Welcome Guest [Log In] [Register]
Rotation Advertisements



We hope you enjoy your visit to this forum.


If you are reading this then it means you are currently browsing the forum as a guest, we don’t limit any of the content posted from guests however if you join, you will have the ability to join the discussions! We are always happy to see new faces at this forum and we would like to hear your opinion, so why not register now? It doesn’t take long and you can get posting right away.


Click here to Register!

If you are having difficulties validating your account please email us at admin@dbzf.co.uk


If you're already a member please log in to your account:

Username:   Password:
Add Reply
  • Pages:
  • 1
  • 2
Warner Bros. is worried about ‘Batman v Superman
Topic Started: Feb 25 2016, 12:51 AM (1,439 Views)
Darker
Member Avatar
The Lord of the Dark

Steve
Feb 26 2016, 01:29 AM
Off the point but we need a movie where a revered hero does turn bad for whatever reason, that'd be f***ing cool.
It's always just someone they know becoming a villain or a hero being mind controlled in to doing bad stuff, not just because they got tired of saving pathetic weaklings or whatever.
Pretty sure that kind of story has already been done, where a villain turns good just because he's tired or a superhero becomes dick simply because he's tired of saving people. Mind control? It has never been a thing in those situations.

And why would it be cool? It'd be confusing as hell. There's no way you can make a character to seem that much of an a*****. Because even the worst writer realizes a story that surrounds that character wouldn't be the least good.
Posted Image

Piccolo: Just how many people have you sacrificed?!

Cell: Sacrifice? Hmph, rubbish! On the contrary, it is an honor to become a fraction of my power.
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Tinny
Member Avatar


Mertroman didn't hurt anyone though, he just kind of retired and went into music. Also the movie is called Megamind, and it's quite a long time before the villain goes good actually.

I think it would be an interesting take on it, though yes, the movie couldn't focus solely on him, we'd need a character to root for as well.
Posted Image
Above signature created by Graffiti

Posted Image
Member Online View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
+ Steve
Member Avatar
Greetings. I will be your waifu this season.

I mean a story set in a universe where there are at least two heroes, one has been a superhero for like 30 years and starts going bad and the other has to take them down.

I don't recall seeing that in a movie, it'd make for some good character moments I reckon. Like the good guy wondering if he'll go bad and such.


Also this BvS story doesn't work with Superman only if you're thinking of him as the usual good guy, he's not, he's not become that guy yet.
We've not seen how this Superman's past shapes him in to the man he becomes.
I think it'd be boring if they done the same crap as usual, him automatically being a paragon of justice.

Can you imagine some dickbag throwing a beer in your face? And having to hold back when you could literally punch him in to space, being an outcast your whole life, afraid of who you are?

It'd be damn weird if this Clark was nice for no reason, people are a***** which raises the questions "Why should he protect them?" "Is he even one of them?" Obviously he'll find his reasons.
That to me is much more interesting than characters who are good, just because.
Posted Image


Definitely not a succubus, fear not
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Tinny
Member Avatar


Steve
Feb 26 2016, 02:06 AM
I mean a story set in a universe where there are at least two heroes, one has been a superhero for like 30 years and starts going bad and the other has to take them down.

I don't recall seeing that in a movie, it'd make for some good character moments I reckon. Like the good guy wondering if he'll go bad and such.


Also this BvS story doesn't work with Superman only if you're thinking of him as the usual good guy, he's not, he's not become that guy yet.
We've not seen how this Superman's past shapes him in to the man he becomes.
I think it'd be boring if they done the same crap as usual, him automatically being a paragon of justice.

Can you imagine some dickbag throwing a beer in your face? And having to hold back when you could literally punch him in to space, being an outcast your whole life, afraid of who you are?

It'd be damn weird if this Clark was nice for no reason, people are a***** which raises the questions "Why should he protect them?" "Is he even one of them?" Obviously he'll find his reasons.
That to me is much more interesting than characters who are good, just because.
I'm pretty sure that's also the plot of irredeemable, it's not a movie, but still.

Except he had, the moment he killed Zod. the pain and anguish of having to murder another person, that's when he became the Superman who hated to kill. I mean aside from property damage he's pretty much shown as the good guy, and through out the movie he is in no way hostile to the people. He's in no way dark and edgy, aside from again, causing property damage. We have clearly seen his past shape him into this man. And automatically? Half the reason he did was the pain he went through due to having to kill Zod.

MoS did a bit of that though? The property damage included the truck, but this man still held up an oil rig for people to stop, he still refused to hurt the kids bullying him, and for allot of the film there are clear Messiah undertones. They already dealt with that in MoS, and in response he defends humanity against Zod and the kryptonians.

Maybe you want a different superhero? I think the X-men in general are far more prone to that kind of idea to the whole mutant thing going on, and Magneto offering a clear alternative. Heck in the recent comics didn't Cyclops become the leader of the Brotherhood of Evil? Superman meanwhile through the entire movie is built up as a messiah, as a Christ like figure. His problem isn't "Why should I protect these people who hate me," it's "Are they right to fear me? Am I doing the right thing?" Like I said, there are heroes that are better for this sort of story where they're not sure if they want to protect the people, like Thor with Asgard, Hulk with his persecution, X-men with the systemic racism, etc.
You mean the trauma of having to kill another person isn't enough reason to not want to leave people to die? Especially the way you phrase it's like you want Superman to get ready to kill people.

Also thought of another story where the good guy turns bad and this one is actually with Superman. It's called Injustice, and those comics are pretty darn good.
Posted Image
Above signature created by Graffiti

Posted Image
Member Online View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Darker
Member Avatar
The Lord of the Dark

Tin Man
Feb 26 2016, 01:55 AM
Mertroman didn't hurt anyone though, he just kind of retired and went into music. Also the movie is called Megamind, and it's quite a long time before the villain goes good actually.

I think it would be an interesting take on it, though yes, the movie couldn't focus solely on him, we'd need a character to root for as well.


I wasn't talking about Megamind.

Steve
Feb 26 2016, 02:06 AM
Also this BvS story doesn't work with Superman only if you're thinking of him as the usual good guy, he's not, he's not become that guy yet.
We've not seen how this Superman's past shapes him in to the man he becomes.
I think it'd be boring if they done the same crap as usual, him automatically being a paragon of justice.

Can you imagine some dickbag throwing a beer in your face? And having to hold back when you could literally punch him in to space, being an outcast your whole life, afraid of who you are?

It'd be damn weird if this Clark was nice for no reason, people are a***** which raises the questions "Why should he protect them?" "Is he even one of them?" Obviously he'll find his reasons.
That to me is much more interesting than characters who are good, just because.


WOOOW. Do you even know who Supes is? I mean seriously it seems like you don't understand anything about him. Superman protects Earth because Earth saved and raised him. With all the power that he has, he uses it properly to solve every problem in this planet in order to make it a better place. This young movie incarnation of Superman just needs to learn that. You think Superman hasn't thought of not being a superhero before? He has. And you know what he was ashamed of thinking like that? Because he's in no position of acting like a douchebag to some people.

He's supposed to keep his cool, always, at any moment. Superman's ment to be calm all the time. He's got nothing to worry about, but he's got everything in the world to protect.

That is interesting to you? Being a dickbag is just a typical human thing to do. Superman's beyond that, even now in his young self.
For starters, because he's a f***ing ALIEN.
Posted Image

Piccolo: Just how many people have you sacrificed?!

Cell: Sacrifice? Hmph, rubbish! On the contrary, it is an honor to become a fraction of my power.
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
lazerbem
Member Avatar


I'd agree Sentry is far better at the dark side thing than Superman is. In fact, it could be done very well and creatively, considering all of his psychological issues. If you want a deep story, the Sentry has a lot of potential for it.
Posted Image
Crazy cat cults in the woods
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
+ Steve
Member Avatar
Greetings. I will be your waifu this season.

Quote:
 
WOOOW. Do you even know who Supes is? I mean seriously it seems like you don't understand anything about him.


Have you...watched MoS? He's quite a bit different.
Why are you assuming every take on Superman is exactly the same? As I've said multiple times he's not even Superman yet anyway, Superman is a hero, Clark at the end of MoS is in between.

Quote:
 
He's supposed to keep his cool, always, at any moment. Superman's ment to be calm all the time. He's got nothing to worry about


That's why he wraps the truck guy who throws beer in his face around a telegraph pole right?

Quote:
 
That is interesting to you? Being a dickbag is just a typical human thing to do. Superman's beyond that, even now in his young self.
For starters, because he's a f***ing ALIEN.


Which fits what I was getting at...

He's practically a God to them, why should he care? He contemplated being a hero before but he'd never actually done it, he obviously felt it was his responsibility to take on Zod and co since they're only there because of him.


Quote:
 
Except he had, the moment he killed Zod. the pain and anguish of having to murder another person, that's when he became the Superman who hated to kill. I mean aside from property damage he's pretty much shown as the good guy, and through out the movie he is in no way hostile to the people. He's in no way dark and edgy, aside from again, causing property damage. We have clearly seen his past shape him into this man. And automatically? Half the reason he did was the pain he went through due to having to kill Zod.


Which could be equated to the pain of killing so far as he knows the only other member of his species left.
Like The Doctor, no matter how much he and The Master were at odds they were the last two Timelords and The Doctor felt unbearable sorrow when The Master died, to be the last alive would be heartbreaking.

It's not at all been established he was upset over generally killing someone, that's just one way you can interpret it.

Also in the trailers it seems like there's a split between people who are afraid of Superman and those who are not.

Quote:
 
His problem isn't "Why should I protect these people who hate me," it's "Are they right to fear me? Am I doing the right thing?" Like I said, there are heroes that are better for this sort of story where they're not sure if they want to protect the people


Does it really matter what hero it is? Shouldn't the story involving that hero be what makes it good?
And I think all those questions apply to this Superman really in one trailer Martha says "You don't owe these people anything"


It's pointless to judge this Superman by the standard versions of him, every version has slight differences and this is very different and also a very early one, like I said, he isn't even Superman yet he's a powerful alien in a suit not a revered hero.
He'll most likely become one in BvS.


I think it's great having people question him, I liked that in Spiderman also. Not everyone loved him immediately people thought he could be a crook.

The idea that the general public would just be glad there's super powered aliens tossing buildings around is silly if you ask me, unless it was abundantly clear they were there to help.
After MoS people are clearly like "Okay well he saved us but...look how much destruction his people caused, is that going to happen again?"

Not "Yay! Superman! Woosh!"
Posted Image


Definitely not a succubus, fear not
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Dbzk1999
Default Avatar


"deep story"
Sorry, couldn't help but chuckle a bit at this part. Anyways, don't see what they're worried about. It's a film with two of the most iconic comic book film characters, as much as I don't like MoS, that's a golden ticket
Posted Image


Until the Battle is Won

USMA 2021
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
+ QueenTD
Member Avatar
My Dear Melancholy,

Steve
Feb 26 2016, 01:29 AM
QueenTD
Feb 25 2016, 03:40 AM
@Steve

Well it's DC's 3rd movie. People forget that the DC movie universe was rebooted. Green Lantern was the first and it was supposed to introduce Flash but.....y'all know the rest.
I'm pretty sure they just don't care about that movie, I don't think it's even technically part of the universe is it? Same as how the Nolan Batman trilogy isn't despite being DC.
Reread. Originally Green Latern was supposed to start the movie universe but....s*** happen.
Posted Image
Spoiler: click to toggle
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Tinny
Member Avatar


Steve
Feb 26 2016, 03:07 AM
Quote:
 
WOOOW. Do you even know who Supes is? I mean seriously it seems like you don't understand anything about him.


Have you...watched MoS? He's quite a bit different.
Why are you assuming every take on Superman is exactly the same? As I've said multiple times he's not even Superman yet anyway, Superman is a hero, Clark at the end of MoS is in between.

Quote:
 
He's supposed to keep his cool, always, at any moment. Superman's ment to be calm all the time. He's got nothing to worry about


That's why he wraps the truck guy who throws beer in his face around a telegraph pole right?

Quote:
 
That is interesting to you? Being a dickbag is just a typical human thing to do. Superman's beyond that, even now in his young self.
For starters, because he's a f***ing ALIEN.


Which fits what I was getting at...

He's practically a God to them, why should he care? He contemplated being a hero before but he'd never actually done it, he obviously felt it was his responsibility to take on Zod and co since they're only there because of him.


Quote:
 
Except he had, the moment he killed Zod. the pain and anguish of having to murder another person, that's when he became the Superman who hated to kill. I mean aside from property damage he's pretty much shown as the good guy, and through out the movie he is in no way hostile to the people. He's in no way dark and edgy, aside from again, causing property damage. We have clearly seen his past shape him into this man. And automatically? Half the reason he did was the pain he went through due to having to kill Zod.


Which could be equated to the pain of killing so far as he knows the only other member of his species left.
Like The Doctor, no matter how much he and The Master were at odds they were the last two Timelords and The Doctor felt unbearable sorrow when The Master died, to be the last alive would be heartbreaking.

It's not at all been established he was upset over generally killing someone, that's just one way you can interpret it.

Also in the trailers it seems like there's a split between people who are afraid of Superman and those who are not.

Quote:
 
His problem isn't "Why should I protect these people who hate me," it's "Are they right to fear me? Am I doing the right thing?" Like I said, there are heroes that are better for this sort of story where they're not sure if they want to protect the people


Does it really matter what hero it is? Shouldn't the story involving that hero be what makes it good?
And I think all those questions apply to this Superman really in one trailer Martha says "You don't owe these people anything"


It's pointless to judge this Superman by the standard versions of him, every version has slight differences and this is very different and also a very early one, like I said, he isn't even Superman yet he's a powerful alien in a suit not a revered hero.
He'll most likely become one in BvS.


I think it's great having people question him, I liked that in Spiderman also. Not everyone loved him immediately people thought he could be a crook.

The idea that the general public would just be glad there's super powered aliens tossing buildings around is silly if you ask me, unless it was abundantly clear they were there to help.
After MoS people are clearly like "Okay well he saved us but...look how much destruction his people caused, is that going to happen again?"

Not "Yay! Superman! Woosh!"
Okay? What do you think happened? That Superman was sad because he had to kill an noble Kryptonian? to save worthless humans? Is that why he had to hug Lois Lane for comfort? Wouldn't he easily associate that with the pain of failing to save people? Yes, I am interested in that honestly.

You seem to have ignored the part where I pointed out that MoS is positively flooded with the Christ metaphor. You know, the objectively superior person that nonetheless died for us.

Yes. Well let me put it like this, let's say we made Citizen Kane with the Hulk. Would that fit his character? Would that be a good Hulk Story? or are you saying character personalities and individual drives and irrelevant and should be discarded, stretched, and changed to fit whatever story you want them in? No offence but I'm pretty sure that thinking is what led to Hitler Ironman and Spiderman's One More Day. AKA the comic that led to Spiderman fans leaving en masse. So yes, which hero you use and how you build it up is important. They have built MoS Superman as an extremely heroic character that the people fear due to the massive destruction his fights cause. They have not built him as someone who has to wrestle with his inner daemons, who can get tipped to the breaking point. There are heroes who are good for that kind of story, Sentry, Hulk, And the X-men for example. Even Spiderman is better for the story where the hero gets tempted to stop being a hero for selfish reasons. Superman is once again, not one of those characters, and is one of the least suited individuals for it.

You're right, let's use the movie he was in that all but directly compared him to Jesus Christ instead. Except that portrays him even more as a noble soul than the DCAU did. And Superman made some very questionable decisions in the DCAU especially concerning Doomsday and Captain Marvel.

Did I say that's the problem? The people fearing him is perfectly fine. The part I object to is the part where he is ready to leave these people out of spite and hatred, the part where he's ready to do what Zod wanted to do.

Once again, you put words into my mouth that were never there. This by all means a story that can be told, of a public frightened of him. If he stops being their hero and messiah, it's not to spite them, it's because he looks what he's doing, he looks at the people who fear him so much, and decides he's doing more harm than good. The question is "Am I doing the right thing?" Not "Maaaannn these people are a***** I'm leaving!"

Once again, you are completely mischaracterizing my argument.
Edited by Tinny, Feb 26 2016, 05:01 AM.
Posted Image
Above signature created by Graffiti

Posted Image
Member Online View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Darker
Member Avatar
The Lord of the Dark

lazerbem
Feb 26 2016, 02:42 AM
I'd agree Sentry is far better at the dark side thing than Superman is. In fact, it could be done very well and creatively, considering all of his psychological issues. If you want a deep story, the Sentry has a lot of potential for it.
I guess? He's nowhere near as interesting, and I doubt Marvel has plans to bring him in the MCU. If they do, who knows what aspect of him they'll take because his personality is very unstable.
Posted Image

Piccolo: Just how many people have you sacrificed?!

Cell: Sacrifice? Hmph, rubbish! On the contrary, it is an honor to become a fraction of my power.
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Copy_Ninja
Member Avatar
Novacane for the pain

It'll do well, no doubt, but how well? Because they've got to the first team up so quickly, they are actually banking a fair bit on this movie. Whereas Marvel could have a couple of the solo movies not do so well because The Avengers team up would be the centre piece, DC kind of needs this to be a big hit considering Wonder Woman is already filmed and principal photography begin on Justice League in the next month. Their biggest worry is if early audiences don't take to it as well as they like, poor word of mouth could be a bit damaging. Not enough to drag it down and stop it from being a success, but less of a success than it could be. A couple of factors that could go in to it:

- Run time of over two and a half hours. Movies are longer these days but if the pacing isn't right audiences will feel that run time. Take any of the Hobbit movies for an example.
- The non Batman and Superman parts of the story. So how well they execute Wonder Woman, Lex, Doomsday and whatever else goes in to it. The two mains are going to do well regardless, but how the rest does is important for their wider universe.
- Civil War. This must worry them a tad I'd think, with a similar movie coming out very close to theirs. The MCU versions of Cap and Iron Man have a connection with audiences now, it's going to be easier to draw people in to their personal conflict. I think Marvel has marketed Civil War better too but that's a minor point. If audiences don't take to BvS but love Civil War then it's not ideal.

Regardless it'll do well by itself, it's their future movies they probably worry about more. Though Suicide Squad is up next and looks very promising so it'll probably be fine.
Posted ImageWe'll never be those kids again
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
+ Steve
Member Avatar
Greetings. I will be your waifu this season.

Quote:
 
Okay? What do you think happened? That Superman was sad because he had to kill an noble Kryptonian? to save worthless humans? Is that why he had to hug Lois Lane for comfort? Wouldn't he easily associate that with the pain of failing to save people? Yes, I am interested in that honestly.


Why can't he care about both in different ways?

If humans choose to alienate him, which they seem to be doing then he's faced with a dilemma, be their protector or their ruler. (or straight up leave)
People will bow down to his strength but...should they?
Not an easy question to answer really, Clark could end war in a day if he got involved but he has to consider many options and all those are personal, does he have any right to delve in to human conflict? Or is it his responsibility to protect us from ourselves?

Quote:
 
You seem to have ignored the part where I pointed out that MoS is positively flooded with the Christ metaphor. You know, the objectively superior person that nonetheless died for us.


But that's how it's shot, at no point has he himself acted as though he'd definitely choose to protect the whole world for a living. There's a difference between how he thinks and how the movie displays things.

In the trailers "False God" is written on a statue of him so it's hardly as clear cut as "he beat the bad Kryptonians so everyone loves him" public opinion isn't that simple.
We all know he'll become the Godly protector but he's not yet.


Quote:
 


Yes. Well let me put it like this, let's say we made Citizen Kane with the Hulk. Would that fit his character? Would that be a good Hulk Story? or are you saying character personalities and individual drives and irrelevant and should be discarded, stretched, and changed to fit whatever story you want them in? No offence but I'm pretty sure that thinking is what led to Hitler Ironman and Spiderman's One More Day. AKA the comic that led to Spiderman fans leaving en masse. So yes, which hero you use and how you build it up is important. They have built MoS Superman as an extremely heroic character that the people fear due to the massive destruction his fights cause. They have not built him as someone who has to wrestle with his inner daemons, who can get tipped to the breaking point. There are heroes who are good for that kind of story, Sentry, Hulk, And the X-men for example. Even Spiderman is better for the story where the hero gets tempted to stop being a hero for selfish reasons. Superman is once again, not one of those characters, and is one of the least suited individuals for it.


Again since when do all depictions of a character go exactly the same way?

Why does it have to go for the bog standard Superman story? Even though it's a far more gritty and "realistic" take on the universe. They're delving in to specifics instead of just "Superman is justice, the end"

Some Christ like imagery is just showing where it will head eventually. Did you not pick up on how lost Clark was? He was working on a fishing boat for crying out loud, he's never decided what to do with his power and Jonathan told him not to just show everyone until it was time.
It wasn't like Spiderman where Peter was given good reason to be a good person and protect people.

Also he doesn't wrestle with his inner demons? Which is again why he wraps that guys truck around a telegraph pole out of anger?
Standard Superman wouldn't do that to someone who was just being a dick to him, he knows he should be better than that. This Superman isn't at that point as of MoS.

Quote:
 
Once again, you put words into my mouth that were never there. This by all means a story that can be told, of a public frightened of him. If he stops being their hero and messiah, it's not to spite them, it's because he looks what he's doing, he looks at the people who fear him so much, and decides he's doing more harm than good. The question is "Am I doing the right thing?" Not "Maaaannn these people are a***** I'm leaving!"

Once again, you are completely mischaracterizing my argument.


Not what I was saying at all, the whole thing I'm getting at involves all of that.
That it's not so clear cut as "Superman is an uber good guy everyone loves"

He's faced with moral choices which is far more interesting than instantly being the regular boy scout, like in Superman Returns where he's already "Superman", the worlds protector(although people were understandably pissed he buggered off for 5 years)

This story is filling in the gaps of how he becomes one of if not the most idolized characters in fiction.

People don't seem to be getting that, wondering why Superman killed Zod and why he couldn't save absolutely everyone in Metropolis, calling it s***ty because they think he should be like Superman as an already established hero when as I think I said earlier he literally flies and puts the suit on for the first time in the movie, who does the job perfectly on the first day...
Posted Image


Definitely not a succubus, fear not
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Tinny
Member Avatar


Steve
Feb 26 2016, 06:06 PM
Quote:
 
Okay? What do you think happened? That Superman was sad because he had to kill an noble Kryptonian? to save worthless humans? Is that why he had to hug Lois Lane for comfort? Wouldn't he easily associate that with the pain of failing to save people? Yes, I am interested in that honestly.


Why can't he care about both in different ways?

If humans choose to alienate him, which they seem to be doing then he's faced with a dilemma, be their protector or their ruler. (or straight up leave)
People will bow down to his strength but...should they?
Not an easy question to answer really, Clark could end war in a day if he got involved but he has to consider many options and all those are personal, does he have any right to delve in to human conflict? Or is it his responsibility to protect us from ourselves?

Quote:
 
You seem to have ignored the part where I pointed out that MoS is positively flooded with the Christ metaphor. You know, the objectively superior person that nonetheless died for us.


But that's how it's shot, at no point has he himself acted as though he'd definitely choose to protect the whole world for a living. There's a difference between how he thinks and how the movie displays things.

In the trailers "False God" is written on a statue of him so it's hardly as clear cut as "he beat the bad Kryptonians so everyone loves him" public opinion isn't that simple.
We all know he'll become the Godly protector but he's not yet.


Quote:
 


Yes. Well let me put it like this, let's say we made Citizen Kane with the Hulk. Would that fit his character? Would that be a good Hulk Story? or are you saying character personalities and individual drives and irrelevant and should be discarded, stretched, and changed to fit whatever story you want them in? No offence but I'm pretty sure that thinking is what led to Hitler Ironman and Spiderman's One More Day. AKA the comic that led to Spiderman fans leaving en masse. So yes, which hero you use and how you build it up is important. They have built MoS Superman as an extremely heroic character that the people fear due to the massive destruction his fights cause. They have not built him as someone who has to wrestle with his inner daemons, who can get tipped to the breaking point. There are heroes who are good for that kind of story, Sentry, Hulk, And the X-men for example. Even Spiderman is better for the story where the hero gets tempted to stop being a hero for selfish reasons. Superman is once again, not one of those characters, and is one of the least suited individuals for it.


Again since when do all depictions of a character go exactly the same way?

Why does it have to go for the bog standard Superman story? Even though it's a far more gritty and "realistic" take on the universe. They're delving in to specifics instead of just "Superman is justice, the end"

Some Christ like imagery is just showing where it will head eventually. Did you not pick up on how lost Clark was? He was working on a fishing boat for crying out loud, he's never decided what to do with his power and Jonathan told him not to just show everyone until it was time.
It wasn't like Spiderman where Peter was given good reason to be a good person and protect people.

Also he doesn't wrestle with his inner demons? Which is again why he wraps that guys truck around a telegraph pole out of anger?
Standard Superman wouldn't do that to someone who was just being a dick to him, he knows he should be better than that. This Superman isn't at that point as of MoS.

Quote:
 
Once again, you put words into my mouth that were never there. This by all means a story that can be told, of a public frightened of him. If he stops being their hero and messiah, it's not to spite them, it's because he looks what he's doing, he looks at the people who fear him so much, and decides he's doing more harm than good. The question is "Am I doing the right thing?" Not "Maaaannn these people are a***** I'm leaving!"

Once again, you are completely mischaracterizing my argument.


Not what I was saying at all, the whole thing I'm getting at involves all of that.
That it's not so clear cut as "Superman is an uber good guy everyone loves"

He's faced with moral choices which is far more interesting than instantly being the regular boy scout, like in Superman Returns where he's already "Superman", the worlds protector(although people were understandably pissed he buggered off for 5 years)

This story is filling in the gaps of how he becomes one of if not the most idolized characters in fiction.

People don't seem to be getting that, wondering why Superman killed Zod and why he couldn't save absolutely everyone in Metropolis, calling it s***ty because they think he should be like Superman as an already established hero when as I think I said earlier he literally flies and puts the suit on for the first time in the movie, who does the job perfectly on the first day...
You haven't answered me directly. Why did he cry? Why does this go with him deciding to become god emperor or whatever. And what the Heck does "different ways" mean?
Okay, what are you asking now? Because I can't tell what you're asking. You seem to be wanting him to want to be selfish but now you're saying he's wondering what's the right thing to do? What?

You mean aside from destroying the world engine, and the Time he said "KRYPTON HAD ITS CHANCE!" Before destroying the only way they had to revive Krypton in favour of saving Earth? He at almost no point was in any way considering letting Zod do what he wants because he wants a Krypton.

Once again, I am not arguing the public can't be wary and fear him, who are you talking to?
Because he isn't skilled enough or experienced enough, it's not because he wants to finish what Zod stated or that he's ready to kill people.

Who are you talking to? There's room for interpretation, but you have to keep it to an interpretation, not a reimagining of receiving he is. They have already built him up in the movie, they have told a story and established his character. And you want them to ignore that so you can have evil Superman.

"Some?" Practically every other shot has him forming a cross, especially the church scene. And he already headed there, it was the plot of the entire movie. What movie did you watch? Really what did you watch? Most of it already had him wrestle with his inner demons, he wrecked the guys truck but he didn't hurt the man and why did he step in in the first place? To help out a waitress. When he was a kid he said how wanted to hurt them, but he didn't, he just gripped a fence and didn't fought back. His Bully? He saves the entire bus of people and goes back for him. His argument with his father? He wants to help people, and they're arguing about what that means with his power, whether it's farming or something else, either he should be a public hero or stay low key and as a father. He even mostly abides by his father's wishes, he didn't reveal himself until it besides absolutely necessary to and otherwise he leads a fairly unknown existence. IF. IF, he considers it, then allot of this movie will need to make him question his life and everything he knows. Or completely railroad his character so that we can have more scenes of Batman beating the s*** out of Superman.

And you are clearly responding to someone else. As I said it's alright to have the people fear him, and for him to question if it was the right decision being a super hero and, asking if he's doing more harm than good. Why is it bog standard to question if you're actually improving anything as a hero, or if you're just making things worse by being a costumed clown rather than the previous existence he had.
He's not prefect in MoS, but he's sure as f*** not psychotic either like you seen to want him to go, of that's your argument because you seen to have changed it.

You do realize Superman Returns was actually trying for that narrative right? Don't worry if you didn't get it, the movie didn't to a good job of telling it's story.

And how does he get there by being ready to kill someone? If you mean him being ready to kill Lex after all he's dine (hopefully it's more than just siccing Doomsday on him) then I might get what you mean, but then that's not exactly a break from the usual Superman story, he's done this before, just look at the DCAU.

What exactly are you saying here? Are you talking about how people don't quite get that the destruction was intended as such?
Also allot of the appeal of Superman is in that prefect person, that hero, that paragon, best Superman story I've ever read was All Start Superman which embraced that about him. Told the story where he was already the paragon, and it's far better than say, Earth One where he wrestles with all that or MoS.
Edited by Tinny, Feb 26 2016, 06:59 PM.
Posted Image
Above signature created by Graffiti

Posted Image
Member Online View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Zoom
Member Avatar


Avengers 3 Budget

Warner Bros are scared because of Marvel's budget for Avengers 3 part 1 and 2. They also scared because Batman and Superman is coming out of the movie being best friends and having no need for bandages = fake war :p
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
1 user reading this topic (1 Guest and 0 Anonymous)
DealsFor.me - The best sales, coupons, and discounts for you
Go to Next Page
« Previous Topic · Television and Films · Next Topic »
Add Reply
  • Pages:
  • 1
  • 2

Theme Designed by McKee91