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NEW DBZ MOVIE 2015: Fukkatsu no F (Warning: Spoilers in Topic)
Topic Started: Jul 15 2014, 04:56 AM (364,262 Views)
Southern Gothic
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Dilly Dilly

Ssj3vegito96
Mar 1 2015, 11:11 PM
Looks like vegetas legs on that screenshot of goku on the ground. I guess toriyama stuck to his word about making vegeta hero in this one?
I'd really like to think that.

But knowing Goku annd Vegeta, I'm wondering if they fight one at a time. Then Goku goes firstand we see the results in that picture, with Vegeta ending up the same way. Then they fuse or Goku gets a power up. Thats what the pessimistic side of me thinks.
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superperfectnerd
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Ssj3vegito96
Mar 1 2015, 11:11 PM
Looks like vegetas legs on that screenshot of goku on the ground. I guess toriyama stuck to his word about making vegeta hero in this one?
Maybe.

Or maybe it's just his legs and his torso is scattered all over the battle field.
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superperfectnerd
Mar 1 2015, 11:18 PM
Ssj3vegito96
Mar 1 2015, 11:11 PM
Looks like vegetas legs on that screenshot of goku on the ground. I guess toriyama stuck to his word about making vegeta hero in this one?
Maybe.

Or maybe it's just his legs and his torso is scattered all over the battle field.
LOL

It's going to fun seeing the other Z fighters fighting too. Not like in battle of gods where they all just get one shotted and watch for the rest of the movie
IT'S CHEESE
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superperfectnerd
Mar 1 2015, 11:18 PM
Ssj3vegito96
Mar 1 2015, 11:11 PM
Looks like vegetas legs on that screenshot of goku on the ground. I guess toriyama stuck to his word about making vegeta hero in this one?
Maybe.

Or maybe it's just his legs and his torso is scattered all over the battle field.
Don't even joke about that! Vegeta gets the short end of the stick in every movie. :lol:
Edited by Ben, Mar 1 2015, 11:34 PM.
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superperfectnerd
Mar 1 2015, 09:47 PM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 1 2015, 09:37 PM
lazerbem
Mar 1 2015, 06:32 PM
Furthermore, Babidi's minions had their potential unlocked by the Majin Charm, so who knows how strong they were before hand
So you're saying Yakon had a power level lower than Freeza's originally? Man, depending on where you place Yakon, that's gonna be a really huuuuuuuuuuge boost.
Yakon was a monster who lived on a dark planet who had no means of interacting with the rest of the universe until Bobidi sought him out. Whilst his strength is a little annoying it's easy to rationalise why he'd made no impact on the universe at large. If these are standard, Freeza soldiers who have always traversed the universe, then their power being more significant than Freeza himself and perhaps even Boo, doesn't make sense. It might not be that. I'm hoping for a better explanation.
So...? Whether Yakon was well known or not is irrelevant.... The fact is, there are people stronger than Freeza in the universe. These really strong Freeza Soldiers we're seeing weren't part of Freeza's original army because they likely weren't that strong at the time of Freeza's rein, much like the Zetto Senshii weren't all that strong in the middle of Freeza's rein. I mean for crying out loud, Goku went from 416 to 150,000,000 over the course of 1 and a half years. Is it really so unthinkable that many other strong individuals surfaced 17 years after Freeza's demise? I certainly don't think so, the universe is a big place.
EDIT: This right here just about sums up my reaction to all the cynicism in regards to this film:
MagicBox of Kanzenshuu
 
I have such fond memories of the (mostly) cautious optimism and (mostly) innocent excitement as we discovered more about "Battle Of Gods," in which the only in-universe thing people wouldn't shut up about was Gohan's hair. The relentless cynicism on display here with every new promotional image is unbearable. Having to read assumption after assumption, which leads to complaint after complaint, knowing that we have zero context for how any of this relates to the movie, is beyond taxing. I notice it's coming from (mostly) new members. It's toxic, it's killing the conversation, and I'm astounded that these people aren't self-aware of the destruction they're causing.


Blade of Kanzenshuu
 
Freeza having grunts who actually pose some kind of a threat is an amusing (and welcome!) concept.


Agreed. We know nothing about the grunts, their power, what Sorbet's ring does, etc. There's nothing that says these guys aren't allowed to pose a threat. It's yet another instance of people dismissing a new concept just because the original series didn't have it. Formidable grunts. What a concept! What, did you guys just want to see the side characters effortlessly knocking them aside for 90 minutes? Wouldn't a more challenging fight be more entertaining? If all of this is handled well, then it'll provide an even greater payoff when Kuririn, Tenshinhan, and Piccolo (hopefully) beat them. I'm intrigued by this revelation. Maybe I won't enjoy it once I see the finished film, but I haven't seen the finished film so I can't jump to conclusions yet.

All I hope is that Kuririn and Tenshinhan win. They haven't gotten a real win since the Saibaimen. They deserve it. This movie seems to be giving them *real* fights, which is going to be so much fun to watch if everything is tastefully done. I'm going to be very sad if Yamcha and Chaozu (the ones who REALLY deserve a win) aren't in on the action.

jjgp1112 of Kanzenshuu
 
Preach! I just find it strange how fans of a series where a scientist was able to create beings stronger than the legendary Super Saiyan with simple earth technology are suddenly finding so many things to draw the line at. It's symptomatic of a stuck in the mud fanbase resistant to anything that will make them have to rethink elements of the story. It's like, do you guys want an interesting story or a 90 minute, masturbatory squash fest that preserves your lists?

I know the common defense will be that it's the fault of the writers bringing an old villain back in the first place, but judging from the landscape of this thread for the past 100 pages, I think a new villian would draw plenty of complaints too, simply for disrupting the mythology even further by introducing more characters who have been lurking in obscurity that put all of the stuff we've seen in the series to shame. Look at all of the heat Beerus catches for being so much stronger than everybody else before him.
Edited by ThePrinceOfSaiyans, Mar 1 2015, 11:46 PM.
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ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 1 2015, 11:39 PM
superperfectnerd
Mar 1 2015, 09:47 PM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 1 2015, 09:37 PM
lazerbem
Mar 1 2015, 06:32 PM
Furthermore, Babidi's minions had their potential unlocked by the Majin Charm, so who knows how strong they were before hand
So you're saying Yakon had a power level lower than Freeza's originally? Man, depending on where you place Yakon, that's gonna be a really huuuuuuuuuuge boost.
Yakon was a monster who lived on a dark planet who had no means of interacting with the rest of the universe until Bobidi sought him out. Whilst his strength is a little annoying it's easy to rationalise why he'd made no impact on the universe at large. If these are standard, Freeza soldiers who have always traversed the universe, then their power being more significant than Freeza himself and perhaps even Boo, doesn't make sense. It might not be that. I'm hoping for a better explanation.
So...? Whether Yakon was well known or not is irrelevant.... The fact is, there are people stronger than Freeza in the universe. These really strong Freeza Soldiers we're seeing weren't part of Freeza's original army because they likely weren't that strong at the time of Freeza's rein, much like the Zetto Senshii weren't all that strong in the middle of Freeza's rein. I mean for crying out loud, Goku went from 416 to 150,000,000 over the course of 1 and a half years. Is it really so unthinkable that many other strong individuals surfaced 17 years after Freeza's demise? I certainly don't think so, the universe is a big place.
It is unthinkable if it undermines the story and the characters so far.

Freeza was in power for a long time. Why didn't these strong characters surface in the 17 years prior? Or the 17 years before that? Or the 17 years before that? I hate random coincidence. It just so happens that all the strongest fighters who make original Freeza into a joke just happen to be surfacing at the same time from different corners of the universe? That is unfathomably unlikely. The point is the saiyans were a special case and everything that happened to Goku and Vegeta unlocked a great power exclusive to the saiyans and it took a long time and a lot of effort and just the right series of events. The opponents who appear after that are as strong as they are because they are linked to the Earth where the strongest warriors happen to be. A threat like Cell exists because of Goku and Vegeta and Goku and Vegeta got stronger because of a threat like Cell - it all links together. Random grunts don't have the connection or the majesty of Gods and Majin Boo. If they suddenly appear and knock out Mystic Gohan - not saying it will definitely happen but it might - then the movie is not obeying the laws that were already set out in that universe. To successfully suspend your disbelief you have to stay within the rules set out in the first place and the implied logic. If it turns out that Goku has increased his power 1000 fold in this movie by doing one push up a day - the audience will go "well that makes no f***ing sense" and it's the same principal here.

I'm hoping this isn't the case and there will be a better reason but are you telling me that if these guys turn out to be Dodoria level guys who trained for 4 months and surpassed Majin Boo (for Christ's sake), that won't at least niggle you a little? It won't seem like lazy story telling?
Edited by superperfectnerd, Mar 2 2015, 12:01 AM.
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superperfectnerd
Mar 1 2015, 11:55 PM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 1 2015, 11:39 PM
superperfectnerd
Mar 1 2015, 09:47 PM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 1 2015, 09:37 PM
lazerbem
Mar 1 2015, 06:32 PM
Furthermore, Babidi's minions had their potential unlocked by the Majin Charm, so who knows how strong they were before hand
So you're saying Yakon had a power level lower than Freeza's originally? Man, depending on where you place Yakon, that's gonna be a really huuuuuuuuuuge boost.
Yakon was a monster who lived on a dark planet who had no means of interacting with the rest of the universe until Bobidi sought him out. Whilst his strength is a little annoying it's easy to rationalise why he'd made no impact on the universe at large. If these are standard, Freeza soldiers who have always traversed the universe, then their power being more significant than Freeza himself and perhaps even Boo, doesn't make sense. It might not be that. I'm hoping for a better explanation.
So...? Whether Yakon was well known or not is irrelevant.... The fact is, there are people stronger than Freeza in the universe. These really strong Freeza Soldiers we're seeing weren't part of Freeza's original army because they likely weren't that strong at the time of Freeza's rein, much like the Zetto Senshii weren't all that strong in the middle of Freeza's rein. I mean for crying out loud, Goku went from 416 to 150,000,000 over the course of 1 and a half years. Is it really so unthinkable that many other strong individuals surfaced 17 years after Freeza's demise? I certainly don't think so, the universe is a big place.
It is unthinkable if it undermines the story and the characters so far.
I'm gonna have to stop you right there, because none of this undermines the narrative based on what we actually know. Honestly, it boggles my mind how upset people have become at a situation we have no context for, yet are completely okay with Earth-made cyborgs being stronger than the legendary-f***ing-super-Saiyajin. Look, if the movie turns out bad, by all means, criticize it, but we don't have all the information. And like people have already pointed out, it's not like Freeza(or the Zetto Senshii for that matter) hasn't been surpassed under equally absurd(if not more so) circumstances. *cough* Artificial Humans *cough*.
superperfectnerd
 
I'm hoping this isn't the case and there will be a better reason but are you telling me that if these guys turn out to be Dodoria level guys who trained for 4 months and surpassed Majin Boo (for Christ's sake), that won't at least niggle you a little? It won't seem like lazy story telling?

What? I'm not expecting any of Freeza's remnants to surpass Boo in 4 months. I'm expecting Freeza to recruit new, stronger members.
Edited by ThePrinceOfSaiyans, Mar 2 2015, 12:07 AM.
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ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 2 2015, 12:01 AM
superperfectnerd
Mar 1 2015, 11:55 PM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 1 2015, 11:39 PM
superperfectnerd
Mar 1 2015, 09:47 PM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 1 2015, 09:37 PM
lazerbem
Mar 1 2015, 06:32 PM
Furthermore, Babidi's minions had their potential unlocked by the Majin Charm, so who knows how strong they were before hand
So you're saying Yakon had a power level lower than Freeza's originally? Man, depending on where you place Yakon, that's gonna be a really huuuuuuuuuuge boost.
Yakon was a monster who lived on a dark planet who had no means of interacting with the rest of the universe until Bobidi sought him out. Whilst his strength is a little annoying it's easy to rationalise why he'd made no impact on the universe at large. If these are standard, Freeza soldiers who have always traversed the universe, then their power being more significant than Freeza himself and perhaps even Boo, doesn't make sense. It might not be that. I'm hoping for a better explanation.
So...? Whether Yakon was well known or not is irrelevant.... The fact is, there are people stronger than Freeza in the universe. These really strong Freeza Soldiers we're seeing weren't part of Freeza's original army because they likely weren't that strong at the time of Freeza's rein, much like the Zetto Senshii weren't all that strong in the middle of Freeza's rein. I mean for crying out loud, Goku went from 416 to 150,000,000 over the course of 1 and a half years. Is it really so unthinkable that many other strong individuals surfaced 17 years after Freeza's demise? I certainly don't think so, the universe is a big place.
It is unthinkable if it undermines the story and the characters so far.
I'm gonna have to stop you right there, because none of this undermines the narrative based on what we actually know. Honestly, it boggles my mind how upset people have become at a situation we have no context for, yet are completely okay with Earth-made cyborgs being stronger than the legendary-f***ing-super-Saiyajin. Look, if the movie turns out bad, by all means, criticize it, but we don't have all the information. And like people have already pointed out, it's not like Freeza(or the Zetto Senshii for that matter) hasn't been surpassed under equally absurd(if not more so) circumstances. *cough* Artificial Humans *cough*.
Artificial humans were created by a man who collected data from the strongest (at least potentially) fighters in the universe and used that information to learn about ki and how to tap into its power. Gero didn't just use the genetic information to create Cell, he observed it in order to understand how to create powerful beings that could rival saiyans, namekians and whatever the hell Freeza is. Plus, humans being so weak would mean more reason to invest in such technology. Freeza would have no need for androids. That's a possible explanation for that one...bit of a stretch I admit.

You're misunderstanding these complaints, they are 'if' complaints. If a random guy casually takes on Gohan then, come on, that is laughable. If it happens for some unknown yet reason then fine.
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superperfectnerd
Mar 2 2015, 12:09 AM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 2 2015, 12:01 AM
superperfectnerd
Mar 1 2015, 11:55 PM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 1 2015, 11:39 PM
superperfectnerd
Mar 1 2015, 09:47 PM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 1 2015, 09:37 PM
lazerbem
Mar 1 2015, 06:32 PM
Furthermore, Babidi's minions had their potential unlocked by the Majin Charm, so who knows how strong they were before hand
So you're saying Yakon had a power level lower than Freeza's originally? Man, depending on where you place Yakon, that's gonna be a really huuuuuuuuuuge boost.
Yakon was a monster who lived on a dark planet who had no means of interacting with the rest of the universe until Bobidi sought him out. Whilst his strength is a little annoying it's easy to rationalise why he'd made no impact on the universe at large. If these are standard, Freeza soldiers who have always traversed the universe, then their power being more significant than Freeza himself and perhaps even Boo, doesn't make sense. It might not be that. I'm hoping for a better explanation.
So...? Whether Yakon was well known or not is irrelevant.... The fact is, there are people stronger than Freeza in the universe. These really strong Freeza Soldiers we're seeing weren't part of Freeza's original army because they likely weren't that strong at the time of Freeza's rein, much like the Zetto Senshii weren't all that strong in the middle of Freeza's rein. I mean for crying out loud, Goku went from 416 to 150,000,000 over the course of 1 and a half years. Is it really so unthinkable that many other strong individuals surfaced 17 years after Freeza's demise? I certainly don't think so, the universe is a big place.
It is unthinkable if it undermines the story and the characters so far.
I'm gonna have to stop you right there, because none of this undermines the narrative based on what we actually know. Honestly, it boggles my mind how upset people have become at a situation we have no context for, yet are completely okay with Earth-made cyborgs being stronger than the legendary-f***ing-super-Saiyajin. Look, if the movie turns out bad, by all means, criticize it, but we don't have all the information. And like people have already pointed out, it's not like Freeza(or the Zetto Senshii for that matter) hasn't been surpassed under equally absurd(if not more so) circumstances. *cough* Artificial Humans *cough*.
Artificial humans were created by a man who collected data from the strongest (at least potentially) fighters in the universe and used that information to learn about ki and how to tap into its power. Gero didn't just use the genetic information to create Cell, he observed it in order to understand how to create powerful beings that could rival saiyans, namekians and whatever the hell Freeza is. Plus, humans being so weak would mean more reason to invest in such technology. Freeza would have no need for androids. That's a possible explanation for that one...bit of a stretch I admit.

You're misunderstanding these complaints, they are 'if' complaints. If a random guy casually takes on Gohan then, come on, that is laughable. If it happens for some unknown yet reason then fine.
That explanation works for Cell, not the Artificial Humans, as their DNA wasn't used to create them. They are cyborgs crafted using Earthly technology to create something that far exceeds the emperor of the universe and Super Saiyajin. To make matters even more ridiculous, Freeza was converted into a cyborg using space-age technology, and yet he barely exceeded his previous self. To put that into perspective.
Earthling + Earthly machinery = Much stronger than Freeza and Super Saiyajin.
Freeza + Space-age tech = Slightly stronger
I mean come on....
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ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 2 2015, 12:14 AM
superperfectnerd
Mar 2 2015, 12:09 AM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 2 2015, 12:01 AM
superperfectnerd
Mar 1 2015, 11:55 PM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 1 2015, 11:39 PM
superperfectnerd
Mar 1 2015, 09:47 PM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 1 2015, 09:37 PM
lazerbem
Mar 1 2015, 06:32 PM
Furthermore, Babidi's minions had their potential unlocked by the Majin Charm, so who knows how strong they were before hand
So you're saying Yakon had a power level lower than Freeza's originally? Man, depending on where you place Yakon, that's gonna be a really huuuuuuuuuuge boost.
Yakon was a monster who lived on a dark planet who had no means of interacting with the rest of the universe until Bobidi sought him out. Whilst his strength is a little annoying it's easy to rationalise why he'd made no impact on the universe at large. If these are standard, Freeza soldiers who have always traversed the universe, then their power being more significant than Freeza himself and perhaps even Boo, doesn't make sense. It might not be that. I'm hoping for a better explanation.
So...? Whether Yakon was well known or not is irrelevant.... The fact is, there are people stronger than Freeza in the universe. These really strong Freeza Soldiers we're seeing weren't part of Freeza's original army because they likely weren't that strong at the time of Freeza's rein, much like the Zetto Senshii weren't all that strong in the middle of Freeza's rein. I mean for crying out loud, Goku went from 416 to 150,000,000 over the course of 1 and a half years. Is it really so unthinkable that many other strong individuals surfaced 17 years after Freeza's demise? I certainly don't think so, the universe is a big place.
It is unthinkable if it undermines the story and the characters so far.
I'm gonna have to stop you right there, because none of this undermines the narrative based on what we actually know. Honestly, it boggles my mind how upset people have become at a situation we have no context for, yet are completely okay with Earth-made cyborgs being stronger than the legendary-f***ing-super-Saiyajin. Look, if the movie turns out bad, by all means, criticize it, but we don't have all the information. And like people have already pointed out, it's not like Freeza(or the Zetto Senshii for that matter) hasn't been surpassed under equally absurd(if not more so) circumstances. *cough* Artificial Humans *cough*.
Artificial humans were created by a man who collected data from the strongest (at least potentially) fighters in the universe and used that information to learn about ki and how to tap into its power. Gero didn't just use the genetic information to create Cell, he observed it in order to understand how to create powerful beings that could rival saiyans, namekians and whatever the hell Freeza is. Plus, humans being so weak would mean more reason to invest in such technology. Freeza would have no need for androids. That's a possible explanation for that one...bit of a stretch I admit.

You're misunderstanding these complaints, they are 'if' complaints. If a random guy casually takes on Gohan then, come on, that is laughable. If it happens for some unknown yet reason then fine.
That explanation works for Cell, not the Artificial Humans, as their DNA wasn't used to create them. They are cyborgs crafted using Earthly technology to create something that far exceeds the emperor of the universe and Super Saiyajin. To make matters even more ridiculous, Freeza was converted into a cyborg using space-age technology, and yet he barely exceeded his previous self. To put that into perspective.
Earthling + Earthly machinery = Much stronger than Freeza and Super Saiyajin.
Freeza + Space-age tech = Slightly stronger
I mean come on....
I explained my theory. It's not about the materials or even the humans that Gero started with. It's about what he learnt from examining the cells of Goku, Vegeta, Piccolo and Freeza. This taught him about the origins of ki and how to manipulate it to some extent when creating his machines.

You could also argue that humans have greater potential for intelligence than most species but are just much younger than most so you just get stand outs like Gero and Bulma.
Edited by superperfectnerd, Mar 2 2015, 12:22 AM.
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i don't mind stronger fighters coming but at least add some variety to it

Do none of these aliens possess abilities other than kicking punching and ki blasts?
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superperfectnerd
Mar 2 2015, 12:19 AM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 2 2015, 12:14 AM
superperfectnerd
Mar 2 2015, 12:09 AM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 2 2015, 12:01 AM
superperfectnerd
Mar 1 2015, 11:55 PM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 1 2015, 11:39 PM
superperfectnerd
Mar 1 2015, 09:47 PM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 1 2015, 09:37 PM
lazerbem
Mar 1 2015, 06:32 PM
Furthermore, Babidi's minions had their potential unlocked by the Majin Charm, so who knows how strong they were before hand
So you're saying Yakon had a power level lower than Freeza's originally? Man, depending on where you place Yakon, that's gonna be a really huuuuuuuuuuge boost.
Yakon was a monster who lived on a dark planet who had no means of interacting with the rest of the universe until Bobidi sought him out. Whilst his strength is a little annoying it's easy to rationalise why he'd made no impact on the universe at large. If these are standard, Freeza soldiers who have always traversed the universe, then their power being more significant than Freeza himself and perhaps even Boo, doesn't make sense. It might not be that. I'm hoping for a better explanation.
So...? Whether Yakon was well known or not is irrelevant.... The fact is, there are people stronger than Freeza in the universe. These really strong Freeza Soldiers we're seeing weren't part of Freeza's original army because they likely weren't that strong at the time of Freeza's rein, much like the Zetto Senshii weren't all that strong in the middle of Freeza's rein. I mean for crying out loud, Goku went from 416 to 150,000,000 over the course of 1 and a half years. Is it really so unthinkable that many other strong individuals surfaced 17 years after Freeza's demise? I certainly don't think so, the universe is a big place.
It is unthinkable if it undermines the story and the characters so far.
I'm gonna have to stop you right there, because none of this undermines the narrative based on what we actually know. Honestly, it boggles my mind how upset people have become at a situation we have no context for, yet are completely okay with Earth-made cyborgs being stronger than the legendary-f***ing-super-Saiyajin. Look, if the movie turns out bad, by all means, criticize it, but we don't have all the information. And like people have already pointed out, it's not like Freeza(or the Zetto Senshii for that matter) hasn't been surpassed under equally absurd(if not more so) circumstances. *cough* Artificial Humans *cough*.
Artificial humans were created by a man who collected data from the strongest (at least potentially) fighters in the universe and used that information to learn about ki and how to tap into its power. Gero didn't just use the genetic information to create Cell, he observed it in order to understand how to create powerful beings that could rival saiyans, namekians and whatever the hell Freeza is. Plus, humans being so weak would mean more reason to invest in such technology. Freeza would have no need for androids. That's a possible explanation for that one...bit of a stretch I admit.

You're misunderstanding these complaints, they are 'if' complaints. If a random guy casually takes on Gohan then, come on, that is laughable. If it happens for some unknown yet reason then fine.
That explanation works for Cell, not the Artificial Humans, as their DNA wasn't used to create them. They are cyborgs crafted using Earthly technology to create something that far exceeds the emperor of the universe and Super Saiyajin. To make matters even more ridiculous, Freeza was converted into a cyborg using space-age technology, and yet he barely exceeded his previous self. To put that into perspective.
Earthling + Earthly machinery = Much stronger than Freeza and Super Saiyajin.
Freeza + Space-age tech = Slightly stronger
I mean come on....
I explained my theory. It's not about the materials or even the humans that Gero started with. It's about what he learnt from examining the cells of Goku, Vegeta, Piccolo and Freeza. This taught him about the origins of ki and how to manipulate it to some extent when creating his machines.
So Gero's relatively limited information and technology is somehow comparable to the PTO's array of information, technology, and scientists? I don't think I have to tell you how ridiculous that is.
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ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 2 2015, 12:24 AM
superperfectnerd
Mar 2 2015, 12:19 AM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 2 2015, 12:14 AM
superperfectnerd
Mar 2 2015, 12:09 AM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 2 2015, 12:01 AM
superperfectnerd
Mar 1 2015, 11:55 PM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 1 2015, 11:39 PM
superperfectnerd
Mar 1 2015, 09:47 PM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Mar 1 2015, 09:37 PM
lazerbem
Mar 1 2015, 06:32 PM
Furthermore, Babidi's minions had their potential unlocked by the Majin Charm, so who knows how strong they were before hand
So you're saying Yakon had a power level lower than Freeza's originally? Man, depending on where you place Yakon, that's gonna be a really huuuuuuuuuuge boost.
Yakon was a monster who lived on a dark planet who had no means of interacting with the rest of the universe until Bobidi sought him out. Whilst his strength is a little annoying it's easy to rationalise why he'd made no impact on the universe at large. If these are standard, Freeza soldiers who have always traversed the universe, then their power being more significant than Freeza himself and perhaps even Boo, doesn't make sense. It might not be that. I'm hoping for a better explanation.
So...? Whether Yakon was well known or not is irrelevant.... The fact is, there are people stronger than Freeza in the universe. These really strong Freeza Soldiers we're seeing weren't part of Freeza's original army because they likely weren't that strong at the time of Freeza's rein, much like the Zetto Senshii weren't all that strong in the middle of Freeza's rein. I mean for crying out loud, Goku went from 416 to 150,000,000 over the course of 1 and a half years. Is it really so unthinkable that many other strong individuals surfaced 17 years after Freeza's demise? I certainly don't think so, the universe is a big place.
It is unthinkable if it undermines the story and the characters so far.
I'm gonna have to stop you right there, because none of this undermines the narrative based on what we actually know. Honestly, it boggles my mind how upset people have become at a situation we have no context for, yet are completely okay with Earth-made cyborgs being stronger than the legendary-f***ing-super-Saiyajin. Look, if the movie turns out bad, by all means, criticize it, but we don't have all the information. And like people have already pointed out, it's not like Freeza(or the Zetto Senshii for that matter) hasn't been surpassed under equally absurd(if not more so) circumstances. *cough* Artificial Humans *cough*.
Artificial humans were created by a man who collected data from the strongest (at least potentially) fighters in the universe and used that information to learn about ki and how to tap into its power. Gero didn't just use the genetic information to create Cell, he observed it in order to understand how to create powerful beings that could rival saiyans, namekians and whatever the hell Freeza is. Plus, humans being so weak would mean more reason to invest in such technology. Freeza would have no need for androids. That's a possible explanation for that one...bit of a stretch I admit.

You're misunderstanding these complaints, they are 'if' complaints. If a random guy casually takes on Gohan then, come on, that is laughable. If it happens for some unknown yet reason then fine.
That explanation works for Cell, not the Artificial Humans, as their DNA wasn't used to create them. They are cyborgs crafted using Earthly technology to create something that far exceeds the emperor of the universe and Super Saiyajin. To make matters even more ridiculous, Freeza was converted into a cyborg using space-age technology, and yet he barely exceeded his previous self. To put that into perspective.
Earthling + Earthly machinery = Much stronger than Freeza and Super Saiyajin.
Freeza + Space-age tech = Slightly stronger
I mean come on....
I explained my theory. It's not about the materials or even the humans that Gero started with. It's about what he learnt from examining the cells of Goku, Vegeta, Piccolo and Freeza. This taught him about the origins of ki and how to manipulate it to some extent when creating his machines.
So Gero's relatively limited information and technology is somehow comparable to the PTO's array of information, technology, and scientists? I don't think I have to tell you how ridiculous that is.
The PTO weren't trying to overpower somebody way above them. They had Freeza and The Ginyu Force. They had no reason to build androids as far as they could see.

Even if you do step back and look at some of the more hard to believe elements of DragonBall, that doesn't mean I'm fine with more equally illogical things cropping up. I'd like it to better explain itself in the future.
Edited by superperfectnerd, Mar 2 2015, 12:28 AM.
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Mar 2 2015, 12:25 AM
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Mar 2 2015, 12:24 AM
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Yakon was a monster who lived on a dark planet who had no means of interacting with the rest of the universe until Bobidi sought him out. Whilst his strength is a little annoying it's easy to rationalise why he'd made no impact on the universe at large. If these are standard, Freeza soldiers who have always traversed the universe, then their power being more significant than Freeza himself and perhaps even Boo, doesn't make sense. It might not be that. I'm hoping for a better explanation.
So...? Whether Yakon was well known or not is irrelevant.... The fact is, there are people stronger than Freeza in the universe. These really strong Freeza Soldiers we're seeing weren't part of Freeza's original army because they likely weren't that strong at the time of Freeza's rein, much like the Zetto Senshii weren't all that strong in the middle of Freeza's rein. I mean for crying out loud, Goku went from 416 to 150,000,000 over the course of 1 and a half years. Is it really so unthinkable that many other strong individuals surfaced 17 years after Freeza's demise? I certainly don't think so, the universe is a big place.
It is unthinkable if it undermines the story and the characters so far.
I'm gonna have to stop you right there, because none of this undermines the narrative based on what we actually know. Honestly, it boggles my mind how upset people have become at a situation we have no context for, yet are completely okay with Earth-made cyborgs being stronger than the legendary-f***ing-super-Saiyajin. Look, if the movie turns out bad, by all means, criticize it, but we don't have all the information. And like people have already pointed out, it's not like Freeza(or the Zetto Senshii for that matter) hasn't been surpassed under equally absurd(if not more so) circumstances. *cough* Artificial Humans *cough*.
Artificial humans were created by a man who collected data from the strongest (at least potentially) fighters in the universe and used that information to learn about ki and how to tap into its power. Gero didn't just use the genetic information to create Cell, he observed it in order to understand how to create powerful beings that could rival saiyans, namekians and whatever the hell Freeza is. Plus, humans being so weak would mean more reason to invest in such technology. Freeza would have no need for androids. That's a possible explanation for that one...bit of a stretch I admit.

You're misunderstanding these complaints, they are 'if' complaints. If a random guy casually takes on Gohan then, come on, that is laughable. If it happens for some unknown yet reason then fine.
That explanation works for Cell, not the Artificial Humans, as their DNA wasn't used to create them. They are cyborgs crafted using Earthly technology to create something that far exceeds the emperor of the universe and Super Saiyajin. To make matters even more ridiculous, Freeza was converted into a cyborg using space-age technology, and yet he barely exceeded his previous self. To put that into perspective.
Earthling + Earthly machinery = Much stronger than Freeza and Super Saiyajin.
Freeza + Space-age tech = Slightly stronger
I mean come on....
I explained my theory. It's not about the materials or even the humans that Gero started with. It's about what he learnt from examining the cells of Goku, Vegeta, Piccolo and Freeza. This taught him about the origins of ki and how to manipulate it to some extent when creating his machines.
So Gero's relatively limited information and technology is somehow comparable to the PTO's array of information, technology, and scientists? I don't think I have to tell you how ridiculous that is.
The PTO weren't trying to overpower somebody way above them. They had Freeza and The Ginyu Force. They had no reason to build androids as far as they could see.
This isn't about building androids. It's about being unable to produce technology to push Freeza far beyond what he was originally capable of where Gero could. This is straying from my original point though. If some Earthling scientist could create artificial beings surpassing the strongest beings in the universe, I don't see why a few individuals couldn't have gotten super strong, then end up being recruited by Freeza. The Zetto Senshii and Freeza can't be the only super powerful beings in the universe. That in and of itself is dumb.
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Freeza's men don't have to be up there with Majin Boo do they? Not all of them.

We don't know wjat happened to Gohan. He might have taken a shot at Freeza. Maybe one guy comes close to his level, but even then he only needs to be close to get in a good cheap shot. Like, maybe he tanks a blast to save Videl like he did for Vegeta.

Next in line is Piccolo. He shouldn't be much stronger than his Cell Games self. Then the rest of the Z Fighters. The way I see it, Freeza needs only a single guy to rival Gohan and also deal with Piccolo.The rest of his PTO guys just need to rival Krillin, and that isnt even close to final form Freeza.

I can handle one henchman being that strong. The universe is a big place.
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