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Nappa vs Hulk and Thor

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  • Nappa vs Hulk and Thor

    Nappa takes on the MCU versions of Hulk and Thor (their current selves). Who wins?

    Fight takes place on the world of Pui-Pui.

    Bonus: If they lose they get their ENTIRE team to help but this time the fight takes place on Earth. If Nappa loses he gets to have Vegeta assist him via tactics/morale support and gets 2 Saibamen.

  • #2
    lol

    i guess even raditz. heck even tenshinhan from 22 budokai could solo the entire avangers mcu

    nappa is overkill

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    • #3
      Nappa's physical feats are pretty lacking compared to Thor's starting up the Iris of Nidavellir,



      Keep in mind he at least added a good bit of momentum to Rocket's ship here given he threw it, then stopped it, probably enough to break the ice and start the thing (though I wouldn't say the continued motion and operation from then on was his strength, more like turning the universe's hardest to operate ignition). Hulk's comparable to Thor in their fights so it's probably safe to say Hulk boasts a similar level of strength. If Nappa takes this for a fist fight against either, it's probably over in one strike. If Nappa uses a blast it's still over in one srike, just in his favor, and the saibamen are irrelevant to this, the best Vegeta can do is maybe tell Nappa that they're stronger than him by a wide margin, but I don't see any reason for Vegeta to realize this except maybe an educated guess (it's not like either opponent uses ki).

      Did Thor or Hulk ever end up taking attacks that could flatten a city? Maybe Thor's star feat (in which case he can basically walk through anything). But that's generally really vague as a feat and what that would mean in specific (as opposed to say, taking a dip in the center). Hulk again scales. If the star feat is valid, then they basically can walk through anything Nappa attempts, hell Vegeta can join in and still fail if it's just straight up valid, however I think the feat is a bit too vague as far as things go for that.

      So this basically comes down to if Nappa blasts or tries to punch, if he tries to punch, he dies in one shot, if he uses a blast, they die immediately.

      As such, this probably comes down to what you mean by team. If you mean just the Avengers up to the Ultron movie, then this basically comes down to if Vision can just obliterate Nappa's heart from the inside or something (which would be OOC), or Scarlet Witch doing something weird (but I don't remember her doing anything particularly strange. If by team you mean everyone in Infinity War, then Doctor Strange solos everyone, I doubt any of them (even if Vegeta joins physically) will be work around with his reality bending magic or even just the portals.

      Basically no version of this fight lasts very long, if the star feat is "equivalent to tanking a star" and all that, then it's a stomp for MCU Hulk and Thor. If not, then this again, goes down to what Nappa does, blast means he wins, punch means he breaks his hand trying to punch them, followed by whatever counter they do obliterating him. And yeah, there really isn't any reason to have the two of them, nothing about this match changes by having both, the either die from the same explosion, or just one of them can solo.

      Signature and Avatar by NinjaSushi

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      • #4
        Pointer - Why you believe Thor and Hulk loses to even Tien from the 22nd Tournament? I don't believe they're that weak compared to Nappa if they're working together.

        Tinny - I don't think Thor pulling a heavy apparatus means he'd win in a fisticuffs. If he and Hulk don't attack in unison then I don't see how'd they hurt him. Nappa is capable of dismembering beings who can defeat Raditz, who can survive moon busting attacks.

        There's nothing solo they can do to harm him though, physically or otherwise unless they have some type of ability that works on beings stronger than themselves.

        But I will admit, Doctor Strange I don't have enough knowledge on so explain that portion for me.

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        • #5
          Solid Snake It has more to do with how he threw it, then stopped it, he can probably do the same or something similar with say, a(n) hammer/axe. And I'm not sure how them attacking together would change anything, either they can 1v1 him, or they can't, it's about that simple, as for Raditz, beams are energy beams, not rocks, I'm not sure what that is supposed to prove, you'll notice I didn't mention anything about Thor's lightning given that it would probably, at least broadly fall under the same category as an energy attack and thus accomplish nothing. I consider physical feats different from energy feats, blunt different from piercing, punching different from lifting, etc. If you can't get behind that then there's nothing to talk about. Fundamental disagreement on how to act towards these.

          Also Thor does actually have that if he has Mjolnir, it's not exactly something he can do on his own, but he could trap Nappa under the hammer, then partially bifrost just a bit. Dead Nappa. But again that's not something he has on his own.

          Also regarding Tien.... I'm not sure what's going on there, Tien's feats then were basically nothing (unless you consider him light speed?) that would ensure a victory here. But arguably Piccolo more than destroys them considering he blew up a mountain range with energy attacks. Again this assumes the character fights like artillery with no fisticuffs.


          Doctor Strange can put them in a portal, strand them in another dimension (that's something that doesn't come up until Superbuu at minimum, or even Broly and Gogeta arguably). He's also turn their energy attacks into say... Butterflies, send it to an alternate dimension before trapping them in said alternate dimension, make many different clones of himself, start screwing around with time, utilize portals to trap them in places they probably would rather not be (Loki mentioned he was falling for thirty minutes). Doctor Strange has many different attacks that they have no real answer to, Thanos in the MCU needed most of the infinity gauntlet, they would undoubtedly destroy him in physical combat if they can get a punch here, but they don't have any real means of closing the distance like Thanos did. Which means Doctor Strange can probably solo them, especially given he can simply make clones of himself as well to fight. Power certainly isn't enough since Thanos ends up relying almost exclusively on his reality stone against Strange, only using space and power to drag him in, furthermore Strange isn't boastful or powerful looking like Thor and Hulk, so they don't really have any reason to understand what they're up against until the fight's already in full swing (and Strange is likely keeping his distance, given how he fought against Thanos). This gets even worse if he ends up putting them into his dimension, and from there as effectively unlimited control over the environment. Effectively unlimited mobility, good range, defenses that circumvent their attacks, total battlefield control, and a host of different methods to effectively combat them, or even outright kill them, between simply making them hit themselves with portals, teleporting them into space with no air to breath, severing their limbs with said portals. Even if they are able to avoid the first one hundred attempts, Strange only needs to make one successful attempt, in a relatively safe and secure position, while they have to fight tooth and claw as he sets the tempo of the fight just to get into a position where they can threaten him, let alone destroy him. That last part is particularly important here, especially given Nappa's a blockhead most of the time, even if Vegeto is advising, Strange can hear Vegeta, and against an opponent like Strange, with the moveset of Nappa, the only really good chance one has, is to surprise him and close the distance before he can react.
          Last edited by Tinny; 11-03-2019, 06:12 PM.

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          • #6
            Strange is good but he's a bit slow. He'll need meat shields unless he wants to lose like against the Maw.

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            • #7
              Tinny What is that supposed to even mean? If Thor does uses lightning than it's simply lightning manipulation. And pretty much every type of attack or actions uses some form of energy so I don't see why you're trying to make it like energy isn't essential and make it like it's something different.

              And like before: Frieza cut in half, being blasted by Goku, and low on Ki, survived being blown away in Namek's explosion. Years later, this guy gets offed by a sword by Future Trunks (and by Goku in the future timeline) and that same sword was defended against Goku with a finger.

              Super Saiyan Goku > Super Saiyan Trunks > Mecha Frieza > Frieza > Planet Exploding Force

              Pretty simple stuff.

              Oh another thing in Dragon Ball Super: Broly this I further emphasized in Gogeta vs Broly fight. There were two instances were they broke through dimensions, the first was due to a beam struggle and the second was due to a physical collision. This means or imply that there isn't too much of a difference between a physical and Ki blast and were always intended to be portrayed as the same for the most part.

              Heck in the Battle of Gods movie, Goku as a Super Saiyan 3 punches through North Kaio's planet, which is 10x denser than earth and in the anime, he blasts through the same planet with a Kamehameha Wave in the same form, further implying they're not too different. Ki blasts or Ki in general are just really flexible and versatile in usage most times compared to say a strike or hold.

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              • #8
                Don't be deliberately obtuse, you know exactly what I mean by "energy attack."
                Edit: On the off chance seriously didn't know, here's an example.



                It seems Freeza has a case of the wonder woman if all the sharp stuff slices him while he can survive a pleanwtary explosions, meanwhile Goku blocks the sword with ki as I recall, and if I'm remembering correctly, he doesn't do this with physical blows, it'a only noted for the ki.

                And as for Broly... Good for Broly and Gogeta? Unless one of them people were actually Nappa and I never realized it, I'm not sure how they relate to this. Examples of equivalent force do not apply retroactively to different characters, unless every db character is just a carbon copy of the other. Especially given that Nappa himself never shows off anything similar at any point.

                Gravity does not equal density, and I don't recall any statements about the planet being as dense or as heavy as Earth, just the gravity.

                and Lazer, fair enough, though Strange I'd say needs to be surprised first or get into physical combat himself to get into that situation, something a lot less likely to happen if he can magic with impunity when comparing to Thanos. Nappa won't be able to close the distance by his lonesome. Hell against Maw, it looked like Strange was trying to wrangle him only for Maw to draw close instead and fly him into a wall.
                Last edited by Tinny; 12-03-2019, 02:06 PM.

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                • #9
                  Tinny Goku does block it with Ki but that Ki was concentrated for defensive purposes. The same principle applies on the opposite end of this spectrum, if the Ki is lowered, intentionally or not, the overall defense would lower and be more vulnerable to damage.

                  My point with Broly and Gogeta is that Ki blasts that were highly concentrated and physical collisions were portrayed as being similar in effects and results. So if a casual Ki blast can blow apart a celestial body as huge as the moon, this means that person can at the very least physically attack just as hard as their Ki blasts.

                  Other sources, aka the dubbed version of Super also backs this, when Goku and Beerus fought, it was said that the force that generated the universe level shockwaves weren't happening, as if they're being absorbed by the individuals. They're force of they're physically attack and their Ki blasts are pretty much near similar to one another, further implying that it doesn't matter if the damage to the universe isn't being portrayed, we have a clue as to how much force they're putting out in the fight.

                  Nappa should be capable of this also with this fact considering he has Fae more power than Piccolo (the one who casually destroys the moon) and Raditz (the one that can tank a blast to face from Piccolo).

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                  • #10
                    The whole 10x denser than the Earth definitely needs some sort of confirmation because that can mean at least two things, not just one.

                    Either it means 10x denser than the ENTIRE Earth condensed in to one point
                    Or the rock is just 10x denser than the Earth's rock, which is not much of a feat by comparison.

                    I find the former harder to believe really 'cause like...the grass on that planet would have to be like knife blades to be able to stick up as grass.


                    In any case the MCU's only hope of winning here is bating Nappa in to monologuing and not trying properly and then Thor's highball feats making sense.
                    Otherwise they're too slow, nobody in the MCU has displayed amazing speed or reflexes really. Quicksilver, the guy who's whole thing is speed could barely dodge bullets and ultimately died to them.

                    You don't really need to be light speed to counter MCU characters unless energy beams are off the table I guess.

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                    • #11
                      Actually yeah Steve that's a good point, Raditz just casually caught a shotgun round, and Roshi caught a bunch, meanwhile the speedster dies to bullets, so Nappa just speed blitzes, especially since unlike Goku, he does kill, even if he starts up with torture first. Forgot about that honestly.

                      Solid Snake, dub lines are someone else's adaptation of a work, translated, then changed again for the local area. Using them is no different from taking Backstroke of the West as an accurate representation of Star Wars 3. To put it another way, if I used lines from the vietnamese dub of Infinity War as an argument, you'd rightfully dismiss my argument. The rest falls into the same problem, those people aren't Nappa, and are different from him in just about every way. Show me Nappa's feats.

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                      • #12
                        Steve The planet is obviously much more durable than earth is. Super Saiyan 2 and 3 Goku cutting loose was deforming the planet and literally blew through it in the latter form. Other than the room of spirit and time and special gravity chamber rooms, as well as the Kaioshin realm, it's one of the best spots to train all out.

                        ​​​​​​@Tinny It's just another source of information that fills in the blanks that the Japanese didn't dwell on. Besides, Dragon Ball Super is Toei's property and allowed for it to be dubbed, so in all fairness there's nothing wrong with it cause it actually better explains a scene more clearly. Besides, Toriyama allowed most of Daizenshuus to publish info that isn't their own, just their opinions that he agreed with, for the most part.

                        Don't dismiss the point, it has nothing to do with Gogeta nor Broly or anyone else. My point is that Ki blasts and physical attacks are portrayed as being relative. That's all I'm really trying to get at, so if that's the case shattering a moon wouldn't be to different as decapitating a being superior to that of a moon level fighter. This applies to all fighters.

                        Feats? Nappa was shown to be far superior to that of all the heroes, who are mostly superior to Raditz, who in turn was superior to BoZ Piccolo, who is a casual moon buster. Meaning he can do the same and more.

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                        • #13
                          None of which I count as a source. While we're at it I don't count J.K. Rowling's tweets as part of the story either (not for feats and especially not for story). If they want the info to be included, it should be there in the story itself, not supplementary material, not adaptations.

                          (Besides iirc if that's the case than threw two planet busting attacks from Freeza and Buu only blew up the Earth through chain reaction, which I think either of us believe)

                          It is dismissed because it is irrelevant to Nappa, who effectively has nothing to do with either in this discussion. Look, if you're wondering how to convince me, you'll have to show me why my systems does not work. Showing me different people achieving similar results only shows that those people achieve similar results. It doesn't mean me dividing durability into multiple categories is fundamentally flawed. Meanwhile your idea doesn't seem to even account for the difference between a hammer and a knife (see how you treated Freeza).

                          Snake you know that's not what I meant, I already explained early on how this would go and the difference in strength. I already said Nappa can blast them to oblivion, you were trying to prove something very different.
                          Last edited by Tinny; 13-03-2019, 02:42 AM.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Tinny View Post
                            Nappa's physical feats are pretty lacking compared to Thor's starting up the Iris of Nidavellir,



                            Keep in mind he at least added a good bit of momentum to Rocket's ship here given he threw it, then stopped it, probably enough to break the ice and start the thing (though I wouldn't say the continued motion and operation from then on was his strength, more like turning the universe's hardest to operate ignition). Hulk's comparable to Thor in their fights so it's probably safe to say Hulk boasts a similar level of strength. If Nappa takes this for a fist fight against either, it's probably over in one strike. If Nappa uses a blast it's still over in one srike, just in his favor, and the saibamen are irrelevant to this, the best Vegeta can do is maybe tell Nappa that they're stronger than him by a wide margin, but I don't see any reason for Vegeta to realize this except maybe an educated guess (it's not like either opponent uses ki).

                            Did Thor or Hulk ever end up taking attacks that could flatten a city? Maybe Thor's star feat (in which case he can basically walk through anything). But that's generally really vague as a feat and what that would mean in specific (as opposed to say, taking a dip in the center). Hulk again scales. If the star feat is valid, then they basically can walk through anything Nappa attempts, hell Vegeta can join in and still fail if it's just straight up valid, however I think the feat is a bit too vague as far as things go for that.

                            So this basically comes down to if Nappa blasts or tries to punch, if he tries to punch, he dies in one shot, if he uses a blast, they die immediately.

                            As such, this probably comes down to what you mean by team. If you mean just the Avengers up to the Ultron movie, then this basically comes down to if Vision can just obliterate Nappa's heart from the inside or something (which would be OOC), or Scarlet Witch doing something weird (but I don't remember her doing anything particularly strange. If by team you mean everyone in Infinity War, then Doctor Strange solos everyone, I doubt any of them (even if Vegeta joins physically) will be work around with his reality bending magic or even just the portals.

                            Basically no version of this fight lasts very long, if the star feat is "equivalent to tanking a star" and all that, then it's a stomp for MCU Hulk and Thor. If not, then this again, goes down to what Nappa does, blast means he wins, punch means he breaks his hand trying to punch them, followed by whatever counter they do obliterating him. And yeah, there really isn't any reason to have the two of them, nothing about this match changes by having both, the either die from the same explosion, or just one of them can solo.
                            Aint no way no way can current thor hulk heck even thanos mcu could survive a full power punch from nappa


                            you said he lacks feats what ?

                            did you just forget how dragon ball works

                            piccolo was moon tier and raditz made him shit himself. Nappa could have vaporized that piccolo if he had wanted to. Thors best feat was in infinity war when he withstood that dwarf star light beam.
                            Mind you... that only proves his durability and not his superiority against nappa.

                            mcu characters are 22 budokai tenkaichi levels maybe prelimitary 23 budokai at very max

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                            • #15
                              Tinny If you don't count it as a source is your choice but that doesn't mean I can't use it to better explain a loose point in my case in a scene that isn't elaborated on as well as it should.

                              To be fair, this backs my point. Frieza busted on screen/paper: Planet Vegeta, Namek and Earth.

                              Planet Vegeta was busted by a much weaker first form Frieza via core disintegration with his Supernova, but since he wasn't on the planet, he didn't have to hold back on how fast it was destroyed so he used enough power to make it as fast as possible (ie. less than 5 minutes).

                              Namek was destroyed by a much weaker final form Frieza via core disintegration with a variation of his Death Ball attack named "Destroy The Planet!", but since he was on the planet and wanted on Goku and his friends to die, he withheld on how much energy he put into so he could leave before it finished destroying the planet (ie. within 5 minutes).

                              Earth was destroyed by a more powerful Frieza via core disintegration with a attack named "Earth Breaker" but again wanted to kill Vegeta and his friends (Majin Buu being among them) after losing against him, with Whis basically stating everyone else is dead while Frieza lives on since he can breath in space. The planet is destroyed just as fast as Planet Vegeta in this case.

                              Kid Buu destroyed Earth with the Planet Burst attack, which was powerful enough even Goku stated he couldn't deflect it, even with Super Saiyan 3. Kid Buu didn't give a care in the world if he destroyed Earth but since Vegeta prevented him initially he at least made sure it was amped enough as neither of them could do I again unless they were fussed. When it made contact it very quickly destroyed Earth.

                              So even if it was the core that was destroyed, the amount of Ki it had was enough to make sure a Super Saiyan 2, and possibly even a Super Saiyan 3 couldn't stop it, both whom are at least as strong as Super Perfect Cell who can destroy the solar system. Quality over quantity in this case.

                              You don't seem to get it. Super Buu and Super Saiyan 3 Gotenks can use a Vice Shout and rip a hole through dimensions with their Ki. They both performed a similar feat and we didn't know exactly how strong he was before he and Buu fought, so if he can replace the same feat as Buu we can safely assume he's at bare minimum as strong (which was disproven as he was actually a bit more superior to Buu) and with that said and done, implies he can also create or do similar feats that Super Buu can do. And we later see that Broly and Gogeta can replicate a feat with Ki and physically, meaning they are just as strong and that Ki and physicals aren't as different.

                              This applies to Nappa as well since he is pretty much a moon buster at least and this mean his durability, and striking force are all around pretty even more or less.

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