How strong are the base Saiyajins in the Majin Boo Arc?

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How strong are the base Saiyajins in the Majin Boo Arc?
Tweet Topic Started: Nov 1 2014, 05:01 PM (1,244 Views)
+ ThePrinceOfSaiyans	Nov 1 2014, 05:01 PM Post #1
魔王子 Posts: 9,798 Group: Elite Member Member #10,492 Joined: November 16, 2013 Gender Male Favourite Anime Dragon Ball Z What Browser do you use? Google Chrome Favourite Manga Dragon Ball	I realize we have 2 threads dedicated to an attempt to prove the base Saiyajins are above Piccolo or 18, but I think we need a general compendium. I say we compile all the evidence for however strong the base Saiyajins are at this point in the series.
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TheACE	Nov 1 2014, 05:11 PM Post #2
The Last GT Fighter Posts: 4,146 Group: Member Member #9,279 Joined: March 31, 2013 Favourite Anime DB/Z/GT, Digimon, YYH, Yugioh!, GetBackers What Browser do you use? Chrome, Safari, IE Favourite Manga Rave Master, FLCL, .hack//legendofthetwilight, Naruto II	Base, base? Powered up base? Battle mode base? Or max power base? The last couple would be tough, given that the active threats they face require them to transform anyway. You could almost argue that Super Saiyan is their real standard mode.
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+ Pyrus	Nov 1 2014, 05:12 PM Post #3
Posts: 39,342 Group: Legend Member #5,088 Joined: August 1, 2010 Gender Not Specified Country Chile	Always assume full power for the specified form, unless otherwise specified. Specifications have led me to lead that life of specifics.
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EMIYA	Nov 1 2014, 05:34 PM Post #4
"I am the bone of my sword." Posts: 11,326 Group: Super Moderator Member #8,292 Joined: September 16, 2012 Gender Not Specified Country United States Favourite Anime Clannad, Shinsekai Yori What Browser do you use? Mozilla Firefox Favourite Manga Hellsing, Elfen Lied, Trigun Maximum	Let me put it this way, everything in the Boo Arc comparing Piccolo and the Base Saiyans is in the latter's favor. There's no part in the Boo Arc where Piccolo was implied to be stronger. The Base Saiyans however. 1.) Vegeta claims that he can defeat everyone in his base form despite knowing Piccolo and No. 18 are there. Nobody questions this. 2.) Piccolo got shoved with the trash while everyone else went to face Babidi. 3.) Piccolo freaks out over Kaioshin which even Herms claims is almost certainly about power while Kaioshin freaks over Yakon who Base Goku rivals. You can make some points that say Piccolo's talking about Kaioshin's godly ability, which funny imo. But as you can see, the manga has so many implications of the Base Saiyans being superior and Piccolo either shuts the **** up or gets thrown out with the trash. Whether you think it was written correctly, I believe its pretty clear Toriyama intended the Base Saiyans to be stronger than Piccolo.



+ Emmeth	Nov 1 2014, 05:38 PM Post #5
I ♥ Yoeri Posts: 20,075 Group: Legend Member #8,985 Joined: February 7, 2013 Country Japan	Father Brofist Nov 1 2014, 05:34 PM Whether you think it was written correctly, I believe its pretty clear Toriyama intended the Base Saiyans to be stronger than Piccolo. Yeah. Consistency doesn't mean s* to Toriyama. Base Saiyans ever being stronger than Piccolo makes no f*ing sense.
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Mihawk	Nov 1 2014, 05:49 PM Post #6
Posts: 4,804 Group: Prodigy Member #4,783 Joined: March 2, 2010 Gender Not Specified	Most of the evidence for Piccolo > Base Monkeys is based on power scaling/levels which Toriyama most likely gave up handling to a certain degree after the Freeza Arc. Base Adult Saiyans >* Kaioshin >** Piccolo Evidence include various implications such as this manga panel and of course the clear cut PeePee debacle. *Piccolo stating Kaioshin was stronger according to Herms.



+ Emmeth	Nov 1 2014, 05:52 PM Post #7
I ♥ Yoeri Posts: 20,075 Group: Legend Member #8,985 Joined: February 7, 2013 Country Japan	Iirc, Akira Toriyama said in an interview that Piccolo trained during the 7 year gap. If this is true, there is no way Base Saiyans are stronger than Piccolo, since the latter was already pretty close to 50% MSSJ Goku during the Cell Games.
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+ Pyrus	Nov 1 2014, 05:54 PM Post #8
Posts: 39,342 Group: Legend Member #5,088 Joined: August 1, 2010 Gender Not Specified Country Chile	Dr. Zoidberg Nov 1 2014, 05:52 PM Iirc, Akira Toriyama said in an interview that Piccolo trained during the 7 year gap. If this is true, there is no way Base Saiyans are stronger than Piccolo, since the latter was already pretty close to 50% MSSJ Goku during the Cell Games. That's hwhat starts this whole roundabout. It's a vicious circle of bias, ignorance, bliss, stubbornness, fact checking, inferring, seducing, suggesting, and some debating thrown in at times. Edited by Pyrus, Nov 1 2014, 05:54 PM.
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+ Emmeth	Nov 1 2014, 05:55 PM Post #9
I ♥ Yoeri Posts: 20,075 Group: Legend Member #8,985 Joined: February 7, 2013 Country Japan	Pyrus Nov 1 2014, 05:54 PM Dr. Zoidberg Nov 1 2014, 05:52 PM Iirc, Akira Toriyama said in an interview that Piccolo trained during the 7 year gap. If this is true, there is no way Base Saiyans are stronger than Piccolo, since the latter was already pretty close to 50% MSSJ Goku during the Cell Games. That's hwhat starts this whole roundabout. It's a vicious circle of bias, ignorance, bliss, stubbornness, fact checking, inferring, seducing, suggesting, and some debating thrown in at times. Even without the quote, it's completely unthinkable that Piccolo lost that much power (or anything at all) during the gap.
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EMIYA	Nov 1 2014, 05:55 PM Post #10
"I am the bone of my sword." Posts: 11,326 Group: Super Moderator Member #8,292 Joined: September 16, 2012 Gender Not Specified Country United States Favourite Anime Clannad, Shinsekai Yori What Browser do you use? Mozilla Firefox Favourite Manga Hellsing, Elfen Lied, Trigun Maximum	Where is it stated that Piccolo is near 50% Goku? Because he was still standing when Goku was on the ground in his fight with the Cell Juniors? There's no telling where Goku stood in that fight or how much the Cell Juniors were screwing around if we bring that up to the equation. The only thing outright stated is the fact that Piccolo was stronger than he was when he fought No. 17, that's pretty much all we have to go by.



+ Pyrus	Nov 1 2014, 05:57 PM Post #11
Posts: 39,342 Group: Legend Member #5,088 Joined: August 1, 2010 Gender Not Specified Country Chile	Dr. Zoidberg Nov 1 2014, 05:55 PM Pyrus Nov 1 2014, 05:54 PM Dr. Zoidberg Nov 1 2014, 05:52 PM Iirc, Akira Toriyama said in an interview that Piccolo trained during the 7 year gap. If this is true, there is no way Base Saiyans are stronger than Piccolo, since the latter was already pretty close to 50% MSSJ Goku during the Cell Games. That's hwhat starts this whole roundabout. It's a vicious circle of bias, ignorance, bliss, stubbornness, fact checking, inferring, seducing, suggesting, and some debating thrown in at times. Even without the quote, it's completely unthinkable that Piccolo lost that much power (or anything at all) during the gap. I'm not talking about Toriyama's statement. I fully understand and accept that; it's logic at its finest. My squabble was for the bolded parts of your post.
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+ Emmeth	Nov 1 2014, 05:57 PM Post #12
I ♥ Yoeri Posts: 20,075 Group: Legend Member #8,985 Joined: February 7, 2013 Country Japan	Father Brofist Nov 1 2014, 05:55 PM Where is it stated that Piccolo is near 50% Goku? Because he was still standing when Goku was on the ground in his fight with the Cell Juniors? There's no telling where Goku stood in that fight or how much the Cell Juniors were screwing around if we bring that up to the equation. The only thing outright stated is the fact that Piccolo was stronger than he was when he fought No. 17, that's pretty much all we have to go by. I feel like that's unnecessary conjecture. Piccolo was standing during the Cell Jr fight, along with Vegeta and Trunks, thus he should be around that level of power. @Pyrus Didn't see the bolded part. Noted and accepted, sir. Edited by Emmeth, Nov 1 2014, 05:58 PM.
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EMIYA	Nov 1 2014, 06:02 PM Post #13
"I am the bone of my sword." Posts: 11,326 Group: Super Moderator Member #8,292 Joined: September 16, 2012 Gender Not Specified Country United States Favourite Anime Clannad, Shinsekai Yori What Browser do you use? Mozilla Firefox Favourite Manga Hellsing, Elfen Lied, Trigun Maximum	That line would be uncessary conjecture. We don't know what kind of effort the Cell Juniors were doing with everyone. We don't say the humans are on SSJ level's because they survived now do we? And even if Piccolo is near 50% Goku, what's stopping the Boo Arc Saiyans from just having trained more and harder so that their base forms finally surpassed Piccolo?



+ Emmeth	Nov 1 2014, 06:04 PM Post #14
I ♥ Yoeri Posts: 20,075 Group: Legend Member #8,985 Joined: February 7, 2013 Country Japan	Father Brofist Nov 1 2014, 06:02 PM And even if Piccolo is near 50% Goku, what's stopping the Boo Arc Saiyans from just having trained more and harder so that their base forms finally surpassed Piccolo? Gohan lost a lot of power. That's the staple I usually use. You would have to put Gohan miles above Goku for it to work out.
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EMIYA	Nov 1 2014, 06:05 PM Post #15
"I am the bone of my sword." Posts: 11,326 Group: Super Moderator Member #8,292 Joined: September 16, 2012 Gender Not Specified Country United States Favourite Anime Clannad, Shinsekai Yori What Browser do you use? Mozilla Firefox Favourite Manga Hellsing, Elfen Lied, Trigun Maximum	And what's stopping Gohan from being miles ahead of Goku?



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