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- Might Gai (NARUTO SPOILERS) vs...
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| Might Gai (NARUTO SPOILERS) vs... | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Nov 1 2014, 12:12 AM (7,412 Views) | |
| + Steve | Nov 1 2014, 12:12 AM Post #1 |
Greetings. I will be your waifu this season.
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So Gai in the 8th Gate vs...who can beat him? Firstly without going to obvious extremes like the Guren Lagan machines who would be on an almost equal level with Gai and be able to beat him outside of Naruto? He totally went Super Saiyan with that 100x boost so what level of power from other series would be needed to take him out in your opinion? I'm not sure what tier but definitely DBZ level, especially going by how ridiculously deep a hole his first punch put Madara down. Actually not even a punch just the air pressure from him punching making actual contact would be insanity. Secondly who could perhaps not beat him but survive long enough for him to die due to the nature of the technique? Discounting people who regenerate. |
 Definitely not a succubus, fear not | |
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| + Steve | Nov 1 2014, 11:48 PM Post #31 |
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Greetings. I will be your waifu this season.
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Again refer to his drill example that explains it. Just because someone with a power level of 100 has a power level 100x higher than someone with a PL of 1 doesn't mean they punch 100x harder. Ki blasts just diffuse of people's bodies due to their ki defences and then a punch, well their fists never smash to pieces. Ki blasts are pretty fragile/volatile they're either ready to blow up or to just be tanked and diffused. Edited by Steve, Nov 2 2014, 12:01 AM.
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Definitely not a succubus, fear not | |
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| Mihawk | Nov 2 2014, 12:13 AM Post #32 |
 
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What's the point of the knife in call of duty when you have a barrel rifle? What's the point of a sword in halo when you have rocket launchers? How the heck does hitting someone with the blunt side of a needler kill someone but 10 shots later they're still alive? The authors make melee and close combat relevant the same way Toriyama did. They do more direct damage to the body in whatever way it worked in the author's head. I'm just trying to give my explanation. You don't have to buy it. If you're gonna use the "concentration" excuse which I did refute, you're not gonna use it no matter what you say on punches and kicks. People have been thrown and kicked into the floor and never have they ever come close to what Gai did until Gotenks in the Boo saga. Punches have missed without intention, and they do absolutely jack to the surroundings. It's fairly clear that Toriyama, like the majority of authors of comics/manga/video games, has made characters vulnerable to close combat techniques more than they would for blasts and other attacks to make the show more interesting and not just a flash fireworks fest. |
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| Arkadom | Nov 2 2014, 12:17 AM Post #33 |
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Bargle nawdle zouss
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Again, my analogy of Gai is that he's a glass cannon, every time he fires he destroys whatever is in his reach as well as damaging himself greatly, and his durability is probably not that great either. Juubi Madara's physical strength was not very impressive, the same as most of the Naruto cast, his primary attacks are Ninjutsu and weapon based, and Gai was so fast that he rarely got hit. On the other hand, Gai is basically the almighty overlord of Taijutsu, his physical strength and body speed already greatly exceeding that of someone renowned for their speed such as Sasuke, and even Madara, a wielder of the sharingan in it's highest form, could not follow Gai's movements, essentially equating him to at least mid-Saiyan saga in speed. Gai was shown on-panel to be so fast that gravity actually couldn't keep up with him, he zoomed into the air above Madara and floated there for a decently long time even when his momentum completely stopped, long enough for Madara to realise his location, and for Gai to unleash the Evening Elephant, and then to land back down again, not even in the same chapter. That's just his speed accomplishments without using any specific techniques. Then let's take into consideration his speed while using Night Moth, his most powerful technique. His speed while doing this was so fast that not only did he actually begin to distort space and bend the very fabric of matter around him, but he allegedly tore through reality according to Madara, apparently moving so quickly that Madara couldn't actually detect his existence until Gai was already hitting him, much faster than Madara's defense could even begin to react to, and his defense was better than that of Obito's who could defend effortlessly again Bijuu bombs. Now let's talk about Gai's strength, as Steve already has shown, even without physical contact one movement from Gai sent Madara so far down into the earth that the surface was just a small dot of light in the distance. Then take into consideration the sheer power of the Night Moth. Gai used it as a last ditch effort, but he never actually stated that the technique itself would be problematic in a fight, he only used it last because nothing else had guaranteed a win, and Madara himself acknowledged he only survived because of the senjutsu chakra and insta-healing he had acquired from Hashirama (which I personally think is a serious asspull seeing as so much of Madara's torso was removed, including the area which contained his heart and the source of his senjutsu chakra.) The attack obliterated about 47% of Madara's body, it was completely gone, incinerated and crushed into nothing but blood and ashes. The impact only broke Gai's leg. If he were to use that technique to begin with, he could still keep on fighting afterwards seeing as the 8th gate is so painful any other pain received is effectively cancelled out, a broken leg would not hinder Gai at all. All of these feats give me confidence Gai could at least fight late Android saga opponents while using the 8th gate, if not more. The only drawbacks are that it's a suicide technique, it has a time limit and once it's up the user burns to ashes, and I can't think of many DBZ characters who have the regenerative ability to survive having the majority of their body-and vital organs-destroyed. While there are some that are probably fast enough to dodge it, I'm doubtful anyone would survive even by blocking it, and even in just regular combat without using Night Moth, Gai's attacks create so much friction due to their speed that everything he hits suffers severe burning, so that also adds some extra damage. I'm doubtful Gai could take on the top-tiers in the Buu saga, such as base Gotenks and above, but I think he could probably take a majority if not all of the human/Android Z fighters and Piccolo, probably not all at the same time, but still. |
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| + Steve | Nov 2 2014, 12:27 AM Post #34 |
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Greetings. I will be your waifu this season.
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Yeah if fists did nothing every fight would be either a beam struggle or an insta-kill. There's no real evidence of condensing in beams etc the only moves that could qualify as condensed ones are like Kienzan, clearly a lot of Ki is packed in there for even Krillin to be able to damage second form Frieza and then Vegeta's sacrifice, he most likely had to regulate the explosion with his body otherwise he'd have nuked like half the planet or something, that crater IIRC wasn't much bigger than the Big Bang Attack one. Beams are pretty much fire and forget attacks, if Vegeta could have condensed his Final Flash which statistically should be way weaker than other blasts in the series he wouldn't have had to launch it in to space or did he just regulate the explosion billions of light years away when it finally hit something? If it's not a technique with obvious control behind it there's no way they could condense it...I mean how? If they fire all their Ki what power lets them limit how big the explosion is from a distance away? Such a thing would be stated, surely. EDIT I dunno about Gai being a glass cannon really he only received serious, fight ending damage after his final technique when his body was already wrecked his bones were probably as tough as condensed milk at that point  the longer the fight goes the less damage his body can handle sure but for the first while, being able to punch with that much friction and not destroy his arms in the process would take some mighty high durability.If he can survive the friction needed to do that he can probably handle attacks of the same calibre, just not for long due to the nature of the Gate. Also I'm fairly sure Gai punched Madara through mountain ranges, given how big the roots of the Shinjuu are the rocks seen, which are pointed like the mountains around the battle zone, probably are mountains. Edited by Steve, Nov 2 2014, 12:33 AM.
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Definitely not a succubus, fear not | |
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| + supersaqer | Nov 2 2014, 12:02 PM Post #35 |
Transcendent
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Un-quantifiable. We don't know how powerful is that. All we know that he almost killed pre-Shinju one eyed Jinchuuriki Madara with his Night Moth. The same as above. Gai vs 23rd Tenshinhan would be kind of hard to tell who would actually win. One swipe from King Piccolo's hand, and it destroyed a city. This Ten is much stronger than that Piccolo. Gai would most likely be able to win, but I'd say he would lose against Kami. Goku/Piccolo are obvious. |
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| + Steve | Nov 2 2014, 12:39 PM Post #36 |
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Greetings. I will be your waifu this season.
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Not with pure physical strength nobody possesses the sheer amount of strength Gai has in the 8th Gate. The dude could kick the air so hard that he could fly. Spoiler: click to toggle In the background there is clearly a mountain range he wrecks that whole place with a kick. Vegeta and Goku weren't even doing that in their fight and their fists were clashing and while Goku wasn't at full power they were going all out. And with physical strength like that his speed should be way above most DBZ characters, he doesn't require Ki to move fast he can just run nonsensically fast, jump or kick the air, if his strength is so much higher than most of DBZ then so should be his raw speed. Of course if he needs to go as far as the Night Moth he dies too but they die first so it's still a win, Madara's regen is easily better than Buu's and he was still nearly obliterated(not that it would kill Buu) |
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Definitely not a succubus, fear not | |
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| + supersaqer | Nov 2 2014, 01:00 PM Post #37 |
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Transcendent
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Sanji could kick the air so hard that he could fly. Is he as strong? Nope. It's not clear as you say, and it mostly appears to be just rock formations. Night Moth is also his most powerful technique. If it was really a mountain range, he could only fragment them. He didn't fragment them to the point the rubble was equally in size, or just small, there were large rocks flying. Piccolo could still obliterate an entire city with a normal blast, and 23rd Ten is much stronger than him. You could say that Gai could beat him, but that's where he'll be able to reach. If you want to debate speed, weakened 23rd Goku could dodge a blast that crossed most of the island in one panel, the island which is close to the size of a small continent. |
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| * Yu Narukami | Nov 2 2014, 02:48 PM Post #38 |
Izanagi!
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Weakened 23rd Goku didn't distort space with pure speed, though. Nobody in Z has done anything close to that. |
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| Arkadom | Nov 2 2014, 02:56 PM Post #39 |
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Bargle nawdle zouss
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Perhaps describing the nature of Gai's speed might make it a little clearer. If something is moving so fast that it can actually bend space, that means it transcends physical parameters. Essentially, what you can see is actually not there anymore, it is an afterimage because even light itself is not capable of moving fast enough to keep up with the object. This means Gai was travelling at about the speed of light when he began to distort space. He moved so quickly that it was actually possible to see the matter in that area moving in to fill the void Gai's speeding frame had just left. |
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In these eyes of mine Spoiler: click to toggle Epic for Copy_Ninja
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| + supersaqer | Nov 2 2014, 03:06 PM Post #40 |
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Transcendent
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Super Boo could open a hole in an infinite dimension by just screaming. It takes much more energy to run than to scream. Does it mean that Gai is as powerful as Super Boo? Absolutely not. Light can't distort space. It takes "faster than light" speeds to accomplish the feat. Gai's feat is un-quantifiable at this point. With his power, he won't get to the Saiyan Saga. |
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| Arkadom | Nov 2 2014, 03:16 PM Post #41 |
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Bargle nawdle zouss
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That's exactly what I just said...He distorted space, thus his speed is even greater than the speed of light. And thus faster than any DBZ character that can't use instant transmission, as the fastest DBZ characters break the sound barrier but not the light barrier. |
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In these eyes of mine Spoiler: click to toggle Epic for Copy_Ninja
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| + Ssj3vegito96 | Nov 2 2014, 04:14 PM Post #42 |
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You can't say gai is faster than anyone in dbz. We don't even know how fast dbz characters are. For all we know they could be hypersonic or way faster than light. Talking about punching, kicking, reaction time etc. of course. Not their traveling speed Idk if saying their movements are weaker because they don't effect the environment like other characters from different series do proves anything. Toriyama is a very simple author who probably just didn't care to include all that Edited by Ssj3vegito96, Nov 2 2014, 04:34 PM.
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IT'S CHEESE Spoiler: click to toggle
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| Goddess Ultimecia | Nov 2 2014, 04:22 PM Post #43 |
 
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Ok so after carefully going over and researching on him and even playing some of his games I'd have to say... this little guy with prep could probably take on a lot of things when translating him into a full 3D environment. But the question is if Might Guy would be too much? Pretty likely I'd say, but he can place Skyscraper sized invisible mounds of Dark Matter around to trap people, and then add Plasma, Fire, Electrical properties to the invisible Dark Matter. Sealing himself inside and forcing others to have to break through the Plasmic, Blazing, Electrical Wall. If we are to allow his other appearances. Then he can simply turn Might Guy into a Bubble and pop him. #SackboyMasterRace |
 NinjaSushi Colouring
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| Mihawk | Nov 2 2014, 04:47 PM Post #44 |
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Just gonna comment once on the whole "unquantifiable" business. Unquantifiable and incomparable aren't the same thing. We can still compare things without quantifying them. That's only relevant for forums where they sit up all day doing lol calcs. Which are thankfully banned around these parts. No one in DBZ had a kick or punch that was strong enough to warp reality around them, which makes sense seeing how weak physical strength is in the series. Sage Mode Naruto is physically already stronger than all the feats we've see in DBZ. Gai's strength feat of knocking Madara down into the Earth wasn't done until the Boo Saga with Gotenks. Although I guess you can argue for a similar feat with Goku punching Freeza through islands. Gonna bump him up to post zenkai Goku vs Freeza. I'd like to entertain higher than Freeza Arc, but he'd mainly just get burned out by an on target ki blast.
Toriyama effectively nerfed the series then. I doubt he cares the he did it. Edited by Mihawk, Nov 2 2014, 04:50 PM.
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| + Ssj3vegito96 | Nov 2 2014, 05:03 PM Post #45 |
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Are you guys saying madara is more durable than buu saga characters? |
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