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| Base Gotenks Discussion | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Jun 26 2014, 01:11 AM (5,665 Views) | |
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Jun 27 2014, 11:25 PM Post #136 |
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You should see if you can provide proof of purchase of your manga and Viz should allow you to download their app and you can load it on your phone. It makes it 10000x easier for debating. I can open up my tablet at any time and scroll to whatever chapter and page near instantly and boom. My interpretation is that Piccolo isn't quite sure of exactly where Super Buu stacks up against Gotenks, he's leaning towards Super Buu being too much for Gotenks, but for whatever reason isn't 100% positive. Then upon Super Buu arriving on the Lookout, perhaps displaying his power to kill the humans or something causes him to be 100% adamant that Gotenks has zero chance. |
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| * Yu Narukami | Jun 27 2014, 11:29 PM Post #137 |
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Izanagi!
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Thing is, Piccolo goes the direction of refuting Krillin and then does so once he asks again. Going from; ''...That'd be nice, but...'' to ''Can't you tell that fusion hasn't been enough yet?'' tells me that, once Piccolo got out of shock, he still felt the same about Boo's power being superior. |
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| Alex D. Boss | Jun 27 2014, 11:35 PM Post #138 |
 
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SSJ2, I still think Super Boo powered up to open the dimensions. |
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Jun 27 2014, 11:42 PM Post #139 |
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He was leaning that way, but not all the way imo. I could see him being in shock though and it's a lot different to have Super Buu down below and then right here on top of you. It's easier to sense people when they are up close to, so that's what Piccolo is probably getting mad about. Maybe a , Dude ok before he was a thousand miles away but he's literally right here in front of your face and you can't tell? You are an idiot! |
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| + ThePrinceOfSaiyans | Jun 28 2014, 12:43 AM Post #140 |
魔王子
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As much as I hate to admit it, base Gotenks(Post) > SSJ Gotenks(Pre) is very well supported. Not only does Trunks claim Gotenks can fight Buu without using SSJ, but Piccolo also confirms he may stand a chance. Sure you can disregard what Piccolo has to say, but what about Trunks? He may be a cocky individual, but I don't think he's stupid. I really don't want to believe this is the case, but I'm not left with much choice. My ears are open to logical counters, but I don't see really any. Sigh... the Buu arc is really f***ed. |
 Battle Power Guide 3DS FC: 2707-1669-7946 XBL/PSN: MaOujiBejita | |
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| + Kyouks | Jun 28 2014, 01:44 AM Post #141 |
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What makes it silly? Perfect Cell never powered up against Vegeta. So you think Super Boo was several times stronger than SSJ Gotenks, or do you have a very small SSJ3 multiplier? |
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Jun 28 2014, 02:17 AM Post #142 |
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So answer me this. Is Base Goten Post > Ssj Goten Pre? |
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| + Pyrus | Jun 28 2014, 02:32 AM Post #143 |
 
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Don't even try, P. You're getting silly. In general, Evil Boo's initial power, the one right after forming, wasn't noteworthy. The second he went insane and screamed, and the wind and dust kicked up, that's when Piccolo began to question Gotenks' chances against him. Mind you, he still had hope. It's when Boo appears on the Lookout does Piccolo fully admit Gotenks is no match for him and sends the boys into the RoSaT. Boo had to have powered up at some point between forming and going into the RoSaT for Piccolo to change his mind. |
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Jun 28 2014, 02:36 AM Post #144 |
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Haha let's take this there. If Base Goten Post is not superior to Ssj Goten Pre, that means the Ssj multiplier is smaller for Goten than it is Gotenks, or the fusion multiplier grows exponentially with increased strength, which means Gogeta is a god damn beast. I think there are too many flaws here, and the Super Buu >>= Ssj Gotenks is right there and can kind of be tied with the quote and it's really reasonable. |
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| + Pyrus | Jun 28 2014, 02:42 AM Post #145 |
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Gogeta would be a beast regardless. Goku thought he could take down Gotenks-Boo, or normal Evil Boo at the least, and this is after Gotenks' RoSaT increase. If you're one of those guys who doesn't have the adults more than 2-2.5x stronger than the kids, then this should mess you right up. As for the boys, their strength is not noted to have increased by anything worthwhile. If they had, perhaps Piccolo wouldn't have had so much worry in his demeanor until they fused to prove him wrong. Edited by Pyrus, Jun 28 2014, 02:43 AM.
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Jun 28 2014, 02:46 AM Post #146 |
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Well that's the issue. The boys don't seem to be more powerful but Gotenks is ridiculously more powerful yet still weaker than Gogeta? When does it add up? |
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| + Pyrus | Jun 28 2014, 02:55 AM Post #147 |
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It doesn't. It's all plot. Gogeta shouldn't be as strong as he's hypothetically implied to be, but that's what Toriyama wrote him to be. Gotenks got the same treatment. |
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Jun 28 2014, 03:03 AM Post #148 |
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Well that's pretty much what I'm trying to do. Rewrite things in my head so they can come out better in a mathematical format. Like I want to make a list and tell him here's why I had to change x,y,z etc. Like dude, you did a 2.22x amplification in the Saiyan Saga and claimed it to be pure poop, yet have enemies tanking blast left and right at 1.25x gap. Like dude no. Plus, you implied the humans were worth something, which with a boost like this shouldn't be possible. So I had to change these words around. Thinking of doing it for the Pikkon filler as well. Base Gohan vs Broly change that. So essentially I'm at a stage where I'm sort of rewriting things into how I think they should be. You know what I like KP? I like that feeling I get from the Saiyans in DB Multiverse. The regular universe, I guess it's 18 or so, I can't explain it really, but they write them in a way where they can be normal. They can be weak in face of these powerful monsters yet still be cool. That's the problem with AT or TOEI or maybe they are one in the same now. Maybe it was the editor who had kept AT in check all these years and AT was more like TOEI with an obsessive editor who needed to reel him in. Or maybe AT just let's TOEI do what they want more or less nowadays. Anyway, I really like how they properly write the protaganist as weak. It's easy to make the strongest guy the most important, but it takes real skill to make him weaker than others and maintain his status as the main character. That's something that Full Metal Alchemist does wonderfully. The main characters aren't weak by any means and have their storyline, but they don't have to be gods. I mean the Saiyans are like gods from the get go considering Kami and King Kai's strength but Kaioshin is poop too? Then finally you give us a real god only for this monkey butt Saiyan to come near his power? Enough with the never ending power ups to infinity stuff, it's annoying. So yea, I kind of am rewriting things in my own head and I think people would prefer more of a gritty realistic feeling to it than this Goku w***ing left and right. Lol. |
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| Saberoph | Jun 28 2014, 03:36 AM Post #149 |
 
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Well see for me, I don't see how Goten and Trunks couldn't make huge increases with their time in the ROSAT, because of the following... 1. They are noted to have Potential equal to Gohan. 2. Hybrids are shown to make huge increases in a short amount of time, and have on several occasions. 3. It's been proven that when you have a training partner that's close to or equal in power, the increases are larger and quicker. 4. Goten and Trunks knew what was at stake... the Earth and the whole Universe was at risk of destruction if they fail. 5. Trunks knows Vegeta is dead, Goten thinks Gohan is dead and Goten watched his mother murdered before his very eyes. 6. Goten and Trunks had more time outside of Fusion than in it. Fusion only lasts 30 minutes, then an hour has to pass before they can do it again. 7. They children, there's no way they're going to quit training together as soon as one hour passes by, children don't pay attention to time the same way adults do. 8. They're not going to sit still for an hour and do nothing, or stop a certain amount of time before an hour... children their age can't sit still for that long, and this plays off #8. 9. They have to be able to sleep at some point everyday or they won't have enough energy to continue training, so that cuts down even more how many times a day Goten and Trunks can fuse. 10. Gohan trained with a sword for one day and in Base surpassed hi past SS self... and that was with a sword. Now, I understand how people would say The Namek not mentioning Goten and Trunks not increasing means they didn't increase that much, but look at the situation. 1. Before Boo Goten and Trunks only had about a month of real training experience. 2. They have no real fighting experience. 3. They're not very mature. 4. The entire Universe is at stake. 5. They don't have the experience to think on the fly like they're fathers or The Namek. 6. The Namek was worried before he went in the ROSAT. Now all of that would be from The Namek's perspective, leading up to Goten and Trunks fusion. Also, here's another thing to think about... Goten and Trunks wouldn't need to increase their power and could stay relaxed... they know Gotenks can power up and Transform at any time he wants to, so they wouldn't have any need to power up from the start when they're plan was to slowly increase Gotenks power and then hit SS3 after faking being all out of power. |
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Jun 28 2014, 03:52 AM Post #150 |
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Just show me how Gogeta and Goten's powers make sense with Base Gotenks Post > Ssj Gotenks Pre. |
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