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According to zamasu; Episode 53 stuff
Topic Started: Aug 4 2016, 08:31 PM (1,572 Views)
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So the ssj2 multiplied Goku's overall Ki by ten ...



Well will this be the next standard for the casual multiplier for ssj2 ?



Odd

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Griffzilla
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Haven't seen the episode yet. Do you have screen grabs?
"I hit the booth and I just went super saiyan!" - Big Sean
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Thiln
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I'm fairly certain the exact terminology stated that SSJ2 Goku was "several dozen" times stronger or something along those lines. Either way, I maintain the belief that a non-suppressed Super Saiyan multiplier being only x10 shouldn't be hailed as some crowning pinnacle of strength when the Oozaru form has the same transformation boost with speed being the only difference. Super Saiyan 2 makes even less since. If it's indeed just 10x stronger than Base then Super Saiyan 1 is logically weaker. Goku might as well use Kaioken x10 in place of Super Saiyan if the increase is greater.
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魔王子

Zamasu said Goku's strength increased several dozen fold. I can see where the speed subs went wrong though. I too heard Juu, which is Japanese for the number 10.
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Even if Zamasu gave an exact multiplier, it shouldn't tell us the exact SSj2 multiplier because that would imply that Goku was already at full power before he transformed.
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That may be what the subs said but I don't think that was the correct translation. I think was actually by several times or something like that, I can't quite remember. In any case by 10 obviously isn't true since x50 is official for Super Saiyan and he went Super Saiyan 2.
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But then why the subs pick the tenfold stuff? I mean they could easily wrote "several times" then, but they wrote 10 times... Either it is an error at the sub part or ...it is that way.



Btw the 50* ssj increase was never confirmed. It was only a guidebook stuff, which is as canon as my power level guide.

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The subs went with tenfold because they were in a hurry. These are speed subs, which are prone to mistakes.

I mean, Super Saiyan was confirmed to be 50 times base in an interview with Toriyama. Even if you were to ignore interviews and guidebooks, basic scaling tells us it'd have to be at least a 40 times increase, initially anyway.
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White Wolf
Aug 5 2016, 09:19 AM
But then why the subs pick the tenfold stuff? I mean they could easily wrote "several times" then, but they wrote 10 times... Either it is an error at the sub part or ...it is that way.



Btw the 50* ssj increase was never confirmed. It was only a guidebook stuff, which is as canon as my power level guide.
Like Prince just said it was confirmed in an interview as well and it has to be around 50. If it was 10 or less that doesn't make sense since Goku wasn't even able to beat Frieza with his Kaioken x20 which increased his power by 20. x40 would put him equal to Frieza and it's obvious that he's not equal to Frieza, he's stronger. So x50 makes the most possible sense.
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Yeah initially. At also said in some interview that he always pictured ssj to be 10 times stronger than base



Which interview shall we take as legit ?

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White Wolf
Aug 5 2016, 02:24 PM
Yeah initially. At also said in some interview that he always pictured ssj to be 10 times stronger than base



Which interview shall we take as legit ?
That's the interview I'm referring to. Toriyama pictured Super Saiyan as 10 times, but acknowledged it as 50 times.
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Only, at the time, it was considered that his strength would increase 50-fold when he became a Super Saiyan, but that was a bit of an exaggeration. My feeling as the creator is that, while drawing it, I felt that it was about a 10-fold change from what it was up to that point.
http://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations/seg-story-volume-truth-about-dragon-ball/
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Does Toriyama not remember his own protagonist's ability to multiply their power in bursts? A x10 multiplier for Super Saiyan would render it virtually pointless since the Kaioken is capable of going up to 20x normal power. Is he implying that Kaioken might have been stronger than SSJ all this time? Moreover, the Oozaru transformation would equal Super Saiyan in terms of raw power. Such a low estimate renders any incentive for using the form by Goku nil.
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Hm yeah this is actually interesting and there's inconsistency on both points of the debate. I may or may not grasp this as well as some do. But I usually go with what sounds the most logical, or what makes the most sense. I'm inclined to state that it only makes more sense that the multiplier wouldn't be X10 for SSJ2. It'd have to be much greater than that as like others have mentioned, to simply be x10 of base form (I think that's what other's stated) just doesn't make any sense. It would not benefit Goku really much or at all to transcend to SSJ2. He'd be better of with kaioken X whatever multiplier than to go to SSJ2 if the increase in power, speed, so forth wouldn't be great enough to be useful to him...

So the SSJ2 would have to be higher than x10. It couldn't be any other multiplier. Not in my opinion.
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