KidBuu55

Jun 27 2016, 07:36 PM

ThePrinceOfSaiyajins

Jun 27 2016, 07:34 PM

KidBuu55

Jun 27 2016, 07:31 PM

ThePrinceOfSaiyajins

Jun 27 2016, 07:30 PM

Not saying they are. Bootenks refers to Evil Boo as the "previous Majin", so the term Majin clearly doesn't refer to a "form".

You are because you keep posting that, and it's literally the 3rd or so time it's been posted in this thread alone.

I'd appreciate it if you actually read my post. If you did, and were unable to comprehend what I said, I have no intention of prolonging this conversation.

I did. But no one stated "Majin" is specific to a form at all.

You and I BOTH know what you were alluding to.

Nagito Komaeda

Jun 27 2016, 07:40 PM

KidBuu55

Jun 27 2016, 07:36 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jun 27 2016, 07:32 PM

You really think Goku's going to be talking about Evil Boo while consciously omitting Bootenks and Boohan? What's the point of making a statement that tells us, essentially, ''You're the strongest form of Boo yet! I'm not counting Bootenks or Boohan, because they're not technically 'forms', per se, but the statement still stands!''

BECAUSE THEY AREN'T A NEW FORM OF BUU. His name is literally Evil Buu (still the Form of Majin Buu Aku) Gohan/Gotenks absorbed.

He's basically using the power of Gohan and Gotenks as a weapon, Goku is CLEARLY speaking of Fat and Evil in context to this conversation. The ONLY reason you don't disagree, is on the grounds you want to discredit the anime's position that Goku and Buu are the strongest.

Don't worry, the Manga doesn't have the specific line, but it does have the others and comes to the same conclusion.

Just Fat and Evil? Why would he only be talking about them? You can say ''Bootenks and Boohan weren't forms!'' all you like, but why would Goku be thinking in those terms?

Also, in regards to Ultra Boo, how does that make any sense? Pure Boo is stronger than Ultra Boo, but Goku's happy that they might be able to manage something against the former? What, does Ultra Boo's build make him really difficult to kill or something?

ThePrinceOfSaiyajins

Jun 27 2016, 07:44 PM

KidBuu55

Jun 27 2016, 07:36 PM

ThePrinceOfSaiyajins

Jun 27 2016, 07:34 PM

KidBuu55

Jun 27 2016, 07:31 PM

ThePrinceOfSaiyajins

Jun 27 2016, 07:30 PM

Not saying they are. Bootenks refers to Evil Boo as the "previous Majin", so the term Majin clearly doesn't refer to a "form".

You are because you keep posting that, and it's literally the 3rd or so time it's been posted in this thread alone.

I'd appreciate it if you actually read my post. If you did, and were unable to comprehend what I said, I have no intention of prolonging this conversation.

I did. But no one stated "Majin" is specific to a form at all.

You and I BOTH know what you were alluding to.

And if Majin isn't alluding to a "form", Bootenks is surely considering every Boo that existed before him, which includes Pure Boo.

KidBuu55

Jun 27 2016, 07:45 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jun 27 2016, 07:40 PM

KidBuu55

Jun 27 2016, 07:36 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jun 27 2016, 07:32 PM

You really think Goku's going to be talking about Evil Boo while consciously omitting Bootenks and Boohan? What's the point of making a statement that tells us, essentially, ''You're the strongest form of Boo yet! I'm not counting Bootenks or Boohan, because they're not technically 'forms', per se, but the statement still stands!''

BECAUSE THEY AREN'T A NEW FORM OF BUU. His name is literally Evil Buu (still the Form of Majin Buu Aku) Gohan/Gotenks absorbed.

He's basically using the power of Gohan and Gotenks as a weapon, Goku is CLEARLY speaking of Fat and Evil in context to this conversation. The ONLY reason you don't disagree, is on the grounds you want to discredit the anime's position that Goku and Buu are the strongest.

Don't worry, the Manga doesn't have the specific line, but it does have the others and comes to the same conclusion.

Just Fat and Evil? Why would he only be talking about them? You can say ''Bootenks and Boohan weren't forms!'' all you like, but why would Goku be thinking in those terms?

Also, in regards to Ultra Boo, how does that make any sense? Pure Boo is stronger than Ultra Boo, but Goku's happy that they might be able to manage something against the former? What, does Ultra Boo's build make him really difficult to kill or something?

Buu was powering up, he stopped powering up and changed into a smaller physical form. This is a scene for scene reenactment of Vegeta vs Perfect Cell.

Goku and Vegeta simply underestimate the threat of Buu because of his small size and they pay for it. Goku's comment of "mange something" is CLEARLY a response to Vegeta's comment about Buu's size, and it doesn't even tell us what Goku means as "mange something" is he still talking about fusion? (The Kaioshin seem to believe it's necessary)


Now I know you'll try to dispute this, but you really can't:

Dende comments that this Buu gives him an uneasy feeling - foreshadowing that something bad will happen.
Kaioshin outright states that Buu is stronger and more dangerous - which is literally contrary to what Goku and Vegeta are shown stating the scene right before.

Nagito Komaeda

Jun 27 2016, 07:48 PM

KidBuu55

Jun 27 2016, 07:45 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jun 27 2016, 07:40 PM

KidBuu55

Jun 27 2016, 07:36 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jun 27 2016, 07:32 PM

You really think Goku's going to be talking about Evil Boo while consciously omitting Bootenks and Boohan? What's the point of making a statement that tells us, essentially, ''You're the strongest form of Boo yet! I'm not counting Bootenks or Boohan, because they're not technically 'forms', per se, but the statement still stands!''

BECAUSE THEY AREN'T A NEW FORM OF BUU. His name is literally Evil Buu (still the Form of Majin Buu Aku) Gohan/Gotenks absorbed.

He's basically using the power of Gohan and Gotenks as a weapon, Goku is CLEARLY speaking of Fat and Evil in context to this conversation. The ONLY reason you don't disagree, is on the grounds you want to discredit the anime's position that Goku and Buu are the strongest.

Don't worry, the Manga doesn't have the specific line, but it does have the others and comes to the same conclusion.

Just Fat and Evil? Why would he only be talking about them? You can say ''Bootenks and Boohan weren't forms!'' all you like, but why would Goku be thinking in those terms?

Also, in regards to Ultra Boo, how does that make any sense? Pure Boo is stronger than Ultra Boo, but Goku's happy that they might be able to manage something against the former? What, does Ultra Boo's build make him really difficult to kill or something?

Buu was powering up, he stopped powering up and changed into a smaller physical form. This is a scene for scene reenactment of Vegeta vs Perfect Cell.

Goku and Vegeta simply underestimate the threat of Buu because of his small size and they pay for it. Goku's comment of "mange something" is CLEARLY a response to Vegeta's comment about Buu's size, and it doesn't even tell us what Goku means as "mange something" is he still talking about fusion? (The Kaioshin seem to believe it's necessary)


Now I know you'll try to dispute this, but you really can't:

Dende comments that this Buu gives him an uneasy feeling - foreshadowing that something bad will happen.
Kaioshin outright states that Buu is stronger and more dangerous - which is literally contrary to what Goku and Vegeta are shown stating the scene right before.

Really? Goku sensed Pure Boo's power and didn't know that it stacked up almost perfectly with his own SSJ3 power?

Yeah, he was talking about Boo's size. Why would Goku, the fighting genius, underestimate Pure Boo due to his size when he can sense his Ki and knows that he's stronger than Ultra Boo?

Dende's bad feeling is decisive evidence, coolio.

So, there's a contradiction there. You side with one, I side with another.

Steve Simmons Translation

 

Episode: 279
Goku: Majin Boo, you are one dense guy, but your power, speed and powers of recovery are all incredible! You're on a whole different level from all the Boos up to now! You're ridiculously strong!

ThePrinceOfSaiyajins

Jun 27 2016, 07:55 PM

But, Goku doesn't specify forms of Boo, he just says Pure Boo is stronger than all other Boos before him:

Steve Simmons Translation

 

Episode: 279
Goku: Majin Boo, you are one dense guy, but your power, speed and powers of recovery are all incredible! You're on a whole different level from all the Boos up to now! You're ridiculously strong!

It'd strike me as odd if Goku didn't include Bootenks and Boohan in that estimate.

KidBuu55

Jun 27 2016, 07:53 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jun 27 2016, 07:48 PM

KidBuu55

Jun 27 2016, 07:45 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jun 27 2016, 07:40 PM

KidBuu55

Jun 27 2016, 07:36 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jun 27 2016, 07:32 PM

You really think Goku's going to be talking about Evil Boo while consciously omitting Bootenks and Boohan? What's the point of making a statement that tells us, essentially, ''You're the strongest form of Boo yet! I'm not counting Bootenks or Boohan, because they're not technically 'forms', per se, but the statement still stands!''

BECAUSE THEY AREN'T A NEW FORM OF BUU. His name is literally Evil Buu (still the Form of Majin Buu Aku) Gohan/Gotenks absorbed.

He's basically using the power of Gohan and Gotenks as a weapon, Goku is CLEARLY speaking of Fat and Evil in context to this conversation. The ONLY reason you don't disagree, is on the grounds you want to discredit the anime's position that Goku and Buu are the strongest.

Don't worry, the Manga doesn't have the specific line, but it does have the others and comes to the same conclusion.

Just Fat and Evil? Why would he only be talking about them? You can say ''Bootenks and Boohan weren't forms!'' all you like, but why would Goku be thinking in those terms?

Also, in regards to Ultra Boo, how does that make any sense? Pure Boo is stronger than Ultra Boo, but Goku's happy that they might be able to manage something against the former? What, does Ultra Boo's build make him really difficult to kill or something?

Buu was powering up, he stopped powering up and changed into a smaller physical form. This is a scene for scene reenactment of Vegeta vs Perfect Cell.

Goku and Vegeta simply underestimate the threat of Buu because of his small size and they pay for it. Goku's comment of "mange something" is CLEARLY a response to Vegeta's comment about Buu's size, and it doesn't even tell us what Goku means as "mange something" is he still talking about fusion? (The Kaioshin seem to believe it's necessary)


Now I know you'll try to dispute this, but you really can't:

Dende comments that this Buu gives him an uneasy feeling - foreshadowing that something bad will happen.
Kaioshin outright states that Buu is stronger and more dangerous - which is literally contrary to what Goku and Vegeta are shown stating the scene right before.

Really? Goku sensed Pure Boo's power and didn't know that it stacked up almost perfectly with his own SSJ3 power?

Yeah, he was talking about Boo's size. Why would Goku, the fighting genius, underestimate Pure Boo due to his size when he can sense his Ki and knows that he's stronger than Ultra Boo?

Dende's bad feeling is decisive evidence, coolio.

So, there's a contradiction there. You side with one, I side with another.

Yes, Goku REALLY sensed Pure Buu's power, much in the same way Vegeta sensed Perfect Cell's power, Gohan sensed Evil Buu - Gotenks absorbed power, and they all underestimated their opponent.
Goku is obviously not infallible, but you somehow want to believe he is (when there are 2 specific scenes PLUS the name of the episode) that make note that he screwed up.

Dende didn't state Buu got stronger, but rather his nature changed, Kaioshin is the one (the very next scene) who makes reference to Buu actually being more dangerous and powerful. This matter isn't up for debate, it's exactly what happens.

Nagito Komaeda

Jun 27 2016, 07:59 PM

KidBuu55

Jun 27 2016, 07:53 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jun 27 2016, 07:48 PM

KidBuu55

Jun 27 2016, 07:45 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jun 27 2016, 07:40 PM

KidBuu55

Jun 27 2016, 07:36 PM

Nagito Komaeda

Jun 27 2016, 07:32 PM

You really think Goku's going to be talking about Evil Boo while consciously omitting Bootenks and Boohan? What's the point of making a statement that tells us, essentially, ''You're the strongest form of Boo yet! I'm not counting Bootenks or Boohan, because they're not technically 'forms', per se, but the statement still stands!''

BECAUSE THEY AREN'T A NEW FORM OF BUU. His name is literally Evil Buu (still the Form of Majin Buu Aku) Gohan/Gotenks absorbed.

He's basically using the power of Gohan and Gotenks as a weapon, Goku is CLEARLY speaking of Fat and Evil in context to this conversation. The ONLY reason you don't disagree, is on the grounds you want to discredit the anime's position that Goku and Buu are the strongest.

Don't worry, the Manga doesn't have the specific line, but it does have the others and comes to the same conclusion.

Just Fat and Evil? Why would he only be talking about them? You can say ''Bootenks and Boohan weren't forms!'' all you like, but why would Goku be thinking in those terms?

Also, in regards to Ultra Boo, how does that make any sense? Pure Boo is stronger than Ultra Boo, but Goku's happy that they might be able to manage something against the former? What, does Ultra Boo's build make him really difficult to kill or something?

Buu was powering up, he stopped powering up and changed into a smaller physical form. This is a scene for scene reenactment of Vegeta vs Perfect Cell.

Goku and Vegeta simply underestimate the threat of Buu because of his small size and they pay for it. Goku's comment of "mange something" is CLEARLY a response to Vegeta's comment about Buu's size, and it doesn't even tell us what Goku means as "mange something" is he still talking about fusion? (The Kaioshin seem to believe it's necessary)


Now I know you'll try to dispute this, but you really can't:

Dende comments that this Buu gives him an uneasy feeling - foreshadowing that something bad will happen.
Kaioshin outright states that Buu is stronger and more dangerous - which is literally contrary to what Goku and Vegeta are shown stating the scene right before.

Really? Goku sensed Pure Boo's power and didn't know that it stacked up almost perfectly with his own SSJ3 power?

Yeah, he was talking about Boo's size. Why would Goku, the fighting genius, underestimate Pure Boo due to his size when he can sense his Ki and knows that he's stronger than Ultra Boo?

Dende's bad feeling is decisive evidence, coolio.

So, there's a contradiction there. You side with one, I side with another.

Yes, Goku REALLY sensed Pure Buu's power, much in the same way Vegeta sensed Perfect Cell's power, Gohan sensed Evil Buu - Gotenks absorbed power, and they all underestimated their opponent.
Goku is obviously not infallible, but you somehow want to believe he is (when there are 2 specific scenes PLUS the name of the episode) that make note that he screwed up.

Dende didn't state Buu got stronger, but rather his nature changed, Kaioshin is the one (the very next scene) who makes reference to Buu actually being more dangerous and powerful. This matter isn't up for debate, it's exactly what happens.

Goku's not stupid enough to underestimate an opponent purely due to their size, though. He can tell that Pure Boo's Ki hasn't decreased at all and, in fact, it should've increased if Pure Boo > Ultra Boo. So, in short, Goku senses that his opponent has gotten stronger but assumes that he's weaker and that his small size means that he's easier to beat?

With Vegeta, Cell was suppressing until he got tired of playing around. #16's scanners tell us that much, iirc.

Yes, it happened, but guess what? It contradicts what we're given in regards to Ultra Boo.

Nagito Komaeda

Jun 27 2016, 08:21 PM

He's wrong, even though we've got an uncontradicted statement telling us that if he was serious right off the bat he could do it?

Nagito Komaeda

Jun 27 2016, 08:21 PM

He's wrong, even though we've got an uncontradicted statement telling us that if he was serious right off the bat he could do it?

Quote:

 

Apparently Goku knew well enough that as small as they were, they wouldn't be able to beat Buu. They reference it many times that they never actually planned on beating Buu from inside his body, combined with the fact that they couldn't just leave and fight him "like this" - Goku (and then Buu) remind the reader that their size is an issue.

Quote:

 

Already addressed this, Goku and Vegeta were not aware they would turn back to normal.

Quote:

 

Goku was willing to fight Evil Buu as well, the issue arose when he had to fight Evil Buu while 1 inside of his body, and 2 while small. They literally point this out.

Beyond that, what does Evil Buu - Gohan/Gotenks absorbed have to do with this conversation? Goku already states IN THE ANIME that Pure Buu isn't as strong as the absorbed Buus and NO ONE in this thread is arguing that is the case. You're clearly constructing a strawman to make your postion seem more reasonable when you already know it's flat out incorrect.

EMIYA

Jun 27 2016, 08:56 PM

Quote:

 

Apparently Goku knew well enough that as small as they were, they wouldn't be able to beat Buu. They reference it many times that they never actually planned on beating Buu from inside his body, combined with the fact that they couldn't just leave and fight him "like this" - Goku (and then Buu) remind the reader that their size is an issue.

But Goku doesn't realize that until Boo tells him. Goku doesn't realize that the size is a huge issue. Until Boo tells him, both Goku and Vegeta were ready to take the boys out and leave. Goku at this point though makes the note of how they'll need fusion to defeat Boo even if they do escape. The issue with size doesn't get brought up until much later and really, at no point is a question how do they resort to the same size brought up.

Quote:

 

Quote:

 

Already addressed this, Goku and Vegeta were not aware they would turn back to normal.

They seem to think they would as it's never brought up. Shouldn't Goku and Vegeta have at some mentioned that they need to make sure they'll need to find a way to get back to their original size and shouldn't that have been done before trying to escape Majin Boo? Goku can't be talking about size when he suggests fusion because he's oblivious to the size fact until told to him by Boo later on.

Quote:

 

Quote:

 

Goku was willing to fight Evil Buu as well, the issue arose when he had to fight Evil Buu while 1 inside of his body, and 2 while small. They literally point this out.

Beyond that, what does Evil Buu - Gohan/Gotenks absorbed have to do with this conversation? Goku already states IN THE ANIME that Pure Buu isn't as strong as the absorbed Buus and NO ONE in this thread is arguing that is the case. You're clearly constructing a strawman to make your postion seem more reasonable when you already know it's flat out incorrect.

Goku didn't have a choice but to fight Super Boo. It was a matter of willingness, it was a matter of lack of choice. It was either fight Boo or die, there was no in between.

Quote:

 

And yes he does state that Kid Boo is stronger than Boohan and the rest, he outright states that Kid Boo is the strongest of all the Boo's faced so far. You're the the one trying to make some random argument that Gotenks Boo and Gohan Boo aren't forms of Boo and that Goku is somehow omitting them. This has already been brought up, why would would Goku be omitting these Boo's?

Instead of having a line saying Kid Boo is on a whole other level from ALL the Boo's faced so far, why not just have the line that says Kid Boo is on a whole other level from two Boo's, the fat and Super faced so far? When you have a statement that says "ALL" you immediately infer all aspects of something. One doesn't just omit random forms of Boo, because Gotenks Boo and Gohan Boo still fit under the line of "All the Boos."

Quote:

 

Goku: Majin Boo, you are one dense guy, but your power, speed and powers of recovery are all incredible! You're on a whole different level from all the Boos up to now! You're ridiculously strong!