Emmeth

Jul 2 2016, 03:38 PM

And once again you haven't given me any proof.

This is pointless.

Quote:

 

Chapter: 517 (DBZ 323), P5.4

Goku: “ If these two hadn’t been here, then we and everyone else would have been done in.

Emmeth

Jul 2 2016, 03:46 PM

What bothers me is that what you provide you call proof. There's no proof in what you've said, at best it's conceivable material. I don't have any proof either, for that matter. The manga clearly has no given proof or statements making that person or the other person stronger, and you know that.

Also, you've made me hate that quote so much because you make it out to be so important and conclusive when it's nothing more than a statement concerning their current options. When Vegeta decided not to bring Gohan and Gotenks, they sealed the deal that lead to that quote. If they brough Gohan and Gotenks, that quote would be completely different.

Quote:

 

Chapter: 508 (DBZ 314), P4.2-7

Elder Kaioshin: “…So he was finally completed…Which is to say…that this current…small Majin Boo…is the initial…mo…most troublesome one…”
Kaioshin: “….Yes…the heart which he gained by going so far as to lower his power through absorption…has returned once again to the way it was…he has no self-control whatsoever…he has become evil itself…”

Quote:

 

Chapter: 510 (DBZ 316), P8.2
Context: as Goku fights pure Boo
Vegeta: “Kakarot…You’re incredible…I am simply no match for that Majin Boo…You’re the only one capable of fighting him…”

Quote:

 

Chapter: 510 (DBZ 316), P8
Vegeta: You are number 1

Quote:

 

Chapter: 517 (DBZ 323), P5.4

Goku: “ If these two hadn’t been here, then we and everyone else would have been done in.

KidBuu55

Jul 2 2016, 04:18 PM

Action: Buu destroys the Earth in a "cruel blast" (quoting the diazenshuu) that cannot be stopped, proving he is MORE EVIL and MORE POWERFUL.
http://web.archive.org/web/20111007094607/http://kanzentai.com/trans.php

Quote:

 

Says Toriyama:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v126/Unrivalled/scan0004zh3.jpg~original

Emmeth

Jul 2 2016, 04:26 PM

It's still not enough to be considered proof. I don't care what you say.

Clearin

Jul 2 2016, 04:48 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 2 2016, 04:18 PM

Action: Buu destroys the Earth in a "cruel blast" (quoting the diazenshuu) that cannot be stopped, proving he is MORE EVIL and MORE POWERFUL.
http://web.archive.org/web/20111007094607/http://kanzentai.com/trans.php

Your link just goes to a general translations page, and not the page that specifically contains the quote. You didn't even say which Daizenshuu it comes from, so how is anybody supposed to fact check it?

Quote:

 

Says Toriyama:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v126/Unrivalled/scan0004zh3.jpg~original

I've already told you, it wasn't Toriyama who said that here, it was the interviewer.

KidBuu55

Jul 2 2016, 06:22 PM

Emmeth

Jul 2 2016, 04:26 PM

It's still not enough to be considered proof. I don't care what you say.

That's the thing. I have proof, it literally says it. You have nothing.
http://dbzf.co.uk/single/?p=9329622&t=8575381

Clearin

Jul 2 2016, 04:48 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 2 2016, 04:18 PM

Action: Buu destroys the Earth in a "cruel blast" (quoting the diazenshuu) that cannot be stopped, proving he is MORE EVIL and MORE POWERFUL.
http://web.archive.org/web/20111007094607/http://kanzentai.com/trans.php

Your link just goes to a general translations page, and not the page that specifically contains the quote. You didn't even say which Daizenshuu it comes from, so how is anybody supposed to fact check it?

Quote:

 

Says Toriyama:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v126/Unrivalled/scan0004zh3.jpg~original

I've already told you, it wasn't Toriyama who said that here, it was the interviewer.

I was being lazy, and I was mistaken:

Dragon Ball Kai Episode 150Air Date: 26 April 2015
地球消滅！！始まりのブウの非道な一撃
Chikyū Shōmetsu!! Hajimari no Bū no Hidōna Ichigeki
Earth Disappears!!
The Original Boo’s Single Cruel Blast

http://www.kanzenshuu.com/episode/kai/majin-buu

And YES, it most definitely DOES say Kid Buu is the strongest, as it's LITERALLY confirmed by Toriyama himself - He agrees and goes into detail as to WHY he drew his characters that way. If the premise of the question was misguided, the answer wouldn't make any sense.

KidBuu55

Jul 2 2016, 06:22 PM

Emmeth

Jul 2 2016, 04:26 PM

It's still not enough to be considered proof. I don't care what you say.

That's the thing. I have proof, it literally says it. You have nothing.
http://dbzf.co.uk/single/?p=9329622&t=8575381

Emmeth

Jul 2 2016, 06:33 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 2 2016, 06:22 PM

Emmeth

Jul 2 2016, 04:26 PM

It's still not enough to be considered proof. I don't care what you say.

That's the thing. I have proof, it literally says it. You have nothing.
http://dbzf.co.uk/single/?p=9329622&t=8575381

And this is exactly what I mean about your attitude. You think you have proof, but you don't. You either have a screwd definition of proof or you simply dgaf.

Clearin

Jul 2 2016, 06:34 PM

Emmeth

Jul 2 2016, 06:33 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 2 2016, 06:22 PM

Emmeth

Jul 2 2016, 04:26 PM

It's still not enough to be considered proof. I don't care what you say.

That's the thing. I have proof, it literally says it. You have nothing.
http://dbzf.co.uk/single/?p=9329622&t=8575381

And this is exactly what I mean about your attitude. You think you have proof, but you don't. You either have a screwd definition of proof or you simply dgaf.

You could at least tell him why his proof isn't proof, and argue against his points rather than just dismissing them.

Of course given how often this topic comes up, I'm sure you've done that many, many times.

Emmeth

Jul 2 2016, 06:47 PM

Clearin

Jul 2 2016, 06:34 PM

Emmeth

Jul 2 2016, 06:33 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 2 2016, 06:22 PM

Emmeth

Jul 2 2016, 04:26 PM

It's still not enough to be considered proof. I don't care what you say.

That's the thing. I have proof, it literally says it. You have nothing.
http://dbzf.co.uk/single/?p=9329622&t=8575381

And this is exactly what I mean about your attitude. You think you have proof, but you don't. You either have a screwd definition of proof or you simply dgaf.

You could at least tell him why his proof isn't proof, and argue against his points rather than just dismissing them.

Of course given how often this topic comes up, I'm sure you've done that many, many times.

Let me ask you something then, Clearin. Do you think anything said in the Boo arc is conclusive? Do you think that Super Boo > Pure Boo or Pure Boo > Super Boo has enough evidence for someone to state it's proof?

Clearin

Jul 2 2016, 06:55 PM

Emmeth

Jul 2 2016, 06:47 PM

Clearin

Jul 2 2016, 06:34 PM

Emmeth

Jul 2 2016, 06:33 PM

KidBuu55

Jul 2 2016, 06:22 PM

Emmeth

Jul 2 2016, 04:26 PM

It's still not enough to be considered proof. I don't care what you say.

That's the thing. I have proof, it literally says it. You have nothing.
http://dbzf.co.uk/single/?p=9329622&t=8575381

And this is exactly what I mean about your attitude. You think you have proof, but you don't. You either have a screwd definition of proof or you simply dgaf.

You could at least tell him why his proof isn't proof, and argue against his points rather than just dismissing them.

Of course given how often this topic comes up, I'm sure you've done that many, many times.

Let me ask you something then, Clearin. Do you think anything said in the Boo arc is conclusive? Do you think that Super Boo > Pure Boo or Pure Boo > Super Boo has enough evidence for someone to state it's proof?

I think there are certain statements that could be interpreted as Kid Boo being stronger, and WOULD be interpreted that way if not for the fact there's a far more overwhelming amount of evidence that points the other way, and evidence that is much harder to explain any other way.

Vegeta calling Goku #1, saying he's the only one who could fight Boo and saying everyone would have been doomed if not for Goku winning with the spirit bomb. That's all stuff that would be used as evidence if the debate was less one sided. But those small lines contradict a much larger amount of stuff, so we simply fit them into the story in a way that doesn't contradict earlier stuff: Goku is the #1 fighter, not necessarily the strongest (Goku is a better fighter than Gohan regardless of strength). Goku is the only one who can fight Boo cos Gohan and Gotenks are dead. "Everyone" would be dead if Mr Satan and Boo hadn't been there because...well...actually I don't know. Because Boo could just blow up Earth without having to fight Gohan? Because the wish to revive the Earthlings and Earth would have never happened if Fat Boo hadn't stalled Kid Boo and let Vegeta make the wish in the first place? There's lot of explanations.

But on the other side of the coin how do you explain away Goku saying Gotenks is stronger than himself, and then later that base Gotenks is stronger than SSj Gotenks from before? And then all the stuff later with Goku being too scared to fight Super Boo? All that stuff makes a pretty solid conclusion to the debate. But despite it being conclusive (at least to me), I still feel it's important to address any statements that could go otherwise. But like I said, that kinda thing has already been done, both in this topic, and hundreds of others like it in the past.

As for guidebooks and stuff, I don't use them as canon, so if a guidebook says Kid Boo is stronger, the people who follow them will have to deal with that.

Edit; That's for the manga though. The anime makes a much stronger case, and outright states, Kid Boo being stronger, despite it being contradicting.