KidBuu55

Jul 1 2016, 04:23 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jul 1 2016, 04:17 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 1 2016, 04:14 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jul 1 2016, 04:08 PM

Wait, so SSJ3 Goku (@ Fat Boo) was as strong as Ultimate Gohan yet Piccolo still had to ask him whether he was capable of beating Fat Boo if he went all-out?

Uh, didn't I already prove that Goku was using a fraction of his power to fight Fat Buu (judged by Fat Buu's fights with vegeta and Goku, as well as Vegeta's fights with Kid Buu and Goku, and finally Goku and Piccolo's conversation)

There is also the matter of Piccolo's comments of when Gotenks fights Buu (stating at SSJ3, he was the strongest person Buu has fought this far, implying that previously Goku held that benchmark) -if you count the anime, Goku brushes off the comparison between Gotenks and himself-

And yes, at Gohan's arrival, he was assumed to not be enough to beat Buu, which was later retracted when he trashes him

Even if we assume that, Gohan arrived on the battlefield suppressed down to Goku's level? Why, exactly?

Was SSJ Gotenks (Post-RoSaT) weaker than SSJ3 Goku (@Fat Boo) then? I mean, Gotenks was putting up a decent fight against an opponent who was >> Fat Boo, yet Gotenks is still that weak?

Gotenks was never on Fat Buu OR Goku's level. Ever, even Piccolo admits that Gotenks wasn't what he expected.

Once: when asking to test Gotenks power as a SSJ
Again: when Krillin states his feelings towards Fusion and Gotenks power, Piccolo and Dende don't agree with his (Goku's) statement
Again: when Buu shows up at the look out (depending on translation, Piccolo states that Gotenks power hasn't been enough YET
- Piccolo states to Krillin that sensing Buu up close gave him a better feel for his power, and Gotenks is no match.
Finally: in RoSat Piccolo states that he never imagined SSJ Gotenks would do as well as he did fighting Buu.

Literally everything says Gotenks is far weaker than Goku and Buu until he obtains SSJ3, at that point even the anime calls tjem both 'the strongest'

Emmeth

Jul 1 2016, 04:26 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 1 2016, 04:24 PM

Emmeth

Jul 1 2016, 04:19 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 1 2016, 04:18 PM

Emmeth

Jul 1 2016, 04:08 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 1 2016, 04:06 PM

He does. He states that it's Goku, and Goten corrects him thay it's his brother. Piccolo is surprised at how strong Gohan has become.

So yes, it's actually both.

That's not necessarily true. Piccolo can simply think that Goku is the only one who's capable of such a growth in strength, underestimating Gohan and/or not know the circumstances behind Gohan's sudden change.

It's as true as your scenario.

Perhaps, but then Piccolo's reaction implies Goku wasn't strong enough before.

I agree.

The Goku we see is still weaker than Gotenks, and it remains that way until the final arc where is easily outstrips everyone.

So now you subscribe to the Vegetto split theory?

KidBuu55

Jul 1 2016, 04:31 PM

Goku was holding back power, I already proved this in 2 threads. Would you like me to post it again?

Nagito Komaeda

Jul 1 2016, 04:27 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 1 2016, 04:23 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jul 1 2016, 04:17 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 1 2016, 04:14 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jul 1 2016, 04:08 PM

Wait, so SSJ3 Goku (@ Fat Boo) was as strong as Ultimate Gohan yet Piccolo still had to ask him whether he was capable of beating Fat Boo if he went all-out?

Uh, didn't I already prove that Goku was using a fraction of his power to fight Fat Buu (judged by Fat Buu's fights with vegeta and Goku, as well as Vegeta's fights with Kid Buu and Goku, and finally Goku and Piccolo's conversation)

There is also the matter of Piccolo's comments of when Gotenks fights Buu (stating at SSJ3, he was the strongest person Buu has fought this far, implying that previously Goku held that benchmark) -if you count the anime, Goku brushes off the comparison between Gotenks and himself-

And yes, at Gohan's arrival, he was assumed to not be enough to beat Buu, which was later retracted when he trashes him

Even if we assume that, Gohan arrived on the battlefield suppressed down to Goku's level? Why, exactly?

Was SSJ Gotenks (Post-RoSaT) weaker than SSJ3 Goku (@Fat Boo) then? I mean, Gotenks was putting up a decent fight against an opponent who was >> Fat Boo, yet Gotenks is still that weak?

Gotenks was never on Fat Buu OR Goku's level. Ever, even Piccolo admits that Gotenks wasn't what he expected.

Once: when asking to test Gotenks power as a SSJ
Again: when Krillin states his feelings towards Fusion and Gotenks power, Piccolo and Dende don't agree with his (Goku's) statement
Again: when Buu shows up at the look out (depending on translation, Piccolo states that Gotenks power hasn't been enough YET
- Piccolo states to Krillin that sensing Buu up close gave him a better feel for his power, and Gotenks is no match.
Finally: in RoSat Piccolo states that he never imagined SSJ Gotenks would do as well as he did fighting Buu.

Literally everything says Gotenks is far weaker than Goku and Buu until he obtains SSJ3, at that point even the anime calls tjem both 'the strongest'

- He wanted to test Gotenks' movement. His Ki was fine, exactly what Piccolo expected.
- Which Krillin statement was that? Was it the one when they were talking about Base Gotenks? Or the one where they're talking about Evil Boo?
- Yeah, because Evil Boo is much stronger than Fat Boo...
- Yes, he knows for definite that Gotenks has no chance whatsoever. He starts crapping himself as soon as Evil Boo forms, seeing him up close just removes any sliver of doubt.
- So Gotenks exceeded his already high expectations?

Nope. Goku says that SSJ Gotenks (Pre) > SSJ3 Goku and he's never proven wrong.

Purely out of curiosity, you know when Piccolo asks Gotenks to show his movement? Does he ever say that Gotenks' movement isn't good enough?

Emmeth

Jul 1 2016, 04:34 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 1 2016, 04:31 PM

Goku was holding back power, I already proved this in 2 threads. Would you like me to post it again?

Thing is though, you never proved anything, you simply claimed it. We have disputed your points many times, but your persistent attitude blinds you.

Though, I'm not gonna argue that anymore even if I don't agree with you. I can see things from both sides, though I still think there's too much disproving Goku holding back.

KidBuu55

Jul 1 2016, 04:39 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jul 1 2016, 04:27 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 1 2016, 04:23 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jul 1 2016, 04:17 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 1 2016, 04:14 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jul 1 2016, 04:08 PM

Wait, so SSJ3 Goku (@ Fat Boo) was as strong as Ultimate Gohan yet Piccolo still had to ask him whether he was capable of beating Fat Boo if he went all-out?

Uh, didn't I already prove that Goku was using a fraction of his power to fight Fat Buu (judged by Fat Buu's fights with vegeta and Goku, as well as Vegeta's fights with Kid Buu and Goku, and finally Goku and Piccolo's conversation)

There is also the matter of Piccolo's comments of when Gotenks fights Buu (stating at SSJ3, he was the strongest person Buu has fought this far, implying that previously Goku held that benchmark) -if you count the anime, Goku brushes off the comparison between Gotenks and himself-

And yes, at Gohan's arrival, he was assumed to not be enough to beat Buu, which was later retracted when he trashes him

Even if we assume that, Gohan arrived on the battlefield suppressed down to Goku's level? Why, exactly?

Was SSJ Gotenks (Post-RoSaT) weaker than SSJ3 Goku (@Fat Boo) then? I mean, Gotenks was putting up a decent fight against an opponent who was >> Fat Boo, yet Gotenks is still that weak?

Gotenks was never on Fat Buu OR Goku's level. Ever, even Piccolo admits that Gotenks wasn't what he expected.

Once: when asking to test Gotenks power as a SSJ
Again: when Krillin states his feelings towards Fusion and Gotenks power, Piccolo and Dende don't agree with his (Goku's) statement
Again: when Buu shows up at the look out (depending on translation, Piccolo states that Gotenks power hasn't been enough YET
- Piccolo states to Krillin that sensing Buu up close gave him a better feel for his power, and Gotenks is no match.
Finally: in RoSat Piccolo states that he never imagined SSJ Gotenks would do as well as he did fighting Buu.

Literally everything says Gotenks is far weaker than Goku and Buu until he obtains SSJ3, at that point even the anime calls tjem both 'the strongest'

- He wanted to test Gotenks' movement. His Ki was fine, exactly what Piccolo expected.
- Which Krillin statement was that? Was it the one when they were talking about Base Gotenks? Or the one where they're talking about Evil Boo?
- Yeah, because Evil Boo is much stronger than Fat Boo...
- Yes, he knows for definite that Gotenks has no chance whatsoever. He starts crapping himself as soon as Evil Boo forms, seeing him up close just removes any sliver of doubt.
- So Gotenks exceeded his already high expectations?

Nope. Goku says that SSJ Gotenks (Pre) > SSJ3 Goku and he's never proven wrong.

Purely out of curiosity, you know when Piccolo asks Gotenks to show his movement? Does he ever say that Gotenks' movement isn't good enough?

- Speed and Ki size are directly related. But he (nor anyone else) ever state he was enough to take on Buu
- Not Base Gotenks, But possibly Evil Buu, which at this point is not said to be stronger than Fat Buu - just more Evil.
-That's not really what happens. Evil Buu forms and Piccolo staes he's more Evil and better suited for fighting. Krillin (who hasn't sensed Buu's Ki change) comments that "GOKU said" that fusion would be the strongest. This is NOT his own observation, he is repeating what Goku told him. Piccolo and Dende obviously don't agree.

When Buu shows up to the lookout, Piccolo tells Krillin to have the boys go into RoSaT, as they haven't been enough to fight Buu yet. He goes on to state seeing Buu up close gave him a better scope of his power.

Finally, when the Boys fail to beat Buu, Piccolo state he never hope that they would have done as well as they did - he didn't expect them to win, which is why he planned on locking them all in RoSaT.

Finally Goku NEVER says Gotenks will be stronger than him, he tells Piccolo he stated that to Buu, but it isn't what he said (he never says this) nor does he use this as a reason to trust in Fusion.

Nagito Komaeda

Jul 1 2016, 04:44 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 1 2016, 04:39 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jul 1 2016, 04:27 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 1 2016, 04:23 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jul 1 2016, 04:17 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 1 2016, 04:14 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jul 1 2016, 04:08 PM

Wait, so SSJ3 Goku (@ Fat Boo) was as strong as Ultimate Gohan yet Piccolo still had to ask him whether he was capable of beating Fat Boo if he went all-out?

Uh, didn't I already prove that Goku was using a fraction of his power to fight Fat Buu (judged by Fat Buu's fights with vegeta and Goku, as well as Vegeta's fights with Kid Buu and Goku, and finally Goku and Piccolo's conversation)

There is also the matter of Piccolo's comments of when Gotenks fights Buu (stating at SSJ3, he was the strongest person Buu has fought this far, implying that previously Goku held that benchmark) -if you count the anime, Goku brushes off the comparison between Gotenks and himself-

And yes, at Gohan's arrival, he was assumed to not be enough to beat Buu, which was later retracted when he trashes him

Even if we assume that, Gohan arrived on the battlefield suppressed down to Goku's level? Why, exactly?

Was SSJ Gotenks (Post-RoSaT) weaker than SSJ3 Goku (@Fat Boo) then? I mean, Gotenks was putting up a decent fight against an opponent who was >> Fat Boo, yet Gotenks is still that weak?

Gotenks was never on Fat Buu OR Goku's level. Ever, even Piccolo admits that Gotenks wasn't what he expected.

Once: when asking to test Gotenks power as a SSJ
Again: when Krillin states his feelings towards Fusion and Gotenks power, Piccolo and Dende don't agree with his (Goku's) statement
Again: when Buu shows up at the look out (depending on translation, Piccolo states that Gotenks power hasn't been enough YET
- Piccolo states to Krillin that sensing Buu up close gave him a better feel for his power, and Gotenks is no match.
Finally: in RoSat Piccolo states that he never imagined SSJ Gotenks would do as well as he did fighting Buu.

Literally everything says Gotenks is far weaker than Goku and Buu until he obtains SSJ3, at that point even the anime calls tjem both 'the strongest'

- He wanted to test Gotenks' movement. His Ki was fine, exactly what Piccolo expected.
- Which Krillin statement was that? Was it the one when they were talking about Base Gotenks? Or the one where they're talking about Evil Boo?
- Yeah, because Evil Boo is much stronger than Fat Boo...
- Yes, he knows for definite that Gotenks has no chance whatsoever. He starts crapping himself as soon as Evil Boo forms, seeing him up close just removes any sliver of doubt.
- So Gotenks exceeded his already high expectations?

Nope. Goku says that SSJ Gotenks (Pre) > SSJ3 Goku and he's never proven wrong.

Purely out of curiosity, you know when Piccolo asks Gotenks to show his movement? Does he ever say that Gotenks' movement isn't good enough?

- Speed and Ki size are directly related. But he (nor anyone else) ever state he was enough to take on Buu
- Not Base Gotenks, But possibly Evil Buu, which at this point is not said to be stronger than Fat Buu - just more Evil.
-That's not really what happens. Evil Buu forms and Piccolo staes he's more Evil and better suited for fighting. Krillin (who hasn't sensed Buu's Ki change) comments that "GOKU said" that fusion would be the strongest. This is NOT his own observation, he is repeating what Goku told him. Piccolo and Dende obviously don't agree.

When Buu shows up to the lookout, Piccolo tells Krillin to have the boys go into RoSaT, as they haven't been enough to fight Buu yet. He goes on to state seeing Buu up close gave him a better scope of his power.

Finally, when the Boys fail to beat Buu, Piccolo state he never hope that they would have done as well as they did - he didn't expect them to win, which is why he planned on locking them all in RoSaT.

Finally Goku NEVER says Gotenks will be stronger than him, he tells Piccolo he stated that to Buu, but it isn't what he said (he never says this) nor does he use this as a reason to trust in Fusion.

- I know that whenever I'm checking to see whether someone's strong enough to take on an opponent, I lie.

Chapter: 482 (DBZ 288), P7.2-3
Context: after Super Saiyan Gotenks forms for the first time
Piccolo: “…Yeah…Your ki really is absolutely incredible, but how about your movement?...Show me a little.”
Gotenks: “Is that alright? If I show you here, the house might break. I’ll do it on the ground.”


If Ki and speed are correlated, why is he content with his Ki?

- You mean the Boo that could be sensed from Kaioshin's planet (Fat Boo couldn't)?

Chapter: 486 (DBZ 292), P3.1
Goku: “…This is Majin Boo, right? This ki…what is it?...”
Note: mostly I wanted to point out that Goku and co. can sense evil Boo from the Kaioshin Realm.

- Krillin also said that Base Gotenks might be able to win against Fat Boo, right?

- Chapter: 487 (DBZ 293), P13.5
Context: as Piccolo plans on having Goten and Trunks train in the Room of Spirit and Time
Piccolo: “Can’t you tell…?! As they are now, even if they perform Fusion they can’t win, no doubt about it…! Tell them that if they don’t want to die while they’re still just little brats, then they should train as much as they can…!”

He's talking present-tense. Is the anime quote any different?

- So yeah, Gotenks exceeded his expectations, right? Gotenks > Gotenks (Piccolo's expectations).

- Lemme guess, Goku thought Piccolo would panic, lose it and be completely useless if he didn't tell him that? Also, why didn't Piccolo acknowledge that Goku was lying to him if that was the case?

KidBuu55

Jul 1 2016, 04:56 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jul 1 2016, 04:44 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 1 2016, 04:39 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jul 1 2016, 04:27 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 1 2016, 04:23 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jul 1 2016, 04:17 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 1 2016, 04:14 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jul 1 2016, 04:08 PM

Wait, so SSJ3 Goku (@ Fat Boo) was as strong as Ultimate Gohan yet Piccolo still had to ask him whether he was capable of beating Fat Boo if he went all-out?

Uh, didn't I already prove that Goku was using a fraction of his power to fight Fat Buu (judged by Fat Buu's fights with vegeta and Goku, as well as Vegeta's fights with Kid Buu and Goku, and finally Goku and Piccolo's conversation)

There is also the matter of Piccolo's comments of when Gotenks fights Buu (stating at SSJ3, he was the strongest person Buu has fought this far, implying that previously Goku held that benchmark) -if you count the anime, Goku brushes off the comparison between Gotenks and himself-

And yes, at Gohan's arrival, he was assumed to not be enough to beat Buu, which was later retracted when he trashes him

Even if we assume that, Gohan arrived on the battlefield suppressed down to Goku's level? Why, exactly?

Was SSJ Gotenks (Post-RoSaT) weaker than SSJ3 Goku (@Fat Boo) then? I mean, Gotenks was putting up a decent fight against an opponent who was >> Fat Boo, yet Gotenks is still that weak?

Gotenks was never on Fat Buu OR Goku's level. Ever, even Piccolo admits that Gotenks wasn't what he expected.

Once: when asking to test Gotenks power as a SSJ
Again: when Krillin states his feelings towards Fusion and Gotenks power, Piccolo and Dende don't agree with his (Goku's) statement
Again: when Buu shows up at the look out (depending on translation, Piccolo states that Gotenks power hasn't been enough YET
- Piccolo states to Krillin that sensing Buu up close gave him a better feel for his power, and Gotenks is no match.
Finally: in RoSat Piccolo states that he never imagined SSJ Gotenks would do as well as he did fighting Buu.

Literally everything says Gotenks is far weaker than Goku and Buu until he obtains SSJ3, at that point even the anime calls tjem both 'the strongest'

- He wanted to test Gotenks' movement. His Ki was fine, exactly what Piccolo expected.
- Which Krillin statement was that? Was it the one when they were talking about Base Gotenks? Or the one where they're talking about Evil Boo?
- Yeah, because Evil Boo is much stronger than Fat Boo...
- Yes, he knows for definite that Gotenks has no chance whatsoever. He starts crapping himself as soon as Evil Boo forms, seeing him up close just removes any sliver of doubt.
- So Gotenks exceeded his already high expectations?

Nope. Goku says that SSJ Gotenks (Pre) > SSJ3 Goku and he's never proven wrong.

Purely out of curiosity, you know when Piccolo asks Gotenks to show his movement? Does he ever say that Gotenks' movement isn't good enough?

- Speed and Ki size are directly related. But he (nor anyone else) ever state he was enough to take on Buu
- Not Base Gotenks, But possibly Evil Buu, which at this point is not said to be stronger than Fat Buu - just more Evil.
-That's not really what happens. Evil Buu forms and Piccolo staes he's more Evil and better suited for fighting. Krillin (who hasn't sensed Buu's Ki change) comments that "GOKU said" that fusion would be the strongest. This is NOT his own observation, he is repeating what Goku told him. Piccolo and Dende obviously don't agree.

When Buu shows up to the lookout, Piccolo tells Krillin to have the boys go into RoSaT, as they haven't been enough to fight Buu yet. He goes on to state seeing Buu up close gave him a better scope of his power.

Finally, when the Boys fail to beat Buu, Piccolo state he never hope that they would have done as well as they did - he didn't expect them to win, which is why he planned on locking them all in RoSaT.

Finally Goku NEVER says Gotenks will be stronger than him, he tells Piccolo he stated that to Buu, but it isn't what he said (he never says this) nor does he use this as a reason to trust in Fusion.

- I know that whenever I'm checking to see whether someone's strong enough to take on an opponent, I lie.

Chapter: 482 (DBZ 288), P7.2-3
Context: after Super Saiyan Gotenks forms for the first time
Piccolo: “…Yeah…Your ki really is absolutely incredible, but how about your movement?...Show me a little.”
Gotenks: “Is that alright? If I show you here, the house might break. I’ll do it on the ground.”


If Ki and speed are correlated, why is he content with his Ki?

- You mean the Boo that could be sensed from Kaioshin's planet (Fat Boo couldn't)?

Chapter: 486 (DBZ 292), P3.1
Goku: “…This is Majin Boo, right? This ki…what is it?...”
Note: mostly I wanted to point out that Goku and co. can sense evil Boo from the Kaioshin Realm.

- Krillin also said that Base Gotenks might be able to win against Fat Boo, right?

- Chapter: 487 (DBZ 293), P13.5
Context: as Piccolo plans on having Goten and Trunks train in the Room of Spirit and Time
Piccolo: “Can’t you tell…?! As they are now, even if they perform Fusion they can’t win, no doubt about it…! Tell them that if they don’t want to die while they’re still just little brats, then they should train as much as they can…!”

He's talking present-tense. Is the anime quote any different?

- So yeah, Gotenks exceeded his expectations, right? Gotenks > Gotenks (Piccolo's expectations).

- Lemme guess, Goku thought Piccolo would panic, lose it and be completely useless if he didn't tell him that? Also, why didn't Piccolo acknowledge that Goku was lying to him if that was the case?

Hey man, not to be rude buy you are clearly wrong on quite a few points.

1. Piccolo stated that Gotenks Ki was impressive, but that doesn't prove he's stronger than Buu or Goku. Beyond that, Krillin, Roshi and Yamcha were impressed with with base Gotenks power - it's a meaningless throw away statement as in 'yeah, you're strong BUT'

2. GOHAN sensed Fat Buu from the Kaioshin realm, he states that Buu is still alive and he needs to train harder.

3. Goten and Trunks had no idea Buu's power increased, and it seems Piccolo himself didn't know until Buu was on the lookout.

4. Gotenks being semi successful is exceeding his expectations, which was absolute failure.

Emmeth

Jul 1 2016, 04:34 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 1 2016, 04:31 PM

Goku was holding back power, I already proved this in 2 threads. Would you like me to post it again?

Thing is though, you never proved anything, you simply claimed it. We have disputed your points many times, but your persistent attitude blinds you.

Though, I'm not gonna argue that anymore even if I don't agree with you. I can see things from both sides, though I still think there's too much disproving Goku holding back.

sekzee

Jul 1 2016, 05:45 PM

Emmeth

Jul 1 2016, 04:34 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 1 2016, 04:31 PM

Goku was holding back power, I already proved this in 2 threads. Would you like me to post it again?

Thing is though, you never proved anything, you simply claimed it. We have disputed your points many times, but your persistent attitude blinds you.

Though, I'm not gonna argue that anymore even if I don't agree with you. I can see things from both sides, though I still think there's too much disproving Goku holding back.

Kid Buu is undeniably stronger than Fat Buu, and we have statements claiming that SSJ3 Goku initially held back against Kid Buu. I think we can surmise that he held back even more power vs. Fat Buu.

EMIYA

Jul 1 2016, 03:44 PM

I don't understand how this whole "Vegetto Split Theory" is supposed. A theory has to have some kind of backing to it, an amount of evidence to support it. Otherwise I might as well make up up the "Decaying Kaioshin Theory" where Boo couldn't keep on to Southern Kaioshin's power because he rotted away after so many years inside Boo.

Not to mention it simply doesn't make sense, as already noted. If Vegetto splits, the power should be separated into the two components that made them, obvious point is obvious. If one them got more power then by virtue the other half must get less. That's just, basic mathematics, 1+1=2. No matter how you try to dilute that number, your total components should always be 2 here.

Now mind you, Goku in the anime is often put on a much higher pedestal than usual. Once Bootenks unfused, he even remarked that Boo was no longer a threat to him and Gohan IIRC. So him winning against Illusion Gohan at least fits with the previous notion of before in the anime. However this is the exact opposite of Vegeta. Vegeta is somehow fighting relatively well against SSj3 Gotenks and Piccolo.

If anything, it is Vegeta who should have gotten the massive boost of power in the split and Goku should be the one massively inferior than he was before. But no, he's fighting the strongest Boo of all.

Nagito Komaeda

Jul 1 2016, 05:04 PM

1. Why didn't Piccolo call out Goku on his lie then?
2. Do ya have a statement showing that?
3. Goten and Trunks were able to sense Evil Boo before they were shoved into the RoSaT. Piccolo knew that Evil Boo had powered up; why do you think his reaction is so different to the idea of Gotenks going up against Fat Boo. With the latter, he's a little cautious, but he's still okay with it. With the former, he's crapping himself and really doubting Gotenks. What spurred this massive change? Was he really that worried about Boo's body being more suited to battle?
4. So Gotenks was able to be semi-successful against an opponent who's undoubtedly >> Fat Boo and he's still weaker than Fat Boo?

Quote:

 

Chapter: 476 (DBZ 282), P12.3-5
Context: as Gohan trains with the Z Sword
Kaioshin: “…This is absolutely unbelievable…To think that he’d become able to swing the Z Sword around so much in such a short period of time.”
Gohan: “…Father gave it his all and continued training even after going to the afterlife…I’ve got to draw closer to him, even just a li-little bit…Because Ma-Majin Boo is still alive…!”

Emmeth

Jul 1 2016, 06:53 PM

sekzee

Jul 1 2016, 05:45 PM

Emmeth

Jul 1 2016, 04:34 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 1 2016, 04:31 PM

Goku was holding back power, I already proved this in 2 threads. Would you like me to post it again?

Thing is though, you never proved anything, you simply claimed it. We have disputed your points many times, but your persistent attitude blinds you.

Though, I'm not gonna argue that anymore even if I don't agree with you. I can see things from both sides, though I still think there's too much disproving Goku holding back.

Kid Buu is undeniably stronger than Fat Buu, and we have statements claiming that SSJ3 Goku initially held back against Kid Buu. I think we can surmise that he held back even more power vs. Fat Buu.

But how much stronger? Pure Boo could just be toying around with Goku when he was holding back, like he did later. That Goku held back doesn't mean much since he never actually challenged Pure Boo.
We know he held back against Fat Boo but we don't know for sure how much. We also knew he lied when he said he couldn't take out Fat Boo, but it doesn't mean he could take him out with ease. Honestly I don't think there's a huge difference between Fat Boo and Pure Boo. East Kaioshin never notes a huge difference in power when Pure Boo absorbed Chief Kaioshin and became Fat Boo. Did he?

We have statements saying Super Boo wouldn't allow anyone to be stronger than him and he was referring to Gohan. Why would he not just say Goku? Are we still under the impression that Goku still is holding back at this point?
I feel like the whole "holding back" argument is thin at best. Goku was definitely not holding back against Vegeta, that much I can say.