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- Would heaven and hell being real be a good thing?
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| Would heaven and hell being real be a good thing? | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: May 13 2014, 11:18 PM (5,952 Views) | |
| * Ketchup Revenge | May 14 2014, 04:52 AM Post #16 |
"Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the war room!"
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I grew up going to Catholic mass every Sunday. Now I'm an Agnostic-Atheist because I've actually read more into religion from an anthropological and philosophical point of view. Once you read into it like that, you find out certain things that really screws with what you've been told, like the fact that Adam had a first wife named Lilith who was banished from Eden because she refused to submit to Adam during sex. Other things you find out was that there was a Gospel of Judas, amongst many other scriptures that never made it into the Bible. You'd also realize that an actual Bible was never compiled until around the year 700 AD. So there was 700 years of early Christians following different scriptures that were never finalized. Does that make these people bad Christians, and who was the one who decided what was to be put in the Bible and what scriptures were going to be left out? |
 The vengeance is her's for as long as she stands by Him. | |
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| Meowth | May 14 2014, 07:13 AM Post #17 |
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I'm not sure hell would be better than reincarnation, but heaven would be, depending on your idea of heaven that is. My idea of heaven would be to be able to experience things you were unable to do so in life, continue to explore hobbies and also exploring the unknown that would be new there. What's the point of reincarnation, you would lose all your memories and experience, for some this might not be a bad thing and they might want to start from a clean slate. My own belief if that when we die, that's it, nothing further, but the concept of an afterlife does sound interesting. |
 
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| + Steve | May 14 2014, 01:49 PM Post #18 |
Greetings. I will be your waifu this season.
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I don't see what would be so great about heaven anyway, unless you were accustomed to the lifestyle that apparently gets you there. People seem to view it as a "you can do whatever you want and everything is magical!" kind of deal but does it not make more sense for you to have to follow the commandments and such still? So you can't just have lots of sex or other debaucherous things and break the rules upon us now. It would be a really restrictive lifestyle, if anything. Probably fine for devout few who live that way anyway. I hold the belief that hell is probably a nicer place generally anyway, why would Satan do what God told him and make hell horrible? If anything he would reward people for going against God's will, as he did. More so than God he is our creator without him we'd just be mindless slaves. So I look more favourably on hell if it turns out heaven and hell are real. Beyond the ideas of God and Satan, heaven and hell the concepts of "good" and "evil" are entirely subjective so I don't think any one religion is going to be correct. To out religion to the side I think that heaven and hell are what you make of them, when you die if you feel like you deserve to be punished your consciousness having left your body creates a world of punishment until you believe you deserve otherwise. So in answer to the original question, it just depends on your opinion and what heaven and hell turn out to be. The Christian/Catholic view of either sound awful and unfair. |
 Definitely not a succubus, fear not | |
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| * Ketchup Revenge | May 14 2014, 02:53 PM Post #19 |
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"Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the war room!"
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I agree. It's similar to a clown. Constant, unyielding happiness is actually pretty creepy and discomforting. I imagine that is the same context when we think about heaven. What you said about good and evil being subjective is 100% true. Morality varies widely with both culture and time. What society considers evil now wasn't so evil back in the biblical days (vice vesa), and what some people consider evil now, others don't. Oddly enough, there's plenty of Christians who believe in non-Christian canon such as poems from authors. For example, many Christians actually believe that Dante Alighieri's depiction of Hell in his epic poem The Divine Comedy is the true Hell. In this poem, there's nine levels to hell, the ninth level being at the deepest part and reserved for the most evil people. Each level is a different grade of punishment, and the punishment gets worse and worse as you get lower into Hell. The ninth level surprisingly is not hot, but freezing cold, as the people are stuck in ice, being too deep in Hell to feel or see Heaven's light and warmth. A lot of Christians also believe in the epic poem of Paradise Lost, from John Milton, which chronicles Lucifer's downfall and banishment to Hell by God. Both of these poems are non-canon, but many Christians believe them as true events. Surprisingly, as much as 25% of Americans who identify themselves as Christian actually believe in reincarnation, which is a belief in Hinduism. |
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The vengeance is her's for as long as she stands by Him. | |
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| SpeedoTrunks | May 14 2014, 04:34 PM Post #20 |
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See now this is all dependant on many things, my biggest thing is if we go off what the bible says Heaven/Hell are like, mainly because what it says and what we think are two completely different things. Example :
So, on the above basis, going to heaven might be terrible as you would be really hot. I've mentioned in previous discussions that I follow a more Buddhist type of philosophy crossed with a healthy dose of science, in which our bodily energy is passed onto something else (Ie the ground/plants and in turn then the animals etc) as of course we and the world/solar system around us are in fact created from the stars themselves. Edited by SpeedoTrunks, May 14 2014, 04:40 PM.
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| Meowth | May 14 2014, 04:58 PM Post #21 |
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=._.=
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I think heaven would be more comparable to Risa for the Star Trek universe with weather control, I don't think you can really look at it from a scientific standpoint because we aren't even sure if it exists or not. |
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May 14 2014, 05:34 PM Post #22 |
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I would hate for them to exist. After 70 odd years on Earth, people should be awarded eternal slumber. |
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| POOHEAD189 | May 14 2014, 05:38 PM Post #23 |
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Hell is essentially a place without God (from what I've heard), which is what makes it eternal suffering. Because without God, all flavor or happiness in life would banish for us. In Heaven, you are in God's domain and full of more happiness than you can ever experience on earth. I think it's justified. If you don't believe or even hate God, then you go to the place that is without him. If you believe and love God, then you go to the place with him. |
| Tha gaol agam ort. <3 | |
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May 14 2014, 05:43 PM Post #24 |
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I'm going to hell then! |
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| * Ketchup Revenge | May 14 2014, 05:58 PM Post #25 |
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"Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the war room!"
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I don't understand how it's punishing you if you already don't believe anyway, or don't accept God. It's pretty much the same thing as living as you did on Earth, just in a different place. |
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The vengeance is her's for as long as she stands by Him. | |
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| POOHEAD189 | May 14 2014, 06:02 PM Post #26 |
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Well the Christian belief is that, even if you don't believe/hate God on earth, you're still within his presence and receive happiness through his grace. Hell is devoid of that. |
| Tha gaol agam ort. <3 | |
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May 14 2014, 06:35 PM Post #27 |
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Hell,Heaven etc Are for the weak minded fools and people who rely on something or someone to do even small things. I personally believe that there is no such thing as hell,heaven etc. And even if they exist,Then on my judgement day I would not choose to go to heaven or hell.I controll my fate,not by some coward pussy s*** god or devil(if they exist that is). I dont mind taking on either of those 2 worthless garbages if have to take a stand on my choice of not opting both hell and heaven on my judgement day. |
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| EMIYA | May 14 2014, 07:17 PM Post #28 |
"I am the bone of my sword."
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The entire points of Heaven and Hell can really be thought of as two ways. The first, Heaven is an idea of acceptance and meaning. Our lives our relatively short and we like to think that there is purpose for us both in life and after it. It doesn't have to be heaven but it could just be an afterlife itself. We like to have this ideology that death isn't just some end and we're forgotten forever but a passing. Likewise, Hell is a state of fear and oppression and it makes sense when you think about it. The church and religion was the top dog in the past, the most prominent of the poltical and social forces. They were the ones who make the rules and what better way to do that than to claim: "Hey, if you do what we say and how we say it...you'll go to this beautiful paradise. But if you dare go against what we say, you're going to the pits and you will burn forever." It's a system of control that the church and religion utilizes to control its masses. Heaven is a positive enforcer, hell is a negative enforcer and religion utilizes these to control the people. The church and religion especially likes to give vivid descriptions of Hell, from fire and brimstone to ice and frozen lakes. Dante's Inferno gave people a vivid description of his own interpretation of Hell. One preacher (and I unfortunately can't recall the name but one of his sermons is very popularly known and you'll probably know whom I'm talking about) gave this huge sermon at one point that's been written down about how vivid and destructive and terrible Hell is and how you're all going to Hell and every person is a sinner. And its only at the end that he actually remarks that you might have a chance. It's a fearful control because you set this stimulus on people and force them to obey your will unless they want to be punished. Heaven itself one could think of partaking into the "meaning of life" We want to think there is meaning in life and we also want to think there is meaning in death. I don't think there's a single prominent culture (Don't quote me on that btw) that has some sort of afterlife, well before Christianity came into being. And many cultures from the ancient past had their own form of Hell. For example, Ancient Greece had multiple terms of the afterlife. It was essentially I believe the Underworld as a whole which was broken into several sections, three I believe being the most prominent were: You had the Fields of Asphodel which was essentially the "purgatory" of the Underworld, where most normal and relatively good people went. There was Elysium, which we would consider as Heaven accept only the most powerful, heroic and important of people went there. and then there of course is Tartarus which we would consider the equivalent of Hell. Religion's today involving an afterlife aren't doing anything new that wasn't done thousands of years before Christianity. The only they are doing is making minor adjustments. Again, you can look at the Greek afterlife and make several comparisons to Christanity's Heaven, Hell and Purgatory. |
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| + Pointer | May 14 2014, 07:29 PM Post #29 |
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it is indeed a good question let me tell you a little story Paul the apostle was once against Christianity, he literally chased and hunt those down who believed that Jesus was the messiah But after his conversion...He changed dramatically from that point on he trully believed that his mission is to help christianity grow even larger. He was chased , tortured, and beated because of his faith... Once he was one of those who trully deny the very basics of christianity as a whole new religion. But soon he becomes one of the greatest apostle of it. He died in the name of Jesus and he truly believed that his mission was the greatest momment /period/ of his life. Now why I mentioned this Because Lets say a man made a lot of sins during his life, but....And it really does not matter when , if this man truly regrets his sins and offer his soul to Jesus ...He will most certainly go to Heaven . There is no hell for those who do this, especially after 35 AD so if theres hell and heaven ....those people who comitted a lot of sins and forget to regret it ,,,,they wont go to heaven directly... On the other hand ...Not even every christians know that it is not true that when somebody dies they go directly to heaven No .....It is only a few who have this privilege... the rest will be "sleeping" till the final revelation. At least Thats what i know in terms of this topic |
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May 15 2014, 01:24 AM Post #30 |
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^^^ Protestant Christians don't believe that at all. |
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