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Comparaison BoG with DBGT
Topic Started: Apr 17 2014, 01:42 AM (8,323 Views)
Venato
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The Saiyan Hunter

I was anyway not sure about the reliability of my first powerscaling : But I have another more reliable: the gift of energy.

Start with DBGT. Indeed, according to Toei, the energy of a Caracther, even half dead, is a great strength. They squarely attributed to three normal Saiyan and a Super Namek weakened enough power to crush the LSSJ! But hey, as debate on two pieces Made in Toei, it poses no problem.

To begin, we will compare the power of donors and DBGT BoG. Note the presence of Gohan, Goten, Pan, Trunks and Vegeta. The fifth gives only in BoG and the third gives in DBGT only during the Baby Saga. On the one hand, we have Pan who is not even born yet in BoG, but the trend is balanced by the fact that all the Z-Team (except Goku and Pan) have neglected their training in DBGT. I know what some will say.

'' If they have neglected their training, why Trunks kills easily Yakon in normal form while Goku had to use the SSJ2? And why Gohan normal rivals with Rildo, who is stronger than Majin Buu ? ''

1)Goku normal is also stronger than Yakon. And they will say to me,'' it is wrong, SSJ Goku = 3,000 kili, 3,000 / 50 = 60 Kili. Yakon = 800. So, Goku is Weaker. '' You think it makes sense kili 60 with the fight? In the manga, Yakon can not even put a single shot and is affected by a kick of Goku. Knowing that Cui was unable to inflict a scratch while Vegeta is only 1 .3 x weaker than him, you think Goku could have done drooling all over Yakon if he was over 10x weaker than him ?

2) An evil death loses power. It is not said, but clearly implied by Toei. Yamcha beats Recoom while Recoom is stronger than Vegeta. Pikkon (with weight) is stronger than Perfect Cell, but weaker than Goku. Similarly, when normal Gohan kills Frieza, all other oponents flee. Among them were opponents Gohan is unable to beat in this form. For example, Bojack who handily beat Gohan, Trunks and Vegeta SSJ. So, why he flee face a Gohan weaker and in his weakest form ?

Well, now I will start my PS. Start with DBGT. As we know, Saiyan 3 Goku are sufficient to recover the energy necessary for its SSJ4 or more. So Goku SSJ4 (Beyond Limits) = 3 Saiyans. Syn Shenron is a little less strong, so 2. But as Li Shenron, he is ten times stronger, so 20.

Now it's the turn of BoG. For Goku SSJG, 6 Saiyans are required. So, Goku = 6. And with the power relations given by AT, Bills = 10 and Whis = 15.


In the end, i have :

1-Gogeta SSJ4 = Beyond 20
2-Omega Shenron = 20
3-Whis = 15
4-Bills = 10
5-Goku SSJG = 6
6-Goku SSJ4 (Beyond Limits) = Vegeta SSJ4 = 3
7-Syn Shenron = 2


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Venato
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Yushin
Apr 17 2014, 06:19 PM
Wait, I'm curious, when exactly did Trunks see Pure Buu? He was unconscious when Pure Buu destroyed Earth.

Trunks knows Good Buu and he only saw Fat Buu and Evil Buu.

I know what you were saying, haha. I'm saying that the majority, including me have Hirudegarn > Gohan-Buu > Janemba.
Hirudegarn should be loads stronger than Janemba. Janemba isn't even stronger than Evil Buu, IMO. The fact that SSJ3 Goku and SSJ2 Vegeta were able to stand up to him, whereas Hirudegarn knocked SSJ3 Gotenks out of Fusion and effortlessly defeated Ultimate Gohan (two characters who are a lot stronger than SSJ3 Goku). Besides, if I'm not mistaken, mot people think Gogeta would need SSJ2 or even SSJ3 to handle Evil Buu, who is considerably weaker than Gohan-Buu.
The "Janemba > Hirudegarn" statement is quite the uneducated statement, besides it has been removed and oddly enough it was never, ever stated anywhere else.
Sorry for double post, but my precedent message is too long. I want say he only saw Good Buu and Evil Buu. I didn't see i write Kid Buu :lol:.

My ranking for Z-Team :

1)Gogeta SSJ4
2)Goku SSJG
3)Vegeta SSJ4
4)Vegito SSJ3
5)Majuub
6)Mystic Gohan
7)Gotenks SSJ3
8)Majin Buu
9)Kibitoshin
10)Pikkon

My ranking for vilains :

1)Omega Shenron
2)Bills
3)Super 17
4)Baby Oozaru
5)Nuova Shenron
6)Eis Shenron
7)Naturon Shenron
8)Hirudegarn
9)Buuhan
10)General Rilldo
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Gogetto
Apr 17 2014, 08:28 PM
I was anyway not sure about the reliability of my first powerscaling : But I have another more reliable: the gift of energy.

Start with DBGT. Indeed, according to Toei, the energy of a Caracther, even half dead, is a great strength. They squarely attributed to three normal Saiyan and a Super Namek weakened enough power to crush the LSSJ! But hey, as debate on two pieces Made in Toei, it poses no problem.

To begin, we will compare the power of donors and DBGT BoG. Note the presence of Gohan, Goten, Pan, Trunks and Vegeta. The fifth gives only in BoG and the third gives in DBGT only during the Baby Saga. On the one hand, we have Pan who is not even born yet in BoG, but the trend is balanced by the fact that all the Z-Team (except Goku and Pan) have neglected their training in DBGT. I know what some will say.

'' If they have neglected their training, why Trunks kills easily Yakon in normal form while Goku had to use the SSJ2? And why Gohan normal rivals with Rildo, who is stronger than Majin Buu ? ''

1)Goku normal is also stronger than Yakon. And they will say to me,'' it is wrong, SSJ Goku = 3,000 kili, 3,000 / 50 = 60 Kili. Yakon = 800. So, Goku is Weaker. '' You think it makes sense kili 60 with the fight? In the manga, Yakon can not even put a single shot and is affected by a kick of Goku. Knowing that Cui was unable to inflict a scratch while Vegeta is only 1 .3 x weaker than him, you think Goku could have done drooling all over Yakon if he was over 10x weaker than him ?

2) An evil death loses power. It is not said, but clearly implied by Toei. Yamcha beats Recoom while Recoom is stronger than Vegeta. Pikkon (with weight) is stronger than Perfect Cell, but weaker than Goku. Similarly, when normal Gohan kills Frieza, all other oponents flee. Among them were opponents Gohan is unable to beat in this form. For example, Bojack who handily beat Gohan, Trunks and Vegeta SSJ. So, why he flee face a Gohan weaker and in his weakest form ?
Perfect Files Vol.1 says Gohan didn't neglect his training for GT.

I entirely disagree with evildoers losing power in death. It's a lot more likely and implied that the heroes are just that strong, ridiculous or not, at that point.
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Venato
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Quote:
 
I entirely disagree with evildoers losing power in death. It's a lot more likely and implied that the heroes are just that strong, ridiculous or not, at that point. 


It there's just one problem with this reasoning. If Gohan normal is stronger than Bojack (who is level Cell Perfect or less), why he was unable to defeat Dabura and Broly in stronger forms ?

Quote:
 
Perfect Files Vol.1 says Gohan didn't neglect his training for GT.



1) Perfect Files are not written by Toei, but by Jump Comics. Proof:

http://dragonball.wikia.com/wiki/Dragon_Ball_GT_Perfect_Files

And Toei completely mocks the Perfect Files. It is therefore not canon GT.

2) There is a lot of nonsense written inside (As SSJ2 is not different from the SSJ thing you notice is obviously false).
Edited by Venato, Apr 18 2014, 08:49 AM.
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My book says Toei wrote it. :(
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Venato
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There are two companion books to the series, called the "Dragon Ball GT Perfect Files", released in May 1997 and December 1997 by Shueisha
's "Jump Comics Selection"imprint.

Source : http://books.shueisha.co.jp/CGI/search/syousai_put.cgi?isbn_cd=4-08-874089-0 and http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragon_Ball_GT#cite_note-18

Traduct them,in english and you will understand Toei have'nt any bond with that.

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At best, I can see those 2 goofballs making it past 10X Kamehameha Absorbed Super 17. I can't see either one of them being stronger than Syn Shenron.
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Gogetto
Apr 18 2014, 03:20 PM
There are two companion books to the series, called the "Dragon Ball GT Perfect Files", released in May 1997 and December 1997 by Shueisha
's "Jump Comics Selection"imprint.

Source : http://books.shueisha.co.jp/CGI/search/syousai_put.cgi?isbn_cd=4-08-874089-0 and http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragon_Ball_GT#cite_note-18

Traduct them,in english and you will understand Toei have'nt any bond with that.

Herms
 
They were published by Shueisha under the Jump Comics label, and copyright Bird Studio, Shueisha, Fuji TV, and Toei Animation. They include reprints of Toriyama's various designs for GT, but he didn't contribute any new artwork, interviews, or other information like with the daizenshuu or SEGs. Which makes sense really, since Toriyama was barely involved in GT. The Perfect Files do however have various notes from the production staff actually responsible for making GT.

There seems to be a lot of misunderstanding and misinformation out there on how this stuff actually works. The idea that Toei or Toriyama would put out books on their own is completely nonsensical. Toei is an animation studio and Toriyama is just a manga artist; they don't own their own book publishing companies. Shueisha publishes all official DB books, including manga volumes, guidebooks, film comic adaptations of the DB movies, and everything else. The Perfect Files are no different.


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Venato
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So, among the donors for Goku (BL), Gohan is the only who train after Dragon ball. But his power does not increase significantly (proved by his defeat against normal Goku GT), he is alway unable to defeat Kid Buu in SSJ, even with Baby boost.

This defeat is a new proof that the villains lose power when they die (Rilldo had trouble against normal Gohan when he was at about the same level as normal Goku)
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Victorious
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Beers loses to Super Baby 1, stated.

Not sure about Whiss.
Victorious' fan made Dragon Ball Z Battle Power (Sentō-ryoku) list
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Victorious
Apr 22 2014, 05:00 PM
Beers loses to Super Baby 1, stated.

Not sure about Whiss.
How is that stated? Super Bebi Vegeta was only stronger than SSJ Vegito whereas Beerus was stated to be "stronger than a Fusion between Goku and Vegeta" meaning he's stronger than SSJ3 Vegito.

You shouldn't mix BoG with GT like that.
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Victorious
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Yusuke Urameshi
Apr 22 2014, 05:54 PM
Victorious
Apr 22 2014, 05:00 PM
Beers loses to Super Baby 1, stated.

Not sure about Whiss.
How is that stated? Super Bebi Vegeta was only stronger than SSJ Vegito whereas Beerus was stated to be "stronger than a Fusion between Goku and Vegeta" meaning he's stronger than SSJ3 Vegito.

You shouldn't mix BoG with GT like that.
The events of GT take place after movie 14 and Goku stated he's never fealt a ki as awesome as Super Baby 1.

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Edited by Victorious, Apr 22 2014, 11:22 PM.
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Event Horizon
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エンペラー

Though, GT was made waaaaaaay before BoG.
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Victorious
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Yushin
Apr 22 2014, 11:34 PM
Though, GT was made waaaaaaay before BoG.
And so? In universe wise BOG would be part of the Z-GT continuum.
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Event Horizon
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エンペラー

Strange how SSJ God was never brought up in GT then.....
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