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- Gremmy Thoumeau vs Kaguya Otsutsuki vs Janemba
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| Gremmy Thoumeau vs Kaguya Otsutsuki vs Janemba | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Jul 2 2014, 08:19 AM (7,317 Views) | |
| + Solid Snake | Jul 2 2014, 08:19 AM Post #1 |
滅Are you frightened?
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Gremmy has insight on both his oppositions power. Kaguya cannot absorb any projectiles attacks. Janemba can't nuke the planet but has everything else. Case 2: Janemba is as smart as Gero. Who wins? |
 Shinnozou tomete kureru! ~ Evil Ryu SSJG and SSJ4 Goku Sig Dragon Ball: Ultimate Road Story Naruto and Goku's Adventure Story
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| + Steve | Jul 4 2014, 04:28 PM Post #61 |
Greetings. I will be your waifu this season.
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You can't see light faster than light actually moves though. Going faster than light all sorts of mad things can happen, time travel for one. How often are wormholes and things made while DBZ characters fight? Well nobody explicitly states "Oh my god in two seconds it blew up the moon!" I'm not saying it took 20 minutes but like at most 2 minutes, which is nowhere near light speed. Plus there are other factors to consider like the fact that there's no resistance in space so upon leaving the atmosphere their acceleration would see a huge boost. King Kakarot you never seem to look up anything about anything versus DBZ all you do is say DBZ > Maybe you should try reading some things, DBZ characters are beatable. Raditz is easily beatable by Naruto verse, easily. And Bleach for that matter. Edited by Steve, Jul 4 2014, 04:28 PM.
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 Definitely not a succubus, fear not | |
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Jul 4 2014, 04:36 PM Post #62 |
 
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*sighs* This is fiction stop trying to apply real world terms to it like worm holes and environmental damage and air resistance akira is CLEARLY not an expertise on those things nor does he think about them while writing it That same moon buster piccolo fired would destroy kaguya lol she isn't tanking it at all Even if it took 2 minutes using kai oken x 20 you would still get relatavistic- FTL in the freiza saga Sure DBZ characters are beatable just not by naruto and bleach characters they would be in the fight of thier lives vs raditz let alone janemba rofl Edited by King Kakarot, Jul 4 2014, 04:38 PM.
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| + Ssj3vegito96 | Jul 4 2014, 04:40 PM Post #63 |
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but toriyama has actually said that the moon in dbz is the same distance from earth it is in real life. I can give you the interview. Busy right now though |
IT'S CHEESE Spoiler: click to toggle
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Jul 4 2014, 04:45 PM Post #64 |
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http://www.kanzenshuu.com/manga/tankobon/vol-09/
Edited by King Kakarot, Jul 4 2014, 04:45 PM.
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| Mihawk | Jul 4 2014, 04:51 PM Post #65 |
 
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Right but even you say not to accept Toriyama's numbers. On one hand you're saying Toriyama didn't think of possibilities like ki having a very high acceleration rate therefore reaching the moon within a minute not being an issue; on the other hand you're saying it won't be fair to throw these two feats out as outliers since Toriyama doesn't understand the physics issues it would cause. If you're going to bring Toriyama into this then you'd have to accept the most logical answer of him not thinking of the speed issues it would cause. To be honest I didn't even consider this to be some sort of issue no matter how many times I saw it. I only made it into a feat when I used to fanboy to make DB/Z the stronger than Superman. I've been down the road you guys are going and I know it's not pretty. |
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Jul 4 2014, 04:58 PM Post #66 |
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All he's saying is that the moon is the same distance to our own Brofist was saying that the distance may be smaller(when it's not) physics as in air friction,wormholes and all that other s*** is irrelevant becuase akira never thought of it when he wrote the manga Akira wanted the beam to be fast so he did just that since you know Gohan was wrecking the earth..... The issue is that this is a mismatch these guys aren't on the same level as Janemba in speed,power,durability Edited by King Kakarot, Jul 4 2014, 04:58 PM.
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| + Steve | Jul 4 2014, 05:00 PM Post #67 |
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Greetings. I will be your waifu this season.
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Well I know this isn't allowed in this fight but Kaguya could just absorb it, you can not deny that she can absorb it. Rinnegan absorption in Naruto has never ever had any stated limit. I'm sure you would probably say "But DBZ characters are really strong so it would kill it" which is no valid statement, absolutes can't be beaten by raw power. Raditz would be nothing to someone with the Rinnegan, Mangekyou Sharingan or someone powerful with the Byakugan and Gentle Fist. How does he stop a Hyuga of equal strength severing his bodies ability to control energy? Or how does he stop fire that burns forever or survive being thrown in to another dimension? How does he get round absolute absorption and being immobilized by touch then having his soul taken? He doesn't. Those are tame examples of Kaguya she can literally throw him in to a dimension where he'd be in space and he would just die or can he breath in space now too? Or maybe he can fly so fast that he could get to a planet and breath again before it kills him. Honestly not sure what you'd thing. Sharingan lets someone see and cut lightning and that was with just one and someone who isn't even an Uchiha. Extremely basic Sharingan too. If you don't think Kaguya could react to DBZ speeds that aren't light speed, you're wrong.
But you can just say people are MFTL without concrete evidence, and that's legit? Edited by Steve, Jul 4 2014, 05:01 PM.
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Definitely not a succubus, fear not | |
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Jul 4 2014, 05:04 PM Post #68 |
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Do you even know what a No Limits Fallacy is? Do you? sure it may have no stated limit but since it says that does that mean she can absorb universal attacks since it has no limit?  edit: lol did you not see vegeta's Final flash speed or are you blind do you need people to write everything out for you? Can you not see how fast an attack is without someone telling you what speed it's moving at? lol Edited by King Kakarot, Jul 4 2014, 05:05 PM.
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| Mihawk | Jul 4 2014, 05:05 PM Post #69 |
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This distance is logically smaller since while he made the manga everything indicated that things were smaller. Only being 4 galaxies; the moon being so big in the drawings that you'd assume it's actually in the Earth's atmosphere; Boss Rabit actually being able to breathe on the moon. If we bring Toiryama into this not knowing the physics then we should also bring in him not knowing the immense speed it would require to reach moon within a minute or so. There's no evidence of him knowing the speed. His physics understanding has been s*** throughout the entire manga. You saying he knows is just your bias towards the situation. Not to mention how notorious he is forgetting things and contradicting the manga in his interviews. I know because I used to try the same thing. If it was possible to see the old other versus section you'd see it all there. |
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| + Steve | Jul 4 2014, 05:11 PM Post #70 |
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Greetings. I will be your waifu this season.
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And just because you say she can't doesn't mean she can't. Maybe you should look up No Limits Fallacy because you pretty much always say Raditz can take on everything. Nobody saw how fast it was, it was either in pictures or a moving guess of how fast it was going in said pictures. Plus how is anything like that usable in a fight? Janemba: "Gremmy-kun, Kaguya-chan, wait while I power up for 20 minutes!" Also Kaguya is only banned from absorbing projectiles. How does Janemba, or any DBZ character counter Genjutsu and their energy being sucked right out of them? Or just their souls being taken. Edited by Steve, Jul 4 2014, 05:12 PM.
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Definitely not a succubus, fear not | |
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| EMIYA | Jul 4 2014, 05:19 PM Post #71 |
"I am the bone of my sword."
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Alright so with the point of the interview, the moon distance is the same as the Earths...which I'm inferring that this number is correct. Though that still doesn't give us any more work to do with the speed of the blast. But the point here is that, Gremmy at least and I'm assuming Kaguya as well have the abilities to wreck each other even someone as strong as Janemba or Vegetto or anyone who isn't near omnipotent themselves regardless of how physically weak they are themselves. What Gremmy lacks in speed (and its possible he could imagine himself faster but we'll assume otherwise) or strength he makes up in ability. It's kind of like giving a normal personal a button that says "instant win...press..." Kaguya like Gremmy is seemingly similar. She seems to lack the same kind of of overwhelming ability that Gremmy has but still has dangerous techniques and this time speed it would appear to help her out. So let's put it in a different perspective. Imagine Vegeta....back when he was evil so he's not nice or merciflu or giving chances. He walks up and sees these two people...they probably aren't building up any massive amount of ki compared to his own. To him, these are two bizarre but fairly normal people who don't seem threatening at all. Especially not Chibi Gremmy over there. He also doesn't know that this little kid has reality warping powers that can easily destroy him with but a single thought. Vegeta's not going to randomly go up and beat the crap out of someone the instant he sees them unless he notices the threat immediately and even that's arguable. Gremmy's physical attacks might not mean much but his mental and ability to warp the reality around him with his thoughts certainly does. This is the same case with Janemba. Janemba has absolute no idea of what these two can do, they seem normal enough, there's no threat from them and one of them can destroy him without moving a single muscle, he just has to think it. And Janemba has zero way to block an attack that is being thought and that makes it much harder if doesn't even have a clue what's going on in the first place. I mean its not like you see a random kid in the street and go up and beat the crap out of them because you automatically know their the spawn of Satan and will destroy the earth in the next second do you? Know, there's no preparation on your part, or Vegeta's part or Janemba's part here. He's unprepared to the abilities of these two. No matter how strong, or fast or powerful Janemba might be. This is meaningless if he doesn't utilize them and he's got a lot less of chance understanding the situation in the first round and attacking then the other two do. |
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Jul 4 2014, 05:20 PM Post #72 |
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So i take it you don't know What A NLF is? Raditz beats the naruto verse down since he's a casual Moon+++++ buster it's as simple as that Piccolo blew up the moon in 1 panel it obviosuly happened fast or do you think piccolo stood in that same position for minutes? lol Janemba speed blitz and 1 shots that simple really there will be no time for the other users to react |
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| * Yu Narukami | Jul 4 2014, 05:31 PM Post #73 |
Izanagi!
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Fallacy fallacy is something that should be considered. Logic says that the moon is much closer to the Earth in the Z-Verse than it is in real life Edited by Yu Narukami, Jul 4 2014, 05:31 PM.
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| + Steve | Jul 4 2014, 05:37 PM Post #74 |
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Greetings. I will be your waifu this season.
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But it isn't... Blowing up stuff doesn't make one automatically more powerful, he has more destructive force, that's it. Energy blasts like that aren't very fast, not fast enough to take on Gremmy or Kaguya, Raditz is laughably slow. You need to realize that DBZ characters have a different kind of power from other series, not outright better powers. Taking someone's soul with them having no defence against it is a far better power than blowing up the moon. As is being able to send someone to any dimension you want. The reason Kaguya is restricted from absorbing projectiles is because she'd obviously beat Janemba easily with that. She is God of the series, why would she have a limit like that? Not only is she God of the series she is God of all chakra there's no way she can't contain a ridiculous amount of power. In fact her goal is to get all the chakra in the whole world back because she created it. Or maybe Akira didn't feel like drawing a million panels of every centimetre of the blasts journey? There can be any amount of time between two panels in manga just because it appears to happen instantly doesn't mean that's the case, that is the nature of pictures. If I walk across a room and someone takes a picture of me on one side and then the other, GOLLY did I just teleport? No. That's the logic you're using there. Also no because Janemba is sadistic, did you watch the movie by any chance? Even if he's as smart as Gero he has no grasp of their powers, he's going to try torture them and get wrecked. Janemba didn't suffer PIS in that movie his characters sadism is just dumb, same thing with Frieza he could have killed Goku easily whenever he wanted but he didn't and look what happened to him, Janemba suffers a similar fate. Brofist if you have the time you should make that topic you PM'd me about  maybe it would help people understand what power is and how complex it is.
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Definitely not a succubus, fear not | |
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| EMIYA | Jul 4 2014, 05:45 PM Post #75 |
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"I am the bone of my sword."
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Yeah...Th-That topic...that I mentioned... Spoiler: click to toggle
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