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| DB RoF and Super's errors - make it STOP; All I want to do is to point out Toei's mistakes in hope they'll learn something from them. | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Aug 20 2015, 04:29 PM (6,170 Views) | |
| Turbotrup | Aug 20 2015, 04:29 PM Post #1 |
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Remember that Toriyama is only focused on DB SUPER story's OUTLINE, he doesn't go into tiny details, that's why we have so massive errors in, for example, DB Resurrection 'F', which BTW - they'll "remake", since they are already remaking BoG. A quick reminder of these inconsistencies (I'll put spoiler next to the one that has a bigger impact on the story): -Piccolo, the person who could already beat androids in the Cell Saga, was struggling to beat a Zarbon-level dude - Shisami - even though he kept on training since Buu saga. And yes, it has been already confirmed that dude was super weak, he even was one of the soldiers that has been owned by 1st form Frieza BEFORE he even started training after being resurrected!!! If they really wanted so badly to make some challenge to the Z fighters (except Freeza, of course), they could at least make the rest of the soldiers on the battlefield hand over their energy to Shisami, that'd make more sense and hurt much less. -Environment destruction sucks as soon as Goku and Freeza transform into their teased forms. Just look at the "power" of Golden Freeza: http://cdn.makeagif.com/media/8-17-2015/1yP24x.gif (Note that he brags about how "powerful" that was) Now look how powerful his attacks were back on Namek: http://media.giphy.com/media/3o85xCnUrqBbD4E0Ug/giphy.gif (he wasn't even at his maximum) Not enough for you? The rest of the fight looked even worse, they didn't even create a single crater while fighting on the GROUND! The shockwaves should completely destroy the mountains which they were fighting on, c'mon! And since Freeza has gotten literally thousands of times stronger since the start of his training, animators should show off his power's destruction capabilities much better, otherwise it loses tons of immersion. - Spoiler: click to toggle And there ARE already errors appearing in DB SUPER, TOO! -When Beerus fought Goku SSJ1, he said that Goku was probably struggling in defeating Freeza! It's as if the scenarist completely forgot about Goku's progress in entire Cell saga alone! Currently (it is even shown in the Manga of DB SUPER) SSJ Goku would be able to beat CELL with a few hits! -Vegeta had a hard time on 150G (he trained on 300 before even Cell Saga started) - http://images69.fotosik.pl/1010/ffabad2bbcbafba8gen.png Goku made this tiny crater while training! He obviously meant to punch hard - before someone starts some stupid argument, like "he can focus his Ki in a different way, so he won't make such a mess, jeez!", because that's stupid and doesn't make any kind of sense. The air pressure from waving the hand alone should cause more destruction, honestly... -Gotenks and Trunks had problems with a... Snake... They couldn't even K.O. it with several punches, that's sad And these are just 6(!) episodes! Imagine what may happen in the future, if we won't do anything about it! We will literally get GT v.2!!! ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ There are 2 ways to contact Toei and I suggest using both of them: - Via mail: international@toei.co.jp - Via their site, posting an inquiry: http://corp.toei-anim.co.jp/english/before_english_inquiry.html Of course you can defend your laziness by stating that it'll change nothing, because it's been like this for years, but: 1. you should know that people's whining about Vegeta's embarrassing scene in BoG has been heard out by Toei and on the world's premiere of the Resurrection 'F', without even being asked about it, they confirmed that Vegeta won't have such a scene in the new movie! See? They DO listen to the crowd, there has to be a bigger number of the "whiners" though, that's why I made this topic. 2. If this still doesn't convince you to even give it a try, so you won't feel bad because of not giving it a chance, then you're a crappy fan, honestly. I'm not asking you to type some super long statement, it's the opposite, I'm asking you to type something relatively short but SPOT-ON, so they'll get the idea and won't get bored of reading it. If you have some extra time, you can also give them links to similar situations which I mentioned etc. Edited by Turbotrup, Aug 20 2015, 04:38 PM.
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| + ThePrinceOfSaiyans | Aug 20 2015, 04:53 PM Post #2 |
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魔王子
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Ugh -It isn't suggested that Piccolo was struggling with a Zarbon-level being. Shisami was stated to be at his level before Freeza and his men arrived on Earth, but Shisami could have easily trained like Freeza did. -The lack of widespread destruction isn't a contradiction. -I'm still waiting on an official translation for what Beerus said in regards to Super Saiyan Goku. All I've seen are s***ty fansubs. -Hitiro from Kanzenshuu explains it best:
-Ki is metaphysical, therefore does not adhere to the laws of physics. If you wanted to get technical, a measly Ki blasts from someone as strong as Freeza should have enough condensed energy to destroy a planet, but they do no such thing upon detonating. -Jesus Christ... They were holding back against the snake. Honestly, I don't know what you wish to accomplish with this thread. Do you really think Toei is going to take suggestions from members of some Dragon Ball forum? Edited by ThePrinceOfSaiyans, Aug 20 2015, 04:56 PM.
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| Turbotrup | Aug 20 2015, 05:09 PM Post #3 |
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- Shisami, just like the rest of the soldiers, flew away when Freeza crushed the glass in their spaceship, it proves he is a weakling. - Entire point of fights in DBZ is destruction that should get bigger every time someone get's stronger, it's just this simple logic. - If all of the translations have the same meaning, then Toei is to blame - But he got tired after a few seconds of training, literally - The scene was supposed to show off the "god" power of his. Maybe not destruction, but I'd rather to have that beam much longer, like, it should encircle the planet, honestly. - The only holding back moment there was when Goten wanted to use a freaking Kamehameha on it! If they were holding back, they wouldn't attack him so repeatedly and still were unable to K.O it!!! If you don't know what I want to accomplish, then reread this topic or simply read it's ending. |
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| + ThePrinceOfSaiyans | Aug 20 2015, 05:21 PM Post #4 |
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-Yup, and that was before the 4 months of training. -You seriously think DBZ is all about destruction and fighting? Anyway, the destructive feats don't have to get bigger when one's battle power grows. The best Boo's ever done is blow up planets, yet Cell claims he's capable of destroying a Solar System. -What? -Uh huh, you'd get tired too if you lifted a 20 pound weight over and over again as fast as you could. It's reasonable to assume Vegeta is going all out in that scene. -No, it really shouldn't. The Z-fighters have made a habit of trying to contain the amount of destruction their battles create. -No, they were holding back the entire time, and Goten decided not to kill the snake. |
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| Tinny | Aug 20 2015, 05:22 PM Post #5 |
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Here's the problem, yes the power chain is thrown into wack from the movies, but quite frankly those are really shallow reasons to dislike a movie. The movies made some errors yes but for the most part the soul of dbz is fine, and we got to see our favorite characters again interact in fun and interesting ways. Even if they screw up the power balance horribly, as long as they tell a good story with it that is worth watching, I'll suspend my disbelief for the movie. And frankly it gives me a good experience as a fan. I mean someone tell me the last time Roshi was awesome aside from RnF. Super (for me anyway) isn't bad because Goku can't best freeza for some reason, is that it retells much better movies with much worse execution, power levels being irrelevant to its quality. Edited by Tinny, Aug 20 2015, 05:28 PM.
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| Turbotrup | Aug 20 2015, 06:02 PM Post #6 |
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- If he trained his entire life with a result of Zarbon-level, then how would a few months make much difference? I remind you that Piccolo kept on training through his entire LIFE and kept training after Buu saga too, so he is probably stronger than Semi Perfect Cell. This is an error, whether you like it or not - It's obvious that they can hold their Ki so the blast won't 1-shot the planet, but they can't hold back punches for god's love - while clashing each other's fists they can't hold back shockwaves that create craters! - I meant that if every single version has the same/similar line in it, then Toei screw this up, simply - I remind you that Vegeta is dozens of times stronger than back, when Cell saga didn't even start yet - I can bet my life that animators simply don't know how powerful their attacks should be, so they don't know how to put it destruction-wise either or they simply keep on forgetting that - So he needed a Kamehameha wave to do so? Because all he would need is a single punch Edited by Turbotrup, Aug 20 2015, 06:06 PM.
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| Turbotrup | Aug 20 2015, 06:04 PM Post #7 |
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The point of this topic is to make Toei be more careful and thus result with more quality content. I've never said that the movies or episodes of "super" are already bad, I'm just saying it can result in horrible things later on. Edited by Turbotrup, Aug 20 2015, 06:05 PM.
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| + ThePrinceOfSaiyans | Aug 20 2015, 06:13 PM Post #8 |
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-Who's to say Shisami ever trained? Maybe he was born with a power level around Zarbon's level. -I don't think that's how it works. Why would villains try and contain their energy? I feel Ki is naturally condensed, and must be manually expanded to destroy celestial objects. -I've only ever scene one fanslation. I have yet to see a proper translation of whatever Beerus said. Even if Beerus had said that, he's either unreliable when it comes to gauging how strong someone is, or Beerus is trying to goad Goku into becoming stronger. -His energy level is a lot bigger, but his physical strength likely isn't. In the Majin Boo arc, he was training under 150 Gs with Trunks. -I kinda doubt that. -No, but a Kamehameha would have been a clean kill, unlike a punch. Edited by ThePrinceOfSaiyans, Aug 20 2015, 06:14 PM.
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| Tinny | Aug 20 2015, 06:41 PM Post #9 |
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but again that power level imbalance led to some good things, like Roshi actually being relevant. And sure maybe the action could create a bit more debris but that's still really small as long as the fight itself is awesome. which can be accomplished just fine without destroying the planet by side effect. I mean what's the worst that could happen from power level silliness? Maybe one could say it's a symptom of them not caring but frankly I think episode 5 is a much more apparent indicator of a lack of care and effort. I mean really, I don't think alot of people think GT is terrible because of power levels being silly. |
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| Turbotrup | Aug 20 2015, 06:42 PM Post #10 |
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- It has been said/written somewhere that he rivals with Sorbet and Tagoma since always, so he obviously wants to keep on getting stronger. Besides, isn't being a soldier of Freeza's army a training itself? - 1st form Freeza, without trying, destroyed entire city during the movie, but when he turns golden, the size of Ki blasts are even smaller than those which Raditz created... In other words: they either make the explosion's size to be smaller or/and animators just suck... - There was also some weird thing Goku said, something about his punches being so powerful, they can send people into other dimension or something(?) - Physical strength is one of 3 components that make Ki (based on the interview with Toriyama), so that's not the case. He maybe does, but he's far from being tired. Besides, even kid trunks, without going SSJ, manages to move there, while it is obvious there is a huuuge gap between them. - And I don't. They often forget to even draw character correctly at certain frames. Even Toriyama made Gohan kill 8 Cell Jrs even though Cell only made 7 of them. - If Kamehameha wasn't the only option of finishing that snake, they'd finish it with a punch... Stop walking in circles with your "arguments", really... |
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| + Clearin | Aug 20 2015, 06:46 PM Post #11 |
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Beerus never said SSj Goku would struggle vs Freeza. He said he can see how Goku defeated Freeza, but that'd be the best he'd be capable of. Context is important though, the 3 people who matter here are Goku, Beerus and Freeza, Beerus is just making a fancy way of saying "Sure you can defeat Freeza, but you can't defeat me" |
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| Turbotrup | Aug 20 2015, 06:46 PM Post #12 |
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Many of them hate GT because of PL being silly, easiest examples: - Goku struggling to lift a building - Goku being hurt by a falling glass (and he was aware of it falling on him) - Goku being impressed that Omega Shenron managed to 1-shot the city etc. The animation is a different thing - they often have to make everything in a hurry to make it on time. Some animators even have few projects to work on at the same time. |
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| Turbotrup | Aug 20 2015, 06:54 PM Post #13 |
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http://s18.postimg.org/tqf46vpzt/beerus.png |
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| + Clearin | Aug 20 2015, 06:58 PM Post #14 |
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Those are bad subs.
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| Turbotrup | Aug 20 2015, 07:05 PM Post #15 |
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I see, but how do you know the conversation went like this? Do you know japanese? |
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