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Base Goku and Ultimate Gohan; Fusion
Topic Started: Dec 23 2013, 05:53 PM (2,937 Views)
+ Solid Snake Dec 23 2013, 05:53 PM Post #1
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滅Are you frightened?

 Can Super Saiyan Gogeta (made of Gohan) really beat Buutenks?

I believe so because looking at Super Saiyan Gotenks pre ROSAT, his power level was a bit higher than that of Super Saiyan 3 Goku's. When the kids, as Gotenks, later trained in the ROSAT his base form alone was comparable to his Super Saiyan state prior he entered the ROSAT, not accounting their Super Saiyan 2 state, they later ascended to level 3 and were a fair degree stronger than Super Buu, whose power is nigh compared to even Super Saiyan 3 Goku's. Now keep in mind the kids, individually are still weaker than Goku and Vegeta post ROSAT.

SSJ3 Goku < SSJ Gotenks pre ROSAT ~ < Base Gotenks post ROSAT < SSJ Gotenks post ROSAT < SSJ2 Gotenks post ROSAT < Super Buu < / < SSJ3 Gotenks post ROSAT

When Goku is granted his life back by Elder Kaioshin he says how does he plan on to defeat Buutenks, which Goku responses by saying Fusion Dance.


Now lets fast forward a little, why would Goku suggest if he should turn into a Super Saiyan first before joining bodies with Gohan? Keep in mind that Potara Gokhan and Vegito are going to be different in terms of power (according to you guys past debates about a theoretical Potara Goku and Gohan Fusion) and that they were both plotted to be used against Buutenks (Gokhan) and Buuhan (Vegito). And later we see the Potara fused Vegito instantly go Super Saiyan as a starting off point to combat Buuhan, Vegito, who actually had no idea how powerful he be but he decided to fight in a state weaker than Super Saiyan 3, even if he wanted to rescue his family and Piccolo, he had no idea how strong he was gonna be. IMO this implies that the Super Saiyan is really what Goku meant when he mentioned the Fusion Dance.

So how could it be that Gogeta (Gohan fused) wouldn't be enough as a Super Saiyan to defeat Buutenks? Goku had a clearer understanding of how strong two fused Saiyans would be after having witnessed the power increase in Other World from the creators of the technique.


Kids post ROSAT < Base Adults < SSJ3 Goku < SSJ Gotenks pre ROSAT ~ < Base Gotenks post ROSAT < SSJ Gotenks post ROSAT < SSJ2 Gotenks post ROSAT < Super Buu < / < SSJ3 Gotenks post ROSAT ~ < Ultimate Gohan < Buutenks ~ < SSJ Gogeta (Gohan)

Is what I came up with
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* Ketchup Revenge Dec 23 2013, 06:37 PM Post #2
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"Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the war room!"

 If you're like me, who believes that the power scales in the Boo arc are completely different from from what we see earlier in the series (because the series at this point in time wasn't written in the same way it was in the Freeza Arc), than it's entirely possible to me.

I really honestly believe that Goku and Ultimate Gohan are closer in power than we've been lead to believe, and that the Super Saiyan multipliers are completely null and void at this point in time. Toriyama didn't even remember Launch's entire existence as a character, what makes us believe that he remembered to base the story around some innocuous multipliers from earlier in the series?
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Yuli Ban Dec 23 2013, 06:51 PM Post #3
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 Just saying, he wouldn't be called Gogeta if he fused with Gohan.


Gohu?
Quote:
 
Think of it as how a Saiyan's entire outfit can change if they go Super Saiyan.

So....His shoes are Super Saiyan 4?

Here's the the glorious position of being part of DBZ forums' prestiged Member #OVER 9000 club.
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+ Solid Snake Dec 23 2013, 06:57 PM Post #4
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滅Are you frightened?

 It's not that I believe Gohan to be near equal with Goku that just the Fusion Dance between the two was actually more than enough, as a Super Saiyan.

Goku was confident that they could beat Buutenks, and Elder Kaioshin doesn't negate this answer, power-wise, but due to the process being too slow was risky. So not only should the Fusion Dance be just a tad bit weaker the results were surely going to have Super Saiyan Gogeta stronger than Buutenks imo.

@ Sky Hedgehogian Maestro Ik I just couldn't think of an alternative name for a Fusion of those two.
Edited by Solid Snake, Dec 23 2013, 06:58 PM.
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Mightiest Gohan Dec 23 2013, 07:18 PM Post #5
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 SSJ3 Gokan was enough to beat Bootenks but not SSJ.
Super Buu: So, hotshot! You want to fight Majin Buu?
Gohan: Fight you? No. I wanna kill you!
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+ Solid Snake Dec 23 2013, 07:20 PM Post #6
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滅Are you frightened?
Mightiest Gohan
Dec 23 2013, 07:18 PM
SSJ3 Gokan was enough to beat Bootenks but not SSJ.
Give me one reason why it couldn't be Super Saiyan Gogeta alone? Like I said before Vegito had no idea if he was going to be vastly stronger than Buuhan, so why not for Gogeta, he had more understanding of the Dance than the Potara.
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Shinnozou tomete kureru! ~ Evil Ryu


SSJG and SSJ4 Goku Sig

Dragon Ball: Ultimate Road Story

Naruto and Goku's Adventure Story
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Mightiest Gohan Dec 23 2013, 07:33 PM Post #7
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xGOKUdaSAVIORx
Dec 23 2013, 07:20 PM
Mightiest Gohan
Dec 23 2013, 07:18 PM
SSJ3 Gokan was enough to beat Bootenks but not SSJ.
Give me one reason why it couldn't be Super Saiyan Gogeta alone? Like I said before Vegito had no idea if he was going to be vastly stronger than Buuhan, so why not for Gogeta, he had more understanding of the Dance than the Potara.
SSJ Vegito was stronger than he expected because of the Rival Boost. He didn't knew that he would get the Rival Boost because he never saw it's power. Elder Kai clearly stated Potara is better than the Fusion Dance.
Super Buu: So, hotshot! You want to fight Majin Buu?
Gohan: Fight you? No. I wanna kill you!
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+ Solid Snake Dec 23 2013, 07:42 PM Post #8
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滅Are you frightened?
Mightiest Gohan
Dec 23 2013, 07:33 PM
xGOKUdaSAVIORx
Dec 23 2013, 07:20 PM
Mightiest Gohan
Dec 23 2013, 07:18 PM
SSJ3 Gokan was enough to beat Bootenks but not SSJ.
Give me one reason why it couldn't be Super Saiyan Gogeta alone? Like I said before Vegito had no idea if he was going to be vastly stronger than Buuhan, so why not for Gogeta, he had more understanding of the Dance than the Potara.
SSJ Vegito was stronger than he expected because of the Rival Boost. He didn't knew that he would get the Rival Boost because he never saw it's power. Elder Kai clearly stated Potara is better than the Fusion Dance.
better isn't defined all that much, like how AT agrees that a 1.5x is great enough for Whis to be stronger than Birusu. And I know of the boost and I accounted that with in my first post they still didn't know if they were gonna match Buuhan's strength so it would have been slightly more logical for them to ascend to Vegito's strongest state Super Saiyan 3, instead of 1 like how Goku most likely was gonna do with Gohan, before the mentioning of the Potara.
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Shinnozou tomete kureru! ~ Evil Ryu


SSJG and SSJ4 Goku Sig

Dragon Ball: Ultimate Road Story

Naruto and Goku's Adventure Story
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Mightiest Gohan Dec 23 2013, 09:05 PM Post #9
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xGOKUdaSAVIORx
Dec 23 2013, 07:42 PM
Mightiest Gohan
Dec 23 2013, 07:33 PM
xGOKUdaSAVIORx
Dec 23 2013, 07:20 PM
Mightiest Gohan
Dec 23 2013, 07:18 PM
SSJ3 Gokan was enough to beat Bootenks but not SSJ.
Give me one reason why it couldn't be Super Saiyan Gogeta alone? Like I said before Vegito had no idea if he was going to be vastly stronger than Buuhan, so why not for Gogeta, he had more understanding of the Dance than the Potara.
SSJ Vegito was stronger than he expected because of the Rival Boost. He didn't knew that he would get the Rival Boost because he never saw it's power. Elder Kai clearly stated Potara is better than the Fusion Dance.
better isn't defined all that much, like how AT agrees that a 1.5x is great enough for Whis to be stronger than Birusu. And I know of the boost and I accounted that with in my first post they still didn't know if they were gonna match Buuhan's strength so it would have been slightly more logical for them to ascend to Vegito's strongest state Super Saiyan 3, instead of 1 like how Goku most likely was gonna do with Gohan, before the mentioning of the Potara.
Goku knew Vegito could beat Boohan. He knew Potara's power due to Kibitoshin so Goku could think about Vegito's SSJ. Because Vegito's power was more than he expected due to Rival Boost, Boohan was beaten pretty badly.
Super Buu: So, hotshot! You want to fight Majin Buu?
Gohan: Fight you? No. I wanna kill you!
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
* Ketchup Revenge Dec 23 2013, 09:41 PM Post #10
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"Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the war room!"
Sky Hedgehogian Maestro
Dec 23 2013, 06:51 PM
Just saying, he wouldn't be called Gogeta if he fused with Gohan.


Gohu?
Tad unrelated, but I've actually referred to him as "Kuhan".
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Mightiest Gohan Dec 23 2013, 10:25 PM Post #11
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 Hanku sounds better. ;)
Edited by Mightiest Gohan, Dec 24 2013, 09:26 AM.
Super Buu: So, hotshot! You want to fight Majin Buu?
Gohan: Fight you? No. I wanna kill you!
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+ Solid Snake Dec 24 2013, 03:06 AM Post #12
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滅Are you frightened?
Mightiest Gohan
Dec 23 2013, 09:05 PM
xGOKUdaSAVIORx
Dec 23 2013, 07:42 PM
Mightiest Gohan
Dec 23 2013, 07:33 PM
xGOKUdaSAVIORx
Dec 23 2013, 07:20 PM
Mightiest Gohan
Dec 23 2013, 07:18 PM
SSJ3 Gokan was enough to beat Bootenks but not SSJ.
Give me one reason why it couldn't be Super Saiyan Gogeta alone? Like I said before Vegito had no idea if he was going to be vastly stronger than Buuhan, so why not for Gogeta, he had more understanding of the Dance than the Potara.
SSJ Vegito was stronger than he expected because of the Rival Boost. He didn't knew that he would get the Rival Boost because he never saw it's power. Elder Kai clearly stated Potara is better than the Fusion Dance.
better isn't defined all that much, like how AT agrees that a 1.5x is great enough for Whis to be stronger than Birusu. And I know of the boost and I accounted that with in my first post they still didn't know if they were gonna match Buuhan's strength so it would have been slightly more logical for them to ascend to Vegito's strongest state Super Saiyan 3, instead of 1 like how Goku most likely was gonna do with Gohan, before the mentioning of the Potara.
Goku knew Vegito could beat Boohan. He knew Potara's power due to Kibitoshin so Goku could think about Vegito's SSJ. Because Vegito's power was more than he expected due to Rival Boost, Boohan was beaten pretty badly.
Goku had no idea if Vegito would win either, he was skeptical if even Vegeta and him were going to raise to his level. The Potara's power differs from user to user.
Posted Image
Shinnozou tomete kureru! ~ Evil Ryu


SSJG and SSJ4 Goku Sig

Dragon Ball: Ultimate Road Story

Naruto and Goku's Adventure Story
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Mightiest Gohan Dec 24 2013, 09:25 AM Post #13
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xGOKUdaSAVIORx
Dec 24 2013, 03:06 AM
Mightiest Gohan
Dec 23 2013, 09:05 PM
xGOKUdaSAVIORx
Dec 23 2013, 07:42 PM
Mightiest Gohan
Dec 23 2013, 07:33 PM
xGOKUdaSAVIORx
Dec 23 2013, 07:20 PM
Mightiest Gohan
Dec 23 2013, 07:18 PM
SSJ3 Gokan was enough to beat Bootenks but not SSJ.
Give me one reason why it couldn't be Super Saiyan Gogeta alone? Like I said before Vegito had no idea if he was going to be vastly stronger than Buuhan, so why not for Gogeta, he had more understanding of the Dance than the Potara.
SSJ Vegito was stronger than he expected because of the Rival Boost. He didn't knew that he would get the Rival Boost because he never saw it's power. Elder Kai clearly stated Potara is better than the Fusion Dance.
better isn't defined all that much, like how AT agrees that a 1.5x is great enough for Whis to be stronger than Birusu. And I know of the boost and I accounted that with in my first post they still didn't know if they were gonna match Buuhan's strength so it would have been slightly more logical for them to ascend to Vegito's strongest state Super Saiyan 3, instead of 1 like how Goku most likely was gonna do with Gohan, before the mentioning of the Potara.
Goku knew Vegito could beat Boohan. He knew Potara's power due to Kibitoshin so Goku could think about Vegito's SSJ. Because Vegito's power was more than he expected due to Rival Boost, Boohan was beaten pretty badly.
Goku had no idea if Vegito would win either, he was skeptical if even Vegeta and him were going to raise to his level. The Potara's power differs from user to user.
Goku had no idea???? :huh:

Chapter: 503 (DBZ 309), P8.8
Context: Goku tries to get Vegeta to use the Potara with him, but Vegeta refuses
Goku: “Knowing you, I thought you might say that…! There ain’t any other way to beat Majin Boo!”



Edited by Mightiest Gohan, Dec 24 2013, 09:29 AM.
Super Buu: So, hotshot! You want to fight Majin Buu?
Gohan: Fight you? No. I wanna kill you!
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+ Solid Snake Dec 24 2013, 04:35 PM Post #14
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滅Are you frightened?
Mightiest Gohan
Dec 24 2013, 09:25 AM
xGOKUdaSAVIORx
Dec 24 2013, 03:06 AM
Mightiest Gohan
Dec 23 2013, 09:05 PM
xGOKUdaSAVIORx
Dec 23 2013, 07:42 PM
Mightiest Gohan
Dec 23 2013, 07:33 PM
xGOKUdaSAVIORx
Dec 23 2013, 07:20 PM
Mightiest Gohan
Dec 23 2013, 07:18 PM
SSJ3 Gokan was enough to beat Bootenks but not SSJ.
Give me one reason why it couldn't be Super Saiyan Gogeta alone? Like I said before Vegito had no idea if he was going to be vastly stronger than Buuhan, so why not for Gogeta, he had more understanding of the Dance than the Potara.
SSJ Vegito was stronger than he expected because of the Rival Boost. He didn't knew that he would get the Rival Boost because he never saw it's power. Elder Kai clearly stated Potara is better than the Fusion Dance.
better isn't defined all that much, like how AT agrees that a 1.5x is great enough for Whis to be stronger than Birusu. And I know of the boost and I accounted that with in my first post they still didn't know if they were gonna match Buuhan's strength so it would have been slightly more logical for them to ascend to Vegito's strongest state Super Saiyan 3, instead of 1 like how Goku most likely was gonna do with Gohan, before the mentioning of the Potara.
Goku knew Vegito could beat Boohan. He knew Potara's power due to Kibitoshin so Goku could think about Vegito's SSJ. Because Vegito's power was more than he expected due to Rival Boost, Boohan was beaten pretty badly.
Goku had no idea if Vegito would win either, he was skeptical if even Vegeta and him were going to raise to his level. The Potara's power differs from user to user.
Goku had no idea???? :huh:

Chapter: 503 (DBZ 309), P8.8
Context: Goku tries to get Vegeta to use the Potara with him, but Vegeta refuses
Goku: “Knowing you, I thought you might say that…! There ain’t any other way to beat Majin Boo!”



You misunderstood bud I'm referring to the time Goku suggests the Dance with Gohan to fight Buutenks. Elder Kaioshin never downplays it he just assumed Buu isn't going to wait for the two two fuse, so he gave them the Potara.
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Shinnozou tomete kureru! ~ Evil Ryu


SSJG and SSJ4 Goku Sig

Dragon Ball: Ultimate Road Story

Naruto and Goku's Adventure Story
Member Online View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Mightiest Gohan Dec 24 2013, 06:37 PM Post #15
Member Avatar
xGOKUdaSAVIORx
Dec 24 2013, 04:35 PM
Mightiest Gohan
Dec 24 2013, 09:25 AM
xGOKUdaSAVIORx
Dec 24 2013, 03:06 AM
Mightiest Gohan
Dec 23 2013, 09:05 PM
xGOKUdaSAVIORx
Dec 23 2013, 07:42 PM
Mightiest Gohan
Dec 23 2013, 07:33 PM
xGOKUdaSAVIORx
Dec 23 2013, 07:20 PM
Mightiest Gohan
Dec 23 2013, 07:18 PM
SSJ3 Gokan was enough to beat Bootenks but not SSJ.
Give me one reason why it couldn't be Super Saiyan Gogeta alone? Like I said before Vegito had no idea if he was going to be vastly stronger than Buuhan, so why not for Gogeta, he had more understanding of the Dance than the Potara.
SSJ Vegito was stronger than he expected because of the Rival Boost. He didn't knew that he would get the Rival Boost because he never saw it's power. Elder Kai clearly stated Potara is better than the Fusion Dance.
better isn't defined all that much, like how AT agrees that a 1.5x is great enough for Whis to be stronger than Birusu. And I know of the boost and I accounted that with in my first post they still didn't know if they were gonna match Buuhan's strength so it would have been slightly more logical for them to ascend to Vegito's strongest state Super Saiyan 3, instead of 1 like how Goku most likely was gonna do with Gohan, before the mentioning of the Potara.
Goku knew Vegito could beat Boohan. He knew Potara's power due to Kibitoshin so Goku could think about Vegito's SSJ. Because Vegito's power was more than he expected due to Rival Boost, Boohan was beaten pretty badly.
Goku had no idea if Vegito would win either, he was skeptical if even Vegeta and him were going to raise to his level. The Potara's power differs from user to user.
Goku had no idea???? :huh:

Chapter: 503 (DBZ 309), P8.8
Context: Goku tries to get Vegeta to use the Potara with him, but Vegeta refuses
Goku: “Knowing you, I thought you might say that…! There ain’t any other way to beat Majin Boo!”



You misunderstood bud I'm referring to the time Goku suggests the Dance with Gohan to fight Buutenks. Elder Kaioshin never downplays it he just assumed Buu isn't going to wait for the two two fuse, so he gave them the Potara.
The Fusion Dance Gokan was enough to beat Bootenks stated by Elder Kai and Goku. But Boohan said that he would beat Gogeta (who was equal to Gokan) means he was referring to SSJ3. So only SSJ3 Gogeta could beat Bootenks.
Super Buu: So, hotshot! You want to fight Majin Buu?
Gohan: Fight you? No. I wanna kill you!
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