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Why do people keep on labeling gropers as rapists?
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Topic Started: Nov 13 2014, 02:48 AM (2,187 Views)
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Daemon Keido
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Nov 15 2014, 02:15 AM
Post #46
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I don't see how celebrity's and their job choices matter here in this conversation. Have I touched somebody inappropriately when I was younger? Hells, probably. My memory isn't as good as I would like it to be. But I do know this: When I was asked to stop, I STOPPED.
The thing you can't seem to understand is that we are talking about the ones that DIDN'T STOP. THOSE are the ones being charged with molestation, harassment and assault. THOSE are the ones being charged, not every schoolkid as you make it sound.
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+ Pelador
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Nov 15 2014, 02:15 AM
Post #47
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Crazy Awesome Legend
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I don't know about you but I didn't do any inappropriate touching as a teenager. Like a lot of us here, I knew it was wrong. Sounds like you didn't, which is a bit worrying. @SSJSC.
Edited by Pelador, Nov 15 2014, 02:16 AM.
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* Yu Narukami
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Nov 15 2014, 02:18 AM
Post #48
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Izanagi!
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- SSJSC
- Nov 15 2014, 02:11 AM
- Nagito Komaeda
- Nov 15 2014, 02:07 AM
- SSJSC
- Nov 15 2014, 02:06 AM
- Nagito Komaeda
- Nov 15 2014, 02:05 AM
- SSJSC
- Nov 15 2014, 02:02 AM
- Nagito Komaeda
- Nov 15 2014, 02:01 AM
- SSJSC
- Nov 15 2014, 01:59 AM
- Daemon_Rising
- Nov 15 2014, 01:54 AM
- SSJSC
- Nov 15 2014, 01:41 AM
@Daemon_Rising, one more time, they should get punished, but not punished to the point where it's an adult type of punishment.
If what they have done warrants a stiff enough punishment, I see no reason why they shouldn't. Sexual harrassment/molestation/assault are all very serious crimes. They DESERVE a very serious punishment. Is it any fair for the victims if the perpetrators do not receive the full amount of punishment owed for breaking such obvious common-sense laws?
Butt-smacking is not a violent crime. It's just a creepy crime that disturbs other people's privacy. Not everyone re-offends out there.
Slapping someone's posterior is sexual assault. Sexual assault is the touching of an individual in a sexual manner without consent.
You think a 13 year old would have as much self control as a 19 year old would? Answer that question and you win me in this argument.
Yes, a 13 year old should know that it's wrong. If they don't, then there's obviously some sort of issue, either with the person themselves or how they've been taught.
And 12 year olds should know too?
Yes, they should know that it's wrong.
Lol, so that means that every inappropriate touching you did as a teenager should get you punished even now then even though you have more self control and you're more mature now and you haven't touched anybody inappropriately since then. Seriously, you can't tell the difference between a kid and an adult. You're the same guy who said Andrew Garfield is a perfect Spider-man cast right? You know, the age of criminal responsibility in England and Wales is 10. That means that anyone who is 10 or older is expected to know right from wrong, and is able to be held responsible for their own actions. You're painting a picture of teenagers who have no sense of self-control whatsoever. So, if that's the case, why isn't the Criminal Justice System here flooded with cases about it? Seems to me that teenagers generally have enough self-control to not grope somebody just because they want to.
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SSJSC
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Nov 15 2014, 02:18 AM
Post #49
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- Daemon_Rising
- Nov 15 2014, 02:15 AM
I don't see how celebrity's and their job choices matter here in this conversation. Have I touched somebody inappropriately when I was younger? Hells, probably. My memory isn't as good as I would like it to be. But I do know this: When I was asked to stop, I STOPPED.
The thing you can't seem to understand is that we are talking about the ones that DIDN'T STOP. THOSE are the ones being charged with molestation, harassment and assault. THOSE are the ones being charged, not every schoolkid as you make it sound. You're referring to someone who touched somebody more than once when they are told to stop or committed the crime more than once?
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Daemon Keido
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Nov 15 2014, 02:25 AM
Post #50
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Both, if you want your question answered to the best of my ability. Once you touch someone after they have asked you not to, you have committed the crime. But answer me this:
Suppose you are the one being touched. Suppose the person doing it is at least 16 years old, for the sake of your own arguement. Suppose you tell them to stop. And then they continue regardless of your wishes. What do you do? If you use violence against them, you have escalated it beyond neccessity, which will invariably leave you on the wrong side of a court docket. If you do nothing, they will simply continue. Your only fair, logical and lawful course of action is to involve the police.
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SSJSC
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Nov 15 2014, 02:29 AM
Post #51
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- Daemon_Rising
- Nov 15 2014, 02:25 AM
Both, if you want your question answered to the best of my ability. Once you touch someone after they have asked you not to, you have committed the crime. But answer me this:
Suppose you are the one being touched. Suppose the person doing it is at least 16 years old, for the sake of your own arguement. Suppose you tell them to stop. And then they continue regardless of your wishes. What do you do? If you use violence against them, you have escalated it beyond neccessity, which will invariably leave you on the wrong side of a court docket. If you do nothing, they will simply continue. Your only fair, logical and lawful course of action is to involve the police. I would tell the 16 year old to stop touching people if they were told to stop touching them. I would also tell them that continuous touching of a person after they're told to stop is a crime. It's against the law. I would have an adult who isn't a law enforcement warn him about it first. But if I just told him that it is a crime off the bat, that should be enough to get him to stop and remember to never do it again.
So this is my point, some teens don't understand it's a crime. You got to tell it to them so they learn to not commit the crime.
Edited by SSJSC, Nov 15 2014, 02:29 AM.
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* Yu Narukami
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Nov 15 2014, 02:32 AM
Post #52
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Izanagi!
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- SSJSC
- Nov 15 2014, 02:29 AM
- Daemon_Rising
- Nov 15 2014, 02:25 AM
Both, if you want your question answered to the best of my ability. Once you touch someone after they have asked you not to, you have committed the crime. But answer me this:
Suppose you are the one being touched. Suppose the person doing it is at least 16 years old, for the sake of your own arguement. Suppose you tell them to stop. And then they continue regardless of your wishes. What do you do? If you use violence against them, you have escalated it beyond neccessity, which will invariably leave you on the wrong side of a court docket. If you do nothing, they will simply continue. Your only fair, logical and lawful course of action is to involve the police.
I would tell the 16 year old to stop touching people if they were told to stop touching them. I would also tell them that continuous touching of a person after they're told to stop is a crime. It's against the law. I would have an adult who isn't a law enforcement warn him about it first. But if I just told him that it is a crime off the bat, that should be enough to get him to stop and remember to never do it again. So this is my point, some teens don't understand it's a crime. You got to tell it to them so they learn to not commit the crime. I don't know about anywhere else, but where I live, it's made pretty clear that groping is wrong. Teachers and Parents teach you that groping is inappropriate and wrong, so you'd probably be hard-pressed to find a 16 year old who isn't aware of that fact.
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Daemon Keido
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Nov 15 2014, 02:35 AM
Post #53
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Warmaster of Chaos
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Indeed, the only ones not aware of this fact are the ones that keep doing it. They have long since justified their actions like you did earlier: It is a victimless crime, why worry one's head over such trivial matters when murderers are abound?
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A Shadow is merely Darkness in the presence of Light

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SSJSC
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Nov 15 2014, 02:36 AM
Post #54
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- Nov 15 2014, 02:32 AM
- SSJSC
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- Daemon_Rising
- Nov 15 2014, 02:25 AM
Both, if you want your question answered to the best of my ability. Once you touch someone after they have asked you not to, you have committed the crime. But answer me this:
Suppose you are the one being touched. Suppose the person doing it is at least 16 years old, for the sake of your own arguement. Suppose you tell them to stop. And then they continue regardless of your wishes. What do you do? If you use violence against them, you have escalated it beyond neccessity, which will invariably leave you on the wrong side of a court docket. If you do nothing, they will simply continue. Your only fair, logical and lawful course of action is to involve the police.
I would tell the 16 year old to stop touching people if they were told to stop touching them. I would also tell them that continuous touching of a person after they're told to stop is a crime. It's against the law. I would have an adult who isn't a law enforcement warn him about it first. But if I just told him that it is a crime off the bat, that should be enough to get him to stop and remember to never do it again. So this is my point, some teens don't understand it's a crime. You got to tell it to them so they learn to not commit the crime.
I don't know about anywhere else, but where I live, it's made pretty clear that groping is wrong. Teachers and Parents teach you that groping is inappropriate and wrong, so you'd probably be hard-pressed to find a 16 year old who isn't aware of that fact. You can't do anything about that. It's better to learn sooner than later or never. Some people's minds process slowly than others, so give them a chance. But yeah, I do agree that if someone doesn't stop touching you once you told him or her to stop, make sure you report it to an adult who can discipline him or her seriously. And if they still don't listen, get the law enforcement involved.
Edited by SSJSC, Nov 15 2014, 02:37 AM.
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* Yu Narukami
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Nov 15 2014, 02:42 AM
Post #55
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Izanagi!
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- SSJSC
- Nov 15 2014, 02:36 AM
- Nagito Komaeda
- Nov 15 2014, 02:32 AM
- SSJSC
- Nov 15 2014, 02:29 AM
- Daemon_Rising
- Nov 15 2014, 02:25 AM
Both, if you want your question answered to the best of my ability. Once you touch someone after they have asked you not to, you have committed the crime. But answer me this:
Suppose you are the one being touched. Suppose the person doing it is at least 16 years old, for the sake of your own arguement. Suppose you tell them to stop. And then they continue regardless of your wishes. What do you do? If you use violence against them, you have escalated it beyond neccessity, which will invariably leave you on the wrong side of a court docket. If you do nothing, they will simply continue. Your only fair, logical and lawful course of action is to involve the police.
I would tell the 16 year old to stop touching people if they were told to stop touching them. I would also tell them that continuous touching of a person after they're told to stop is a crime. It's against the law. I would have an adult who isn't a law enforcement warn him about it first. But if I just told him that it is a crime off the bat, that should be enough to get him to stop and remember to never do it again. So this is my point, some teens don't understand it's a crime. You got to tell it to them so they learn to not commit the crime.
I don't know about anywhere else, but where I live, it's made pretty clear that groping is wrong. Teachers and Parents teach you that groping is inappropriate and wrong, so you'd probably be hard-pressed to find a 16 year old who isn't aware of that fact.
You can't do anything about that. It's better to learn sooner than later or never. Some people's minds process slowly than others, so give them a chance. But yeah, I do agree that if someone doesn't stop touching you once you told him or her to stop, make sure you report it to an adult who can discipline him or her seriously. And if they still don't stop, get the law enforcement involved. How long does it take to process, though? If a teenager is told by a teacher 'groping is inappropriate and wrong', how long do they have to wait until the message has sunk in? If a person is told that message by a person who they should trust, they shouldn't go out and grope someone under any circumstance. If a person is told something and still does it anyway because they haven't processed it yet then, barring someone with learning difficulties or someone with a mental illness, they can't have accepted that it's wrong. It's just common sense.
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SSJSC
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Nov 15 2014, 02:45 AM
Post #56
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- Nagito Komaeda
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- SSJSC
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- Nagito Komaeda
- Nov 15 2014, 02:32 AM
- SSJSC
- Nov 15 2014, 02:29 AM
- Daemon_Rising
- Nov 15 2014, 02:25 AM
Both, if you want your question answered to the best of my ability. Once you touch someone after they have asked you not to, you have committed the crime. But answer me this:
Suppose you are the one being touched. Suppose the person doing it is at least 16 years old, for the sake of your own arguement. Suppose you tell them to stop. And then they continue regardless of your wishes. What do you do? If you use violence against them, you have escalated it beyond neccessity, which will invariably leave you on the wrong side of a court docket. If you do nothing, they will simply continue. Your only fair, logical and lawful course of action is to involve the police.
I would tell the 16 year old to stop touching people if they were told to stop touching them. I would also tell them that continuous touching of a person after they're told to stop is a crime. It's against the law. I would have an adult who isn't a law enforcement warn him about it first. But if I just told him that it is a crime off the bat, that should be enough to get him to stop and remember to never do it again. So this is my point, some teens don't understand it's a crime. You got to tell it to them so they learn to not commit the crime.
I don't know about anywhere else, but where I live, it's made pretty clear that groping is wrong. Teachers and Parents teach you that groping is inappropriate and wrong, so you'd probably be hard-pressed to find a 16 year old who isn't aware of that fact.
You can't do anything about that. It's better to learn sooner than later or never. Some people's minds process slowly than others, so give them a chance. But yeah, I do agree that if someone doesn't stop touching you once you told him or her to stop, make sure you report it to an adult who can discipline him or her seriously. And if they still don't stop, get the law enforcement involved.
How long does it take to process, though? If a teenager is told by a teacher 'groping is inappropriate and wrong', how long do they have to wait until the message has sunk in? If a person is told that message by a person who they should trust, they shouldn't go out and grope someone under any circumstance. If a person is told something and still do it anyway because they haven't processed it yet then, barring someone with learning difficulties or someone with a mental illness, they can't have accepted that it's wrong. It's just common sense. LOL, not all schools discipline students that well. You think every middle school and high school goes over the code of conducts completely and definitely. Plus, learning disabilities is common when you're a kid. That's why we, the victims, always have the power to TEACH it to them in person, giving them more than two chances to learn to not do these things. It is ONLY if they NEVER stop, you enforce the law.
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* Yu Narukami
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Nov 15 2014, 02:49 AM
Post #57
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Izanagi!
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- SSJSC
- Nov 15 2014, 02:45 AM
- Nagito Komaeda
- Nov 15 2014, 02:42 AM
- SSJSC
- Nov 15 2014, 02:36 AM
- Nagito Komaeda
- Nov 15 2014, 02:32 AM
- SSJSC
- Nov 15 2014, 02:29 AM
- Daemon_Rising
- Nov 15 2014, 02:25 AM
Both, if you want your question answered to the best of my ability. Once you touch someone after they have asked you not to, you have committed the crime. But answer me this:
Suppose you are the one being touched. Suppose the person doing it is at least 16 years old, for the sake of your own arguement. Suppose you tell them to stop. And then they continue regardless of your wishes. What do you do? If you use violence against them, you have escalated it beyond neccessity, which will invariably leave you on the wrong side of a court docket. If you do nothing, they will simply continue. Your only fair, logical and lawful course of action is to involve the police.
I would tell the 16 year old to stop touching people if they were told to stop touching them. I would also tell them that continuous touching of a person after they're told to stop is a crime. It's against the law. I would have an adult who isn't a law enforcement warn him about it first. But if I just told him that it is a crime off the bat, that should be enough to get him to stop and remember to never do it again. So this is my point, some teens don't understand it's a crime. You got to tell it to them so they learn to not commit the crime.
I don't know about anywhere else, but where I live, it's made pretty clear that groping is wrong. Teachers and Parents teach you that groping is inappropriate and wrong, so you'd probably be hard-pressed to find a 16 year old who isn't aware of that fact.
You can't do anything about that. It's better to learn sooner than later or never. Some people's minds process slowly than others, so give them a chance. But yeah, I do agree that if someone doesn't stop touching you once you told him or her to stop, make sure you report it to an adult who can discipline him or her seriously. And if they still don't stop, get the law enforcement involved.
How long does it take to process, though? If a teenager is told by a teacher 'groping is inappropriate and wrong', how long do they have to wait until the message has sunk in? If a person is told that message by a person who they should trust, they shouldn't go out and grope someone under any circumstance. If a person is told something and still do it anyway because they haven't processed it yet then, barring someone with learning difficulties or someone with a mental illness, they can't have accepted that it's wrong. It's just common sense.
LOL, not all schools discipline students that well. You think every middle school and high school goes over the code of conducts completely and definitely. Plus, learning disabilities is common when you're a kid. That's why we, the victims, always have the power to TEACH it to them in person, giving them more than two chances to learn to not do these things. It is ONLY if they NEVER stop, you enforce the law. The Law doesn't just throw people in Prison. People can be put on Court-ordered courses in order to educate them. Also, 'ignorance is no excuse' is a principle that the Law follows. Regarding another one of your points; learning disabilities don't just disappear and, if you're going down that route, I'd appreciate some evidence to support your point that they're common.
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Tim
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Nov 15 2014, 02:56 AM
Post #58
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Forum Royalty
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- SSJSC
- Nov 14 2014, 11:30 PM
- Tim
- Nov 14 2014, 11:27 PM
- SSJSC
- Nov 14 2014, 10:43 PM
I'm not going to offend anyone here, but people are just so retarded these days. I hate the sensitive crooks who elected Obama, De Blasio, and Charles Schumer into office.
So, correct me if i'm wrong here, but you're saying you think it should be perfectly acceptable to feel a woman up without her permission? @Steve, if it's an accident then i'm sure it's fine, but usually people don't feel someone up and then apologise for it in a sincere manner. If you touch someone in a sexual manner without their permission that is a violation of their bodies plain and simple.
Some people like it and some people don't. That's how the way it is. But as for groping in crowded places, expect it to happen intentionally and unintentionally, because it's CROWDED. Yes, some people don't like it and some people do - hence CONSENT. If you have someones permission go ahead and grope them all they want as they obviously like it, but you cannot assume everyone will like it. You should assume everyone won't and don't do it unless you explicitly know otherwise. You're asking for trouble if you don't/
@minors, most countries have relaxed legislation for dealing with minors, however they most definitely undergo some form of punishment - it does need to be made clear it is unacceptable behaviour.
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SSJSC
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Nov 15 2014, 02:56 AM
Post #59
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- Nagito Komaeda
- Nov 15 2014, 02:49 AM
- SSJSC
- Nov 15 2014, 02:45 AM
- Nagito Komaeda
- Nov 15 2014, 02:42 AM
- SSJSC
- Nov 15 2014, 02:36 AM
- Nagito Komaeda
- Nov 15 2014, 02:32 AM
- SSJSC
- Nov 15 2014, 02:29 AM
- Daemon_Rising
- Nov 15 2014, 02:25 AM
Both, if you want your question answered to the best of my ability. Once you touch someone after they have asked you not to, you have committed the crime. But answer me this:
Suppose you are the one being touched. Suppose the person doing it is at least 16 years old, for the sake of your own arguement. Suppose you tell them to stop. And then they continue regardless of your wishes. What do you do? If you use violence against them, you have escalated it beyond neccessity, which will invariably leave you on the wrong side of a court docket. If you do nothing, they will simply continue. Your only fair, logical and lawful course of action is to involve the police.
I would tell the 16 year old to stop touching people if they were told to stop touching them. I would also tell them that continuous touching of a person after they're told to stop is a crime. It's against the law. I would have an adult who isn't a law enforcement warn him about it first. But if I just told him that it is a crime off the bat, that should be enough to get him to stop and remember to never do it again. So this is my point, some teens don't understand it's a crime. You got to tell it to them so they learn to not commit the crime.
I don't know about anywhere else, but where I live, it's made pretty clear that groping is wrong. Teachers and Parents teach you that groping is inappropriate and wrong, so you'd probably be hard-pressed to find a 16 year old who isn't aware of that fact.
You can't do anything about that. It's better to learn sooner than later or never. Some people's minds process slowly than others, so give them a chance. But yeah, I do agree that if someone doesn't stop touching you once you told him or her to stop, make sure you report it to an adult who can discipline him or her seriously. And if they still don't stop, get the law enforcement involved.
How long does it take to process, though? If a teenager is told by a teacher 'groping is inappropriate and wrong', how long do they have to wait until the message has sunk in? If a person is told that message by a person who they should trust, they shouldn't go out and grope someone under any circumstance. If a person is told something and still do it anyway because they haven't processed it yet then, barring someone with learning difficulties or someone with a mental illness, they can't have accepted that it's wrong. It's just common sense.
LOL, not all schools discipline students that well. You think every middle school and high school goes over the code of conducts completely and definitely. Plus, learning disabilities is common when you're a kid. That's why we, the victims, always have the power to TEACH it to them in person, giving them more than two chances to learn to not do these things. It is ONLY if they NEVER stop, you enforce the law.
The Law doesn't just throw people in Prison. People can be put on Court-ordered courses in order to educate them. Also, 'ignorance is no excuse' is a principle that the Law follows. Regarding another one of your points; learning disabilities don't just disappear and, if you're going down that route, I'd appreciate some evidence to support your point that they're common. So that's 4 chances for a kid to learn to stop touching others without consent. I think we both can definitely agree on this route and stop debating about this back and forth now. As for the latter, no research is needed. Common sense will tell you that it's there every day. It happens even in college too. Maturity doesn't just come right away, it grows on you as you age because your mind, hormones, and mechanism will evolve and make you into a different person. It's human nature and part of our life cycle - study some science buddy.
Edited by SSJSC, Nov 15 2014, 02:58 AM.
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Daemon Keido
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Nov 15 2014, 03:12 AM
Post #60
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Warmaster of Chaos
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There is a difference between gaining maturity and taking responsibility. Those that have gotten to 16 or so have gained a fair bit of maturity, whether or not you will concede the point. After that point, the focus is upon responsibility. Consider this: Most criminal charges are for finding you RESPONSIBLE enough to know not to break the law and yet doing it anyway. Maturity very rarely comes into it at that point.
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A Shadow is merely Darkness in the presence of Light

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