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| Toguro runs the Dragonball Z gauntlet. | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: May 21 2015, 03:57 PM (3,947 Views) | |
| + Pelador | May 21 2015, 03:57 PM Post #1 |
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Crazy Awesome Legend
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Toguru from Yu Yu Hakusho runs the DBZ gauntlet. How far can he go? Saiyan Saga Radditz Nappa Vegeta Freeza Saga Cui Vegeta Dodoria Zarbon Monster Zarbon Recoome Jeice Burter Ginyu Freeza first form Freeza second form Freeza third form Freeza fourth form Freeza 50% Freeza 100% Cell Saga Android 19 Android 20 Cyborg 18 Cyborg 17 Inperfect Cell Android 16 Semi Perfect Cell Cell Junior Initial perfect Cell Cell games Perfect Cell warm up 50% Perfect Cell 100% Perfect Cell Super Perfect cell I can't see him getting past First form Freeza but I can imagine him beating Ginyu. |
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| + Solid Snake | May 30 2015, 07:00 PM Post #121 |
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滅Are you frightened?
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That's my point though, if Goku vs Vegeta first fight is anything to go off of, then Goku physical attacks were just as strong as the Kamehameha during the duration of their battle. Goku managed to stagger him with his attacks (though he managed to recover) as in Kaioken times 3 and on 4 his Kamehameha did the the same (and he recovered from that too). Chapter: 227 (DBZ 33), P1.3, P2.1 Kuririn: “Goku, how’d you do that? Was that something you were taught by Lord Kaio? Goku: “Yeah. It’s called Kaio-Ken! [ ] You control all the ki in your body…momentarily amplifying it. If you get it right, then your power, speed, destructive force, and defensive force all become many times greater…” This here shows that there's a difference for power (strength) and destructive force (ki projectiles assumingly) yet defensively seems to stand by itself. |
![]() Shinnozou tomete kureru! ~ Evil Ryu SSJG and SSJ4 Goku Sig Dragon Ball: Ultimate Road Story Naruto and Goku's Adventure Story
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| Mihawk | May 30 2015, 07:05 PM Post #122 |
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They were just as strong in terms of hurting the opponent, yet also show to have completely different levels of force and destructive damage. Which leads to the belief that they're more susceptible to physical punches than ki attacks. |
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| + Solid Snake | May 30 2015, 07:57 PM Post #123 |
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How can both be just as strong but have different showing of force though? |
![]() Shinnozou tomete kureru! ~ Evil Ryu SSJG and SSJ4 Goku Sig Dragon Ball: Ultimate Road Story Naruto and Goku's Adventure Story
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| Mihawk | May 30 2015, 08:11 PM Post #124 |
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It's called susceptibility... or weakness to a type of attack. Kind of how like in some games mages are always taking hard hitting magic attacks without being phased yet when they get cut with a sword the suddenly die. It's more or less just a plot device like ki control. Technically even if ki was concentrated the energy just can't disappear. It needs to go through the Earth and beyond. It doesn't make sense in terms of physics but we just accept that ki control as a plot convenience. |
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| + Solid Snake | May 30 2015, 08:29 PM Post #125 |
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But how can they have absurb amounts of ki and none of that increasing their physical strength? That's what don't make sense to me. You can't have ki higher then your opponent to the point them hitting you with both physical and projectiles have a TOO difference of impacts. And the quote earlier is hinting that their overall defensive force is all in a singular column (being able to take blunt damage from any attack that has to deal with: power, speed, and destructive force). If that was the case then Goku would have included or specified saying it increases ki attacks solely apart from power. |
![]() Shinnozou tomete kureru! ~ Evil Ryu SSJG and SSJ4 Goku Sig Dragon Ball: Ultimate Road Story Naruto and Goku's Adventure Story
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| + Steve | May 30 2015, 10:13 PM Post #126 |
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Greetings. I will be your waifu this season.
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Well it does considering his whole thing is muscle manipulation it's not like he only increases his lifting strength. To have enough strength to do a small scale version of what Gai does is definitely greater than what Goku does. Even if we want to say pushing Chi-Chi out the ring involved no Ki at all(even though it could be an invisible Ki blast as Roshi couldn't sense) that still pales in comparison to being able to fire something more powerful than a bullet with a flick of a finger. A gust of wind is nothing compared to: Spoiler: click to toggle Especially considering those are demons, way stronger than a human. Actually he also does make a blast by flicking his hand, he hits the wall if the stadium where Yusuke's friends are which is like 30+ meters away while he's just playing around. Not sure that was in the anime. So with a full power punch clearly he could send out some powerful shockwaves. Also with one punch he shatters the whole arena he and Yusuke are fighting on. |
![]() Definitely not a succubus, fear not | |
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| Mihawk | May 31 2015, 06:08 PM Post #127 |
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The Ki does increase their physical strength. I already said that. It multiplies it. It doesn't do much else. If you have more ki than your opponent then you will hit harder physical attacks. I still don't get what you're trying to get at with the quote. Are you saying Goku should have said something along the lines of "it increases my ki defense and my physical defense as well"? And if he didn't that means the barrier doesn't exist? That's a fallacy.
It does but you don't know by how much so it's a pointless measure. It's whatever is in the author's mind at the time. Like I said if the author wants he can lift only 10 pounds but destroy the planet with a punch. I agree that they win in terms of strength of blowing winds with their strength. But that's the only category the decisively win in. AT didn't write in gust blowing, yet Goku @ Freeza has kicking strength several leagues above other characters who can use the wind with their strength. The point people were making about how different authors show strength in different ways is actually relevant here. |
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| + Solid Snake | May 31 2015, 11:43 PM Post #128 |
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So how hard do they hit from your observation? Excluding benchmark physical strength. Their destructive force lies mainly in there ki attacks. And since Goku differentiated power from destructive force, I can't possibly see them being more vulnerable to physical attacks then ki attacks. The way he worded defense as defensive force has to mean he meant all around. |
![]() Shinnozou tomete kureru! ~ Evil Ryu SSJG and SSJ4 Goku Sig Dragon Ball: Ultimate Road Story Naruto and Goku's Adventure Story
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| Mihawk | Jun 1 2015, 03:00 AM Post #129 |
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Well without statements and visual evidence there's no other solid way to gauge their strength. So I agree with what we've been giving in terms of benchmarks and what not. I don't agree with you that just because he didn't say physical strength he didn't mean both under the same umbrella. He did mean combat speed and travel speed in the same umbrella, after all. |
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| + Solid Snake | Jun 1 2015, 03:24 AM Post #130 |
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So you think anyone on SSJ3 Gotenks tier or higher can replicate what he did? I think you said if wasn't consistent then it can't be taken as face value then (cause no later feat like that occurred excluding BoG and RoF). That's what I'm saying though, when he says "power" what's the first thing that pops in your mind? And for "destructive force"? Being a simplistic story, it's easy to just automatically assume they mean anything regarding their overall strength. Destructive force is easily understood for ki attacks. Trying to determine what they're strength lies due to something the author didn't expand on. |
![]() Shinnozou tomete kureru! ~ Evil Ryu SSJG and SSJ4 Goku Sig Dragon Ball: Ultimate Road Story Naruto and Goku's Adventure Story
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| Mihawk | Jun 1 2015, 03:35 AM Post #131 |
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Yeah, I think anyone with SSJ3 Gotenks level or higher can replicate what he did. If I said it wasn't consistent and can't be taken at face value than I'll admit I was wrong back then if that's the entire context. I honestly don't understand your argument with the quote, maybe someone else can break it down for me? |
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