Messiah

Feb 16 2014, 04:57 PM

Crashbreaka

Feb 16 2014, 02:39 AM

Mind control's a bit of a wild card on Raditz IMO. He might be an idiot, but I think his Saiyan aggression might cut off anyone trying to control him like that.

I think Saiyan minds are not all that complex, if they let someone like Frezia rule them.

Ava Chang

Feb 16 2014, 05:18 PM

Messiah

Feb 16 2014, 04:57 PM

Crashbreaka

Feb 16 2014, 02:39 AM

Mind control's a bit of a wild card on Raditz IMO. He might be an idiot, but I think his Saiyan aggression might cut off anyone trying to control him like that.

I think Saiyan minds are not all that complex, if they let someone like Frezia rule them.

Well considering Freeza was tens of times stronger than the strongest saiyan in his weakest form...

Quote:

 

Vader says out his mouth "The power to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of the Force

lunar2

Feb 17 2014, 01:40 AM

you're forgetting that vader has no way to know to target the tail. you're also forgetting that vader may not be able to apply enough pressure to hurt raditz's tail. do you think if a normal human grabbed raditz by the tail, it would hurt him at all? no, of course not. his high levels of ki bolstering his durability would prevent him from even feeling pain.

Messiah

Feb 17 2014, 01:41 AM

Vader could rip Raditz's tail off with mind control alone.

lunar2

Feb 17 2014, 01:50 AM

Messiah

Feb 17 2014, 01:41 AM

Vader could rip Raditz's tail off with mind control alone.

1. proof that vader's abilities can affect raditz at all? remember that chiaotzu already showed us that ki does defend against psychic powers, which is essentially what the force is.

2. again, vader doesn't know to target raditz's tail. if vader was going to try to affect raditz directly with the force, he'd go for the force choke.

3. ripping off raditz tail would do nothing but piss him off. see goku vs. grandpa gohan. goku immediately recovered as soon as his tail came off.

4. another point is that raditz may be entirely immune to the force. remember the yuuzhan vong were immune to the force because, as extragalactic creatures, they did not interact with it in any way. raditz isn't from the star wars galaxy, either, so he may not be affected by the force no matter powerful vader is.

ThePrinceOfSaiyajins

Feb 17 2014, 01:45 AM

lunar2

Feb 17 2014, 01:40 AM

you're forgetting that vader has no way to know to target the tail. you're also forgetting that vader may not be able to apply enough pressure to hurt raditz's tail. do you think if a normal human grabbed raditz by the tail, it would hurt him at all? no, of course not. his high levels of ki bolstering his durability would prevent him from even feeling pain.

His tail is weak, I'm sure Vader can apply pressure to it. Why would Vader not try? Raditz is an arrogant idiot when someone's BP is much lower than his. The way I see this playing out is Raditz laughing and Vader's BP and toying with him. Vader would strategize and find a method to beat him. When he found said weakness in his tail he would strangle it and proceed to kill Raditz while his power level is very low.

miguelnuva

Feb 17 2014, 04:07 AM

Yuuzhan Vong had to be removed from the Force in some very unnatural way Raditz is not going to be removed the same way.

Vader at his weakest was crushing metal more advanced their our metal now so Raditz's tail shouldn't be much problem.

Also

http://forums.spacebattles.com/threads/darth-vaders-post-suit-most-impressive-feats.263593/

Some of Vader's feats.

This how I think the fight goes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2BeKWWGy5vY


Also Vader chocked someone on the other side of the galaxy. It was Prince Xizor.

lunar2

Feb 17 2014, 05:08 AM

miguelnuva

Feb 17 2014, 04:07 AM

Yuuzhan Vong had to be removed from the Force in some very unnatural way Raditz is not going to be removed the same way.

Vader at his weakest was crushing metal more advanced their our metal now so Raditz's tail shouldn't be much problem.

Also

http://forums.spacebattles.com/threads/darth-vaders-post-suit-most-impressive-feats.263593/

Some of Vader's feats.

This how I think the fight goes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2BeKWWGy5vY


Also Vader chocked someone on the other side of the galaxy. It was Prince Xizor.

1. where was it stated that the yuuzhan vong's force immunity was unnatural? you can't simply assume these things. a more reasonable explanation would be that the force was present in the SW galaxy only. it was a specific evolution of life within that galaxy. remember that although SW is sci-fi, it is meant to have happened in our universe, a long time ago in a galaxy far, far away. there is no force in our galaxy, in case you haven't noticed.

2. again. the tail is a non issue even if vader can affect it. you know why? because vader doesn't know about the tail's vulnerability and has no way to find out about it unless raditz is stupid enough to tell him, which raditz isn't. there is no "oh he'll experiment and find out eventually". no, he won't. he'll try to crush raditz's throat, that won't work, and then give up on squeezing because he'll conclude that it doesn't work. the throat is one of the most vulnerable parts on the body. if you aren't strong enough to damage that, you aren't strong enough to damage anything.

so again, vader is left with 2 options. lightsaber, and mountain. and he's not fast enough to land a hit with either one.

lunar2

Feb 17 2014, 06:20 PM

2. vader's ability is of the "what happens in the next ten seconds" variety. mace windu is the one who notices weak points. if this were mace vs. raditz, i'd give it to mace. but vader doesn't have that ability. unless raditz either says something about the weakness or thinks of it, vader has no way of knowing. but raditz would have no reason to even think of his tail during the fight, so vader won't get that information even from reading raditz's mind.

3. really? show me where obi-wan and vader are shown moving at speeds of over 3700 mph. you can't, btw, because it never happened. none of the movies or the animated series show them moving that fast, and none of the books or comics state that they move that fast.

on the other hand, we have an explicit statement that the droid from shadows of the empire is 4 times as fast as a human, and that luke is a little bit faster. this is just a couple of weeks before RotJ, and luke had no significant training between his fight with the droid and his fight with vader, so he didn't get faster between the two fights. and yet, when he fights vader, they are roughly equal in speed. therefore, we have a very explicit chain of feats and statements putting vader at a little over 4 times as fast as a human.

also, the force can't even protect jedi from bullets, how is it going to protect vader from a ki blast moving much faster than a bullet? and vader isn't moving that light saber nearly fast enough to touch raditz with it. and even if it did hit raditz, it would only burn him, not cut him. ki protects the body from kinetic energy, meaning the plasma loop won't cut raditz. however, the heat of the plasma will still burn him.