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Goku's power in Super Saiyan 3
Topic Started: Aug 1 2014, 02:47 PM (1,289 Views)
* Ketchup Revenge
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ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Aug 1 2014, 05:44 PM
Why not? The less energy he uses, the less strain the form would have.
It's the physical properties of the form itself that cause the strain, not the ki level itself.

Even if he reduced the amount of ki used in battle, I'd imagine that he'd still have the same rate of consumption from simply sustaining the form. Not to mention that it seems that the stronger the SSj3 form is, the faster ki is consumed.
We see this with Gotenks, where he arguably only spent about ten minutes or so in the form, maybe not even.

However, it's possible that Goku could stay SSj3 longer if he did reduce the amount used, but that doesn't mean his strain would be any less.

Transformations are stated by Rou Dai Kaioshin to be bad because you can't relax in them. This was the whole reason why he unlocked Gohan's hidden ki. Gohan wouldn't have to use transformations (which cause strain) in order to tap into his reserves.



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Hurry My Curry
Aug 1 2014, 06:08 PM
I don't see it that way. I think the form is the weight. It's noted at least once that the form itself causes strain. If it was related to ki output, the same would hold true for every form, why just SSjin 3. Maintaining it is what takes so much energy, thus holding back in that form doesn't make sense to me.
I don't know if SSj3 can be suppressed or not, but Freeza didn't have any problems suppressing his power despite his final form taking a lot of energy.
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Clearin
Aug 1 2014, 06:19 PM
Hurry My Curry
Aug 1 2014, 06:08 PM
I don't see it that way. I think the form is the weight. It's noted at least once that the form itself causes strain. If it was related to ki output, the same would hold true for every form, why just SSjin 3. Maintaining it is what takes so much energy, thus holding back in that form doesn't make sense to me.
I don't know if SSj3 can be suppressed or not, but Freeza didn't have any problems suppressing his power despite his final form taking a lot of energy.
The difference between that though is that his Final Form is his natural state, if I'm correct.
His first three transformations are actually his transformed states, which are intended to reduce his power.

We also need to consider the fact that Freeza's forms are more metamorphoses, not really a transformation like Super Saiyan.
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Ketchup Revenge
Aug 1 2014, 06:18 PM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Aug 1 2014, 05:44 PM
Why not? The less energy he uses, the less strain the form would have.
It's the physical properties of the form itself that cause the strain, not the ki level itself.

Even if he reduced the amount of ki used in battle, I'd imagine that he'd still have the same rate of consumption from simply sustaining the form. Not to mention that it seems that the stronger the SSj3 form is, the faster ki is consumed.
We see this with Gotenks, where he arguably only spent about ten minutes or so in the form, maybe not even.

However, it's possible that Goku could stay SSj3 longer if he did reduce the amount used, but that doesn't mean his strain would be any less.

Transformations are stated by Rou Dai Kaioshin to be bad because you can't relax in them. This was the whole reason why he unlocked Gohan's hidden ki. Gohan wouldn't have to use transformations (which cause strain) in order to tap into his reserves.



Physical properties? He just has long hair....
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Ja, never been a fan of the idea that Lord Goku could suppress his power in the form that's so damning he can only maintain it for a few minutes. That's strain added on top of strain. Boom.
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I think it's bad enough he has to maintain a ki-consuming state like SSJ3 let alone supressing his ki in it.
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ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Aug 1 2014, 06:42 PM
Ketchup Revenge
Aug 1 2014, 06:18 PM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Aug 1 2014, 05:44 PM
Why not? The less energy he uses, the less strain the form would have.
It's the physical properties of the form itself that cause the strain, not the ki level itself.

Even if he reduced the amount of ki used in battle, I'd imagine that he'd still have the same rate of consumption from simply sustaining the form. Not to mention that it seems that the stronger the SSj3 form is, the faster ki is consumed.
We see this with Gotenks, where he arguably only spent about ten minutes or so in the form, maybe not even.

However, it's possible that Goku could stay SSj3 longer if he did reduce the amount used, but that doesn't mean his strain would be any less.

Transformations are stated by Rou Dai Kaioshin to be bad because you can't relax in them. This was the whole reason why he unlocked Gohan's hidden ki. Gohan wouldn't have to use transformations (which cause strain) in order to tap into his reserves.



Physical properties? He just has long hair....
Because it's because of the hair... I remember when I had long hair it was so difficult walking from one room to another... it was almost too much for me to handle, I ended up cutting up because of it's strain. :p

Seriously, I think Kakarrot can Only being dead... I don't believe he can being alive. Especially since he's stated he can do more with SS3 dead than being alive. That's how I see Kakarrot's comment about being able to beat Fat Boo.
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ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Aug 1 2014, 06:42 PM
Ketchup Revenge
Aug 1 2014, 06:18 PM
ThePrinceOfSaiyajins
Aug 1 2014, 05:44 PM
Why not? The less energy he uses, the less strain the form would have.
It's the physical properties of the form itself that cause the strain, not the ki level itself.

Even if he reduced the amount of ki used in battle, I'd imagine that he'd still have the same rate of consumption from simply sustaining the form. Not to mention that it seems that the stronger the SSj3 form is, the faster ki is consumed.
We see this with Gotenks, where he arguably only spent about ten minutes or so in the form, maybe not even.

However, it's possible that Goku could stay SSj3 longer if he did reduce the amount used, but that doesn't mean his strain would be any less.

Transformations are stated by Rou Dai Kaioshin to be bad because you can't relax in them. This was the whole reason why he unlocked Gohan's hidden ki. Gohan wouldn't have to use transformations (which cause strain) in order to tap into his reserves.



Physical properties? He just has long hair....
There's obviously something different with it than Super Saiyan or Super Saiyan 2 considering that it eats up so much ki to simply be in the state.

Change in the physical appearance aren't the only "properties" that come with transformations. There's obviously physiological changes too.

For example, both Goku and Vegeta mention that regular Super Saiyan makes them feel "ecstatic" or "restless" (before FPSSj was reached). Goku also mentions that Grades 2 and 3 use up too much ki.
All of these properties are physiological changes.
Edited by Ketchup Revenge, Aug 1 2014, 11:56 PM.
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Kblo247
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I would say he held back vs Fat but not at Kid. He had more control in his dead body and could have ended it. In his living body, he never really got the chance, and we see overestimation on his part with being able to build the power up within a minute.
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Shazam
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you dont need to master in order to hold back. you can always hold back.

he was holding back against fat buu. later he did not hold back. its just that he was alive when he tried to fight again with it and using it while being alive is much harder to control and it just wastes ki very fast.
that is why he prefers ssj/ssj2 when he is in the lower realms.
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* Yu Narukami
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There's 'holding back' in regards to suppressing your ki and there's 'holding back' in regards to not putting your full effort into the battle. I don't believe that Goku can suppress his ki in SSJ3, as it's a form that forces out his ki, to the point where his body struggles to cope with it.
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