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NEW DBZ MOVIE 2015: Fukkatsu no F (Warning: Spoilers in Topic)
Topic Started: Jul 15 2014, 04:56 AM (364,314 Views)
superperfectnerd
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He didn't train post cell to the point it pissed Vegeta off and made Goku acknowledge it at Dabura


Yeah, I would have thought he would have learnt from that.

Even if he just went for a brisk jog every morning he'd probably be stronger than Goku and Vegeta.
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Frost20
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is there any info about Zarbon ?
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+ Pyrus
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His ashes are in a jar in a compartment in Freeza's hover chair. That's what I heard from Planet Namek.
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Professor Gohan
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No way?
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Skywalker
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Pyrus
Dec 31 2014, 06:12 AM
Despite being a scholar, Gohan doesn't seem to learn his lesson.
Maybe he won't be drunk this time.
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True. Maybe Gohan will take sleeping pills before Freeza shows up so he can have an excuse to get his a*** kicked yet again.

Then in the next one he can decide to fire a full power blast into space for the sake of showing off, so he has no power when the next threat shows up.
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TheGmGoken
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For those who thinks Vegeta should be the one to defeat Freeza.......explain yourself?
"dbzfan7"
 
"TheGmGoken"
 
"dbzfan7"
 
Yeah I give up. Apparently Vegeta deserves payback for some a***** stopping him from being an uncontrolled a*****.

This is anime silly :lol: . One good deed suddenly means you're not a selfish prick who used to kill for a living. It also means you're allowed to do no harm and any memory of who you USED to be is erased by every character except yourself and your rival. Vegeta killed a-lot of people at the Tenkaichi Budokai. But after killing himself. That doesn't matter and he still deserve to kill Freeza.

Not that it matters though. Freeza already been beaten by Two Saiyans. Two SUPER Saiyans. If anything this movie will make Vegeta look like a straight b*** as 2 other people have already beaten Freeza. It won't have that feel good moment. Honestly the only thing Vegeta deserves is to be beaten up again like in other movies. What more development do this character needs that we haven't seen in Cell and Boo arc(Now Vegeta is a gimmick thief). Just wondering. Why do Vegeta deserves to beat Freeza? Even when Vegeta turnt good. It wasn't until BoG that he DEFENDED earth. He usually cost more damage to the Earth than good. Such as killing people.....on purpose....because.....of...a....one....sided...rivalry.


Apparently so. I mean Freeza made him be evil, so he deserves to....oh wait...no he didn't. That was a stupid dub line. Silly me. I mean if Freeza wasn't around Vegeta would help his race and....probably....just do what Freeza did...except with him in charge....huh. I mean yeah he deserves to kill Freeza as Freeza made his life miserable. How dare Freeza be an a***** to an equally evil genocidal maniac who also kills his minions and delighted in killing the innocent. Oh wait...hm...something ain't right here. I keep looking back and all I see is just one stronger douchebag being a douchebag to another douchebag. Am I supposed to feel sorry for Vegeta because he couldn't be an uncontrollable douche? Hell once he was free from Freeza, he still was an awful person. If anything without being controlled by Freeza, he'd probably never have been good. He'd never join our heroes if he were the top dog. He would just kill them, and if he somehow escaped if he lost, try to kill them again. He only joined the heroes as he wasn't strong enough on his own to beat Freeza and his lackey's. If he was the strongest he'd never team up with them.

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* Yu Narukami
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Izanagi!

It would be preferable to Goku beating the big bad again. Vegeta's power is always tauted as 'great' or 'amazing', yet Vegeta always takes a back-seat to Goku. It's time that Vegeta actually got his time in the spotlight. The fact that he actually has a long history with Freeza helps too, as opposed to Goku, who only found out who he was on the way to Namek. Though Vegeta didn't seem to care, he actually experienced what it was like to lose his entire race and be one of the last Saiyans in the Universe; Goku didn't suffer that and, as such, it didn't really have much of an impact on his character.

Why Vegeta?

He has a history with Freeza
He deserves to be the hero for once
Goku beating Freeza again would just be boring
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TheGmGoken
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I don't know why you're saying "again". The last "Big Bad" that Goku defeated(Written by Toriyama) was Freeza. He hasn't beaten any "Big Bad" since then. Vegeta deserves anything BUT being a hero. Vegeta has never redeem himself ever. Everything he has done Pre-BoG has been for selfish reasons. Even more-so than Goku. Vegeta is an a*****. Freeza was being an a***** dictator to another a***** prick. Had Freeza NOT enslave Vegeta then Vegeta would be even WORST than what Freeza was. Freeza at least had an army. Vegeta would form a small alliance with two people. Kill everyone else. Who to say Goku will beat Freeza. Maybe Beerus will? Maybe even Goku and Vegeta will beat him. But won't kill him again. Perhaps sent into another universe.

Vegeta might have Saiyan pride. But he doesn't give a DAMN about his race. If Vegeta cared so much about being the last Saiyan. He would't had killed Nappa or use the DBs for Immortally. Vegeta can go to hell and stay there to burn for all I care. He doesn't deserve to be the hero.

Yes, I'm heavily aware that Vegeta will probably be the hero. Yes I'm going to "Deal with it" if it happens the way I think it'll happen. And yes I do hope for this movie to be better than BoG.
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+ Havoc_Wreaker
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Popcorn

wow haters gonna hate, is totally applicable

gm you seem to forget that vegeta DID redeem himself before BOG
he went as far as to come back to life to try and save earth knowing he was going to fail
he then went on to become veggeto knowing that it was permanent and pride being thrown away
and then tried to help with the spirit bomb

so thats 3 times in the last part of the saga alone, i also like how you u bring up his bad points BEFORE he became
for the most part good, lmao

i dont see how you can hate vegeta, hes just that badass in every series
Edited by Havoc_Wreaker, Jan 3 2015, 01:28 AM.
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superperfectnerd
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TheGmGoken
Jan 2 2015, 10:35 PM
For those who thinks Vegeta should be the one to defeat Freeza.......explain yourself?
"dbzfan7"
 
"TheGmGoken"
 
"dbzfan7"
 
Yeah I give up. Apparently Vegeta deserves payback for some a***** stopping him from being an uncontrolled a*****.

This is anime silly :lol: . One good deed suddenly means you're not a selfish prick who used to kill for a living. It also means you're allowed to do no harm and any memory of who you USED to be is erased by every character except yourself and your rival. Vegeta killed a-lot of people at the Tenkaichi Budokai. But after killing himself. That doesn't matter and he still deserve to kill Freeza.

Not that it matters though. Freeza already been beaten by Two Saiyans. Two SUPER Saiyans. If anything this movie will make Vegeta look like a straight b*** as 2 other people have already beaten Freeza. It won't have that feel good moment. Honestly the only thing Vegeta deserves is to be beaten up again like in other movies. What more development do this character needs that we haven't seen in Cell and Boo arc(Now Vegeta is a gimmick thief). Just wondering. Why do Vegeta deserves to beat Freeza? Even when Vegeta turnt good. It wasn't until BoG that he DEFENDED earth. He usually cost more damage to the Earth than good. Such as killing people.....on purpose....because.....of...a....one....sided...rivalry.


Apparently so. I mean Freeza made him be evil, so he deserves to....oh wait...no he didn't. That was a stupid dub line. Silly me. I mean if Freeza wasn't around Vegeta would help his race and....probably....just do what Freeza did...except with him in charge....huh. I mean yeah he deserves to kill Freeza as Freeza made his life miserable. How dare Freeza be an a***** to an equally evil genocidal maniac who also kills his minions and delighted in killing the innocent. Oh wait...hm...something ain't right here. I keep looking back and all I see is just one stronger douchebag being a douchebag to another douchebag. Am I supposed to feel sorry for Vegeta because he couldn't be an uncontrollable douche? Hell once he was free from Freeza, he still was an awful person. If anything without being controlled by Freeza, he'd probably never have been good. He'd never join our heroes if he were the top dog. He would just kill them, and if he somehow escaped if he lost, try to kill them again. He only joined the heroes as he wasn't strong enough on his own to beat Freeza and his lackey's. If he was the strongest he'd never team up with them.

Saiyans are 'evil' by nature. They literally crave violence and destruction. Asking a saiyan to not fight and conquer is like asking a lion not to hunt a gazelle. Goku would be exactly the same had he not suffered brain damage as a baby. Vegeta didn't have that luxury and his redemption - whilst certainly a bumpy ride - came through experience and choice. Plus, righteousness isn't the only thing that makes a character interesting to watch. You seem to be suggesting a fight can only be enjoyable if it's a 'good versus evil' battle for the fate of the universe. What about when Vegeta was on Namek? Did you not enjoy his fights with Kiwi? Dodoria? Zarbon? He has history with Freeza and despite the fact that - as you said - he didn't 'deserve' to be the one to beat Freeza the first time, he now does deserve to because he has developed into a good person. There's nothing wrong with a redemption story and seeing Vegeta face Freeza as a different person with different motives is more exciting than seeing Goku face him again with the same motives.

And this obsession with Vegeta always making things worse...well yeah, he's a saiyan, he wants a fight. Goku is exactly the same - as I've said before - the only difference is that Goku happens to not lose or his actions accidentally turn out for the best.

Goku let Taopaipai climb Karin's tower because he was confident he wouldn't get strong enough to be a threat again.

Goku let Vegeta live to threaten Earth again because he wanted a rematch.

Goku let Freeza attain 100% of his power because he wanted to beat him at his best.

Goku opted to not find Gero before the 17 and 18 were awakened and mankind was exterminated and just train for an exciting fight instead.

Goku put the whole fate of the universe on his 9 year old son's shoulders despite the fact Gohan didn't want to fight and happily ignored Piccolo's pleas to intervene...he even gave Cell a senzu bean because he wanted Cell to have a fair fight.

Goku opted to not return to life to be with his family because he wanted to 'protect' the earth from villains who return for revenge on those who defeated them...which they will continue to do when somebody else defeats them anyway, that's just what villains do. He then lost his s*** from the excitement of possibly fighting and training with all the great fighters of Otherworld.

Goku opted to ignore Kaioshin and fight Vegeta, letting his energy revive Buu instead of just ssj3ing the fight to an early conclusion.

Goku decided to let Buu live so that the kids could defend the world this time...despite the fact that Gohan did it last time anyway.

Goku runs off with a small child at the end of Z and gives a heartfelt goodbye to all his friends despite the fact he has the shunkan ido and could see them instantly....at any time....whenever he wants.


I still like Goku by the way. He's probably my second favourite, especially when he was a kid, but his stupid decisions are just as stupid as Vegeta's. Vegeta just happens to always lose and Goku happens to always win. Well that formula is boring now. I wouldn't even be that concerned if Vegeta wasn't the one to beat Freeza, just anyone but Goku.
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+ Clearin
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I wouldn't like Vegeta beating the villain in the Freeza or Cell saga, his attitude and reasoning for it would just make him insufferable if he succeeded. But now I wouldn't mind. If anything I think Vegeta is more suited to beat a villain now than Goku is, Goku still cares too much about a good fight, while Vegeta cares more about protecting Bulma.
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Professor Gohan
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Probably Earth as well, Clearin.
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Kblo247
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How can you say vegeta would have grown up to be worse had he not been given to frieza as a boy?

Had Gohan not found Goku, he could have been worse off and evil. He could have tried to kill everyone had he not been raised and taken in by Gohan, Bulma, Rosh, LAunch, Krillin, Yamcha, and the like. Goku was taken in by everyone, given home, food, and love all around.He was every bit as evil at the start as Vegeta but didn't have a choicer about reforming because of brain damage.

Tine was evil and changed with the help of others.

Piccolo was evil incarnate and only became good because a 4 year old boy reached out to him when he was 8 in earth years as opposed to his original self which spent years being corrupted.

Vegeta wasn't even a teenager when he was taken. He was taken, trained to kill and fight for his life, and yes he excelled at it, which was no different than Ten who didn't bat an eye. He took joy in crippling Yamcha when he was beat. He tried to kill without remorse.

All we see is that Vegeta is shown genuine teamwork without a selfish motive and friendship when he meets the Z fighters. They let him go. But you know for a fact he paid them back 10 fold, more than they did him. He let Gohan go when he first sees him on name. HE saves them from Guido repaying his debt. He heals Goku, who didn't heal him before. He saved them versus initial frieze when they are shaking and he steps in. When he's being beat they don't lift a finger and are frozen in fear. He returns to fight Frieza when he has no shot in his mind when frieza comes to earth. He saves Goku from 19. He is the only one in the manga to even help Gohan vs Cell.

Yes he was wrong for going to the extreme at the tourney over his fight that he's been promised for over a decade and no he won't get for seemingly ever. He was no more wrong than Piccolo willingly sacrificing millions when he tells Super buu kill the humans for fun. He still came up with the plan to free everyone from buu, beat him, and revive everything. He didn't' wish memories away either, that was goku, and even that is wish washy with them counting Tarble in canon as the special celebrates the defeat of Buu, making it seem like they replaced fat boys image in peoples head with the midget doing all the evil. He made a fool of himself to not get everyone killed in bog where goku tries to fight beers after being told don't.

Vegeta is no saint, but he's also far from the devil. He is Tommy from MMPR if anything ... and at present day, Vegeta would put his kids, wife, and yes even his friends over his own glory.l Had he cared about that alone, he would have been the one to be a god since he showed the most power. He wouldn't have sung and danced like a clown and he wouldn't have called Goku a better man at Kid. He would fight the battle for everyone else over the fn fun of it like Goku whose pride had blinded him as the series went on and he developed his own ideas of battle
Edited by Kblo247, Jan 3 2015, 01:31 AM.
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TheGmGoken
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he went as far as to come back to life to try and save earth knowing he was going to fail

To fix a problem...that he not only created BUT helped out by KILLING the people in the Tenkaichi Budokai. Just to fight in an one-sided rivalry. And no Vegeta wanted to re-match against Boo. He looked confident and did NOT know he was going to fail again.

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he then went on to become veggeto knowing that it was permanent and pride being thrown away

Only because he had NO CHOICE. It was either Vegetto or losing his soul forever.
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and then tried to help with the spirit bomb

Only because SSJ3 Goku ran out of energy, Vegeta was going to lose his soul, and for his family.

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so thats 3 times in the last part of the saga alone, i also like you u bring up his bad points BEFORE he became
for the most part good, lmao

Okay. He was mostly good at the beginning of the arc correct? Within that very arc he did this.

Turn Majin just to fight Goku
Killed ALOT of people in the Tenkaichi Budokai
Killed more people in the Tenkaichi Budokai
Smacked Gohan
Admit that he turnt Majin on purpose
Say he doesn't give a damn about Trunks and Bulma
Was begging to be the warrior he was before(RUTHLESS Saiyan Arc Vegeta)
Gave Boo energy

Do I need to continue? Should I bring up Cell Arc?

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i dont see how you can hate vegeta, hes just that badass in a every series

He's a whiny b*** in every series.

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Saiyans are 'evil' by nature.

Thanks for proving my point. Many people say Vegeta should get payback on Freeza. Freeza was being evil to another Evil character. So what? Freeza kept Vegeta under control. It's not like Freeza forced him to kill. Vegeta loved it.

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You seem to be suggesting a fight can only be enjoyable if it's a 'good versus evil' battle for the fate of the universe.

Vegeta vs Zarbon(Round 1), Vegeta vs Ginyu, Vegeta vs Rikum, and Vegeta vs 19 are great battles. I ain't suggesting anything. I'm not grading the quality of the fight. I'm questioning fans logic of Vegeta deserves to beat Freeza. Freeza(A prick) was bullying Vegeta(Another prick). If Vegeta was stronger than Freeza. Vegeta would kick Freeza a***. Kill his empire. And just go on a rampage until someone stops him.

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He has history with Freeza and despite the fact that - as you said - he didn't 'deserve' to be the one to beat Freeza the first time, he now does deserve to because he has developed into a good person.

No...he doesn't deserve Freeza. Freeza as much as I love him as a bad guy. Was killed. It will NOT have the same impact if Vegeta beats him now. Vegeta is getting sloppy thirds then. He doesn't deserve Freeza now and never have.

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There's nothing wrong with a redemption story and seeing Vegeta

Vegeta had FOUR redemption stories. How many do this bastard need?

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And this obsession with Vegeta always making things worse...well yeah, he's a saiyan, he wants a fight. Goku is exactly the same - as I've said before - the only difference is that Goku happens to not lose or his actions accidentally turn out for the best.

I've criticize Goku for his mistakes too. Difference being....Vegeta doesn't get hate on for it. But let Goku do something bad. Goku would get hated on within 4 heartbeats. Maybe less.

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Goku let Taopaipai climb Karin's tower because he was confident he wouldn't get strong enough to be a threat again.

Most of that was filler

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Goku let Vegeta live to threaten Earth again because he wanted a rematch.

He did the same for Piccolo. But I see your point there

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Goku let Freeza attain 100% of his power because he wanted to beat him at his best.

Fighting Honour. Saiyans aren't the only ones to do this.

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Goku opted to not find Gero before the 17 and 18 were awakened and mankind was exterminated and just train for an exciting fight instead.

Even Piccolo agreed too. And it's morally wrong to kill Gero because he hasn't done anything evil yet.

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Goku put the whole fate of the universe on his 9 year old son's shoulders despite the fact Gohan didn't want to fight and happily ignored Piccolo's pleas to intervene...he even gave Cell a senzu bean because he wanted Cell to have a fair fight.

Goku HIMSELF regretted this.

Quote:
 
Goku opted to not return to life to be with his family because he wanted to 'protect' the earth from villains who return for revenge on those who defeated them...which they will continue to do when somebody else defeats them anyway, that's just what villains do. He then lost his s*** from the excitement of possibly fighting and training with all the great fighters of Otherworld.

The past 4 villains(Cyborgs, Freeza, Saiyan, and Piccolo Jr) was after Goku. Who knows if Goku has made a repuation in space. If he's dead there's LESS of a chance bad guys will appear. Funny enough. The moment Goku came back to Earth. Majin Boo's gang made their debut.

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Goku opted to ignore Kaioshin and fight Vegeta, letting his energy revive Buu instead of just ssj3ing the fight to an early conclusion.

Goku HAD to fight Vegeta. Vegeta started killing people. Should Goku just ignore that? SSj3 also causes lots of strain. Not only would Goku lose his time on Earth(and not be able to distract Boo) but Vegeta has durablity. Vegeta could had outlasted the beating until Goku reverted.

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Goku decided to let Buu live so that the kids could defend the world this time...despite the fact that Gohan did it last time anyway.

You got a point there.

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Goku runs off with a small child at the end of Z and gives a heartfelt goodbye to all his friends despite the fact he has the shunkan ido and could see them instantly....at any time....whenever he wants.

To be fair. All spin off Dragonball titles hinted that Goku either trained Oob near home(Neko Majin Z) or only trained Oob once a year(DBGT perfect files). It's not like Goku saw his friends alot anyways. Bulma said so herself. You also forgot that instead of Goku visiting them. How about they visit GOKU.

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Goku happens to always win.

Goku hasn't beaten the "Bad" guy of the arc since Freeza.

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his stupid decisions are just as stupid as Vegeta's.

I've already adressed this. Not to mention I ain't refering to their decisions. I'm talking about their personality. Vegeta is a prick. While Goku is naive and means no harm. Compare to Vegeta who does mean harm.

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just anyone but Goku.

It's been awhile since Goku has beaten a bad guy. So why not? He's the FACE of Dragonball.

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If anything I think Vegeta is more suited to beat a villain now than Goku is, Goku still cares too much about a good fight, while Vegeta cares more about protecting Bulma.

Is that why Goku had a vision about his family when Beerus almost killed Earth?

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How can you say vegeta would have grown up to be worse had he not been given to frieza as a boy?

Because it's been told throughout the story that Vegeta is a a***** even by SAIYANS standards. Even Nappa are shocked by his actions at times.

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Piccolo was evil incarnate and only became good because a 4 year old boy reached out to him when he was 8 in earth years as opposed to his original self which spent years being corrupted.

And Piccolo never back to being evil did he? Unlike Vegeta who killed thousands when he became Majin.

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He was taken, trained to kill and fight for his life,

Dub line my friend. He was NEVER taken. He always worked for Freeza. But Saiyans were like that before Freeza. Hell they now do it for missions. Also he only saved Goku, Krillin, and Gohan because he needs them for Freeza.

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Vegeta is no saint, but he's also far from the devil

If Demon King Piccolo is a Demon. Then Vegeta is the devil.

Edited by TheGmGoken, Jan 3 2015, 01:40 AM.
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