| We hope you enjoy your visit to this forum. If you are reading this then it means you are currently browsing the forum as a guest, we don’t limit any of the content posted from guests however if you join, you will have the ability to join the discussions! We are always happy to see new faces at this forum and we would like to hear your opinion, so why not register now? It doesn’t take long and you can get posting right away. Click here to Register! If you are having difficulties validating your account please email us at admin@dbzf.co.uk If you're already a member please log in to your account: |
| DBZf Debate League | |
|---|---|
| Tweet Topic Started: May 12 2015, 10:57 PM (5,749 Views) | |
| + Sandy Shore | May 19 2015, 05:17 AM Post #61 |
![]()
|
If your position is well-sourced, articulated, and not contradicted, it doesn't mean there isn't still an issue with it. Even if the majority can't to see it. What your salesman analogy left out was the fact that you might not be able to sell the superior product for the simple fact that people are comfortable and content with what they already have. That is neither the fault of the salesman, or the product. It's an unfortunate obstacle. If the opinion that seeks to challenge the status quo can not be disproved, makes sense and might be a more logical fit (objectively), it doesn't mean people are going to turn away from what they already believe - therefore the person defending the established notion. So you can challenge someone who others have already decided are more competent than you are? Who's views and opinions already line up more with what they also believe, compared to you who got voted less competent? So that those who voted for you already may vote again? Those voted at the top are surely outed as champions of the majority. It may be well earned, but it doesn't mean there isn't a personality or familiarity (of fact) bias. Please don't think I'm trying to attack you for whatever reason - it just so happened that the highest voted user challenged my dismissal of the system, is all. If it seems very personal, it's merely an accident. Currently, as you know, I'm debating the nature of the "Full Power" Super Saiyan form. There is clearly personal bias from everyone who looks at the concept, and how it works exactly, so why don't I challenge you in formulating a convincing argument for how it works, and letting the people vote on which fits better? Despite your social and familiarity bias. Given your first post in the thread, it would seem you don't like to think of it the same way as I'm currently considering it. Edited by Sandy Shore, May 21 2015, 03:58 PM.
|
![]() |
|
| + Yusuke | May 19 2015, 05:23 AM Post #62 |
![]() ![]()
|
A debate about debating the criteria of how debaters should be ranked on a debate thread...
Edited by Yusuke, May 19 2015, 05:23 AM.
|
![]() Ask Yusuke | |
![]() |
|
| + Sandy Shore | May 19 2015, 05:25 AM Post #63 |
![]()
|
Is that a good way to prove one's debating abilities? |
![]() |
|
| + Yusuke | May 19 2015, 05:32 AM Post #64 |
![]() ![]()
|
IDK man, i'm just observing what's going on in this thread. Though I do trust the insight of the members that give their opinions here for the most part. I would be a casual scrub when it comes to DBZ if it weren't for people like KP, SS, and Brofist. Edited by Yusuke, May 19 2015, 05:32 AM.
|
![]() Ask Yusuke | |
![]() |
|
|
|
May 19 2015, 05:35 AM Post #65 |
![]() ![]()
|
You forgot the greatest of all time. Spoiler: click to toggle
|
| |
![]() |
|
| + Yusuke | May 19 2015, 05:36 AM Post #66 |
![]() ![]()
|
Ahh of course, I wouldn't be nearly as knowledgeable in Broly threads if it weren't for him. May his legacy live on forever...
Edited by Yusuke, May 19 2015, 05:37 AM.
|
![]() Ask Yusuke | |
![]() |
|
|
|
May 19 2015, 05:38 AM Post #67 |
![]() ![]()
|
R.I.P to the living legend. http://dbzf.co.uk/profile/4104856/ |
| |
![]() |
|
| + Havoc_Wreaker | May 19 2015, 05:40 AM Post #68 |
|
Popcorn
![]()
|
top debaters tier doesn't make sense how can one know ''everything'' its like the tier is synonymous with having a god complex for the series i doubt even AT would put himself there lol |
| |
![]() |
|
| FutureProtagonist | May 19 2015, 05:52 AM Post #69 |
![]()
Quwrof Wrlccywrlir
![]()
|
I never thought you were attacking me personally, though I felt I was included in a group that you were unreasonably attacking. Of course I have bias towards my point of view. I wouldn't have that point of view if I didn't. You have the same bias. If you put out a point that I have no counter for, I'll reconsider, but you haven't. I'm going to argue my point of view until you convince me otherwise. The same goes for you, the same goes for all of us. Of course you can! It is possible to make yourself more competent and convince those people that you're the more competent one now. You can work to surpass people who are better than you at whatever it is. If the people who know the most right now can never be challenged, what's the point of teaching anybody anything? What's the point of learning? What is so bizarre about this to you? I simply don't get it. Maybe I'm less skilled than Bob over there at Calculus, but what if I read ten calculus books and work at it? Can I never be better than Bob just because he's better than me now? Edited by FutureProtagonist, May 19 2015, 06:18 AM.
|
|
I love building PCs. If you have any questions about it feel free to ask. I can help you with almost any kind of PC you'd want to build. Join DBZeta | |
![]() |
|
| EMIYA | May 19 2015, 06:08 AM Post #70 |
|
"I am the bone of my sword."
![]()
|
While you people are having your ...ahem...debate in here, don't forget to cast the votes as well. Also, anyone who asks to be ranked, just say so and I'll put you name on it. There isn't any kind of limit to this. |
![]() |
|
| + Emmeth | May 19 2015, 10:23 AM Post #71 |
![]()
I ♥ Yoeri
![]()
|
And please don't discuss banned people in a thread like this. |
![]() My Twitch Page | |
![]() |
|
| + Sandy Shore | May 19 2015, 01:27 PM Post #72 |
![]()
|
The bias I was talking about wouldn't be your own towards to an explanation, but others towards the person giving the explanation or the explanation that others are giving. If they already consider your word more reliable, or they also hold the same view, then they will get the most votes. If you walked into a room where people were insisting there was a genuine painting by Rembrandt on the wall As for me putting forth a point that you have a counter for: what's the worth of your counter? That you can muster a reason to disagree doesn't therefore make me wrong - and vice versa. Is it that others deemed you more capable at debating, and as such your word more truth? It certainly carries more weight. I never said otherwise, but it's not a case of surpassing Bob; it's a case of people voting on whether you've surpassed Bob or not. To be better than Bob at calculus you would be objectively judged against a set of questions and answers that is unanimously agreed upon. The point isn't to change anyone's mind as to what the answer should be This isn't a contest of one's debating ability, but rather how closely one lines up to the majority opinion. If this were a contest of one's ability to debate, then the opposite view would be welcome The more people you agree with, the more popular you are - popularity contest. Yes, you may also be right. Edited by Sandy Shore, May 19 2015, 02:25 PM.
|
![]() |
|
| EMIYA | May 19 2015, 04:52 PM Post #73 |
|
"I am the bone of my sword."
![]()
|
There's nothing you can do about bias. A good debater can back up their reasoning. It's as simple as that. Most of the members here will gladly be able to change opinions if given the right information. Tons of people were absolutely certain that Gohan was only an SSJ in Movie 10. But then we got actual images to compare and we could easily see that Movie 10 Gohan took his exact reference from SSJ2 Gohan from the Boo Arc. It was a huge game changer. The same thing happen way in the past. Back in the days when people only had the fan translations and stuff, that's all we could use. Then Herms, Kazenshuu and what not came around, started getting the actual information together and we finally got some real stuff that we didn't have to half guess on. As time goes on, we get more and more information. Opinion and popularity only make up a small part of this. The majority boils down to what you know and how you know it. There's nothing you can do about it unless you can turn the other side's point of view. Yes people are going to vote on you, that's how it goes. Debates are kind of like a democracy. The majority vote wins. If you can't turn the other sides points of view, then you lose, it's that simple. --- --- @ Yondaime A top debater isn't someone who knows everything. They're someone who has an intrinsic knowledge on each subject. They know where to find information on Dragon Ball, Z, GT, movies, Translations, etc. This has gotten easier because we've managed to get a lot of information into a single place like the Strength Checkers. But even the Strength Checkers can only go so far. Here's an example. A "Upper" Debater will go to the Strength Checker to see some facts on Tao Pai Pai. A "Top" level debater will have done the same thing and have read the manga too. Same thing with any other issue. It's that extra step that they take along with being quite knowledgeable. I could just bring a Strength Checker quote on Hirudengard. That easily makes me knowledgeable. But a Top level debater would have seen the movie, could tell you the specific expressions that might have been made. I could explain the difference between the dub and original Japanese and all that. That's the difference between them. More so, a Top Level debater is someone who will never decline a challenge because they feel they don't know enough about it. |
![]() |
|
| + Pyrus | May 19 2015, 05:07 PM Post #74 |
![]() ![]()
|
A Level 1 debater will not only take information from the Strength Checker, but will also support it with context from which it's called from whether it be the manga, anime, or movies. A Level 2 debater may only take a line from the Strength Checker and present it by itself with no surrounding context and believe that to be sufficient. The levels are arbitrary for the point I'm attempting to make. |
|
Spoiler: click to toggle
| |
![]() |
|
| Fearless Saiyajin | May 19 2015, 06:23 PM Post #75 |
![]()
Legendary of Super Saiyan
![]()
|
This is ridiculous, debating about "How or What is a good debater" jus ruined this thread. |
DragonballZeta
| |
![]() |
|
| 0 users reading this topic | |
| Go to Next Page | |
| « Previous Topic · Dragon Ball/Z Discussion · Next Topic » |
| Track Topic · E-mail Topic |
4:47 PM Jul 13
|
Theme Designed by McKee91
Powered by ZetaBoards Premium · Privacy Policy























4:47 PM Jul 13