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Base Goku and Vegeta=>Ep 14 Goku; And the two base theory is fanfic at its finest
Topic Started: Jul 26 2016, 03:26 AM (4,504 Views)
Timothy
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Base Goku And Vegeta after Whis training>Peak Goku against Beerus

Goku against Beerus was constantly evolving in power due to the ritual and him being a prodigy and at the end his ki peaked out in base form when he destroyed the sphere of destruction. The strongest ki construct of the fight.

https://plus.google.com/111592428874553488335/posts/DwyTjqs352E


Now this merge and evolution in power was emphasized to be permanent as Goku said "I'm just me",Beerus said he "merged" with the power and Vegeta said he "evolved".


The whole God of Destruction arc is about surpassing Gokus limits.

"I Never knew a world like this existed"
"The super saiyan god power tells me to Keep going higher"
"You intend to Keep going above the power of a god"

"He's surpassed super saiyan god,the level of gods"

"You still haven't reached your limit"
"Look just because you're a god,Beerus sama,doesn't mean you can put limits on people"


It should also be noted that peak Goku as well as rof Goku are using mortal ki in combat and that god ki is only *accessed in god forms* during combat.
https://plus.google.com/111592428874553488335/posts/9LW9K2x11Ei

Spoiler: click to toggle


After the fight ended his gains did not diminish


Rof Base Goku And Vegeta being stronger than Goku against Beerus is not Only supported later by Krillin And Gohan but by Beerus himself
https://plus.google.com/111592428874553488335/posts/GsoFFhbHVXL


Gohan and Krillin state Goku while in base is beyond what he fought Beerus with.

http://i.imgur.com/vdcsNEk.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/OPQvLNA.png
http://i.imgur.com/JHW2cBN.png

And they are referring to Peak Goku against Beerus as they sensed that.

http://i.imgur.com/jdfckkr.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/3UVzwRz.jpg
                   
This is supported By Gohan Krillin and Beerus himself.

https://plus.google.com/111592428874553488335/posts/PsounDeUYoB
Even in Toyotaros Rof manga its portrayed that rof base Goku is on par or beyond himself against Beerus



Base Goku fights Monaka Costume Beerus, and Beerus enjoys the fight in episode 42. This would further support he is on par with himself against Beerus or beyond as Beerus was not finger flicking him away( what happened to ss3 pre god goku) or clawing at his heart(the fate pre zenkai ssg goku suffered)

http://i.imgur.com/39kBIn4.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/pf1yqeo.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/obDHCHt.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/nIY13IJ.jpg
http://imgur.com/B8IX9Y9.jpg
http://imgur.com/mPMyX3G.jpg


https://plus.google.com/111592428874553488335/posts/1jSfdM699R5
Base Copy Vegeta easily dominated ss3 Gotenks, a super boo level enemy, further validation that base goku and Vegeta are ssg tier.

And Vegeta kills Tagoma an ultimate Gohan tier enemy(bare minimum)
https://plus.google.com/111592428874553488335/posts/EfQ1Wa4kwxy
https://plus.google.com/111592428874553488335/posts/UbBZoP1YiiU

With ease.


There is far too much evidence for this to be denied


Now time to address the reason why ppl have been pushing downplaying theories.

Frost
Spoiler: click to toggle


Cabba
Spoiler: click to toggle


Piccolo
Spoiler: click to toggle


Trunks
Spoiler: click to toggle

Maggetta Hit and Botamo are unique special cases as well.


We've seen ridiculous gains in dbz plenty of times

Did it make sense when kid goten and trunks proved to be mssj tier?
Or when Piccolo went from below nappa to over nail in a few days
Or when Krillin and goku surpassed bodb oozaru goku from farming and other meager training tactics
Or when Freeza became ssb+ tier from torturing tagoma for months
Etc.

Peak Goku( against Beerus)tier to dbs is essentially like how planetary is to z. A new impressive benchmark introduced in the beginning that soon becomes a constantly surpassed standard.
New series new scaling. Stop the denial,theories,etc.
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Part of me agrees with this tbh.
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lazerbem
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Explain to me then how base Goku can hold his own against Hit despite Bluper Vegeta getting thrashed. Remember that SSJ, SSJ2, and SSJ3 still exist, so at the very minimum, we're talking a 400x difference, and that's assuming Bluper is equal to SSJ3 when it's likely higher.
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Well, Goku's performance against Hit can be explained by Hit holding back further as not to kill Goku, but yeah, the whole ordeal with Super Saiyan 2 and Super Saiyan 3 certainly makes a case for the "2-base theory". Frankly, I don't know why people are so dead set against the idea. Why don't we all just wait until we're given enough information before we embrace or deny the idea?
Edited by ThePrinceOfSaiyans, Jul 26 2016, 03:10 PM.
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If Goku merged with Super Saiyan God, couldn't he just manifest it through Super Saiyan giving him Blue? Like I see it like this: base, Super Saiyan, Super Saiyan 2, Super Saiyan 3, and to go further he emits God ki in his Super Saiyan form thus Super Saiyan Blue.
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Judau Ashtha
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@If Goku merged with Super Saiyan God, couldn't he just manifest it through Super Saiyan giving him Blue? Like I see it like this: base, Super Saiyan, Super Saiyan 2, Super Saiyan 3, and to go further he emits God ki in his Super Saiyan form thus Super Saiyan Blue.

Huh, So, basically the two-base theory?
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Judau Ashtha
Jul 26 2016, 05:44 PM
@If Goku merged with Super Saiyan God, couldn't he just manifest it through Super Saiyan giving him Blue? Like I see it like this: base, Super Saiyan, Super Saiyan 2, Super Saiyan 3, and to go further he emits God ki in his Super Saiyan form thus Super Saiyan Blue.

Huh, So, basically the two-base theory?
No not the two base Theory. I am saying Super Saiyan Blue has the god ki and ONLY it.
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Judau Ashtha
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@No not the two base Theory. I am saying Super Saiyan Blue has the god ki and ONLY it.

Okay. But then, according to this line,

@..and to go further he emits God ki in his Super Saiyan form thus Super Saiyan Blue

wouldn't this mean that he has the ability to use God ki whenever he wants i.e he can turn it on or off?. Or in your own words has the ability to either "emit it out" or not "emit it out"?
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Timothy
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lazerbem
Jul 26 2016, 03:01 PM
Explain to me then how base Goku can hold his own against Hit despite Bluper Vegeta getting thrashed. Remember that SSJ, SSJ2, and SSJ3 still exist, so at the very minimum, we're talking a 400x difference, and that's assuming Bluper is equal to SSJ3 when it's likely higher.
Hit adjusts his bp to not kill ppl champ. Unless you really think base goku>ssb Vegeta
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Timothy
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ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Jul 26 2016, 03:09 PM
Well, Goku's performance against Hit can be explained by Hit holding back further as not to kill Goku, but yeah, the whole ordeal with Super Saiyan 2 and Super Saiyan 3 certainly makes a case for the "2-base theory". Frankly, I don't know why people are so dead set against the idea. Why don't we all just wait until we're given enough information before we embrace or deny the idea?
I gave far more than enough evidence to destroy that theory completely. In every case base goku showed ssg tier feats he was using regular ki. Whenever god ki os used its in god form and not a second later. Anyway this is all in my two base theory debunk.

That theory is more dead than dinosaurs



@Judai when they emit god ki they seemingly automatically go ssb. Regardless the feats we've seen from mortal form Goku are on regular ki
Edited by Timothy, Jul 26 2016, 10:03 PM.
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Timothy
Jul 26 2016, 10:00 PM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Jul 26 2016, 03:09 PM
Well, Goku's performance against Hit can be explained by Hit holding back further as not to kill Goku, but yeah, the whole ordeal with Super Saiyan 2 and Super Saiyan 3 certainly makes a case for the "2-base theory". Frankly, I don't know why people are so dead set against the idea. Why don't we all just wait until we're given enough information before we embrace or deny the idea?
I gave far more than enough evidence to destroy that theory completely. In every case base goku showed ssg tier feats he was using regular ki. Whenever god ki os used its in god form and not a second later. Anyway this is all in my two base theory debunk.

That theory is more dead than dinosaurs
You really didn't tho. Once gain, I'd hold off on critiquing the idea until we have more information. What'll happen if it's revealed that Piccolo isn't much stronger than his Golden Freeza arc self? You'd pretty much have to fall back on the theory.
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Timothy
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ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Jul 26 2016, 10:04 PM
Timothy
Jul 26 2016, 10:00 PM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Jul 26 2016, 03:09 PM
Well, Goku's performance against Hit can be explained by Hit holding back further as not to kill Goku, but yeah, the whole ordeal with Super Saiyan 2 and Super Saiyan 3 certainly makes a case for the "2-base theory". Frankly, I don't know why people are so dead set against the idea. Why don't we all just wait until we're given enough information before we embrace or deny the idea?
I gave far more than enough evidence to destroy that theory completely. In every case base goku showed ssg tier feats he was using regular ki. Whenever god ki os used its in god form and not a second later. Anyway this is all in my two base theory debunk.

That theory is more dead than dinosaurs
You really didn't tho. Once gain, I'd hold off on critiquing the idea until we have more information. What'll happen if it's revealed that Piccolo isn't much stronger than his Golden Freeza arc self? You'd pretty much have to fall back on the theory.
Hilarious champ. Then that'll mean that his sbc multiplier is op now still broke Champa barrier


Spoiler: click to toggle



That theory is dead and the most unsubstantiated contradicted widespread thing in db.


Now cite one single time one time in dbs where goku makes His base form use god ki to fight someone.... You cant because it never happened.
Never

Almost 40 episodes since Goku evolved and not one single instance is this headcannon "god ki base" present
Edited by Timothy, Jul 27 2016, 02:03 AM.
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A stronger Makankosappo wouldn't explain his performance. I can't cite an example of Goku using God Ki in base because it's pure speculation. I'll concede it's a point of contention, but then, we can't really be sure he isn't using God Ki in base, especially when you consider how ambiguous Super is about everything.
EDIT: Oh, and Goku doesn't necessarily have to have God Ki in his base form for a variation of the 2-base theory to exist.
Edited by ThePrinceOfSaiyans, Jul 27 2016, 02:48 PM.
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Timothy
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ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Jul 27 2016, 12:42 PM
A stronger Makankosappo wouldn't explain his performance. I can't cite an example of Goku using God Ki in base because it's pure speculation. I'll concede it's a point of contention, but then, we can't really be sure he isn't using God Ki in base, especially when you consider how ambiguous Super is about everything.
EDIT: Oh, and Goku doesn't necessarily have to have God Ki in his base form for a variation of the 2-base theory to exist.
Its been confirmed Goku in these instances is using regular ki by sensing statements. Then what's your variation of this theory
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There's a train of thought out there that Goku chooses to use his standard base state and his Saiyan Beyond God state.
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