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19/20 Cyborg Absorption Flawed?
Topic Started: Jul 28 2013, 02:58 PM (910 Views)
SuperSaiyan1993
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Super Saiyan among Super Saiyans

How is it that

Piccolo > #20 + Vegeta's Ki Blast + Majority of Piccolo's Energy (+ technically Yamcha)


Is it that Piccolo was heavily suppressed and thus #20 couldn't access his vast battle ki making it:


Piccolo FP > #20 + Vegeta's Ki Blast + Suppressed Piccolo's Energy


Or is it that the 19/20 model doesn't increase one's own battle power that much?


It could go either way honestly but IMO it's more inclined toward the latter.

Gotta admit though, total defense against ki attacks is still a huge pro
We Super Saiyans are in a league of our own.
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+ Pyrus
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I'm beginning to think Gero's calculations are just off.
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+ Kyouks
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With #20 it isn't that bad really, it gets weird with #19 and the Kamehameha though.
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FamousBueller
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Super Asian

how>

19 (post Kamehameha) > Ssj Goku > 19

that makes perfect sense

now Ssj Vegeta (big bang attack) > 19 (post ssj vegetas energy) > Ssj Vegeta (drained) that's kinda confusing to me and the whole 20 thing is confusing
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Indestructible Super Gohan
 
According to the quote he says that he’ll be able to win against Vegeta, not surpass him:

Chapter: 345 (DBZ 151), P14.7
Context: after seeing that Gohan, Tenshinhan, Piccolo, and Kuririn had followed him
No.20: “If I collect their energy and add it to my own, I’ll be able to win against Vegeta!”

#20 is shown to have rudimentary understanding of Ki and whatever readings he may have gotten could not be taken accurately. Had he been so confident in his calculations, he wouldn’t have retreated when Vegeta was at a clearly disadvantaged state. His function is to steal energy, and that’s what the terrain gives a potential leverage on; his goal is not to best Vegeta in combat.

Oh, to answer your original question, Piccolo stated himself that he was suppressed, so the power No.20 took was meaningless. His suppressed power was below Base Vegeta.
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FamousBueller
Jul 28 2013, 05:03 PM
how>

19 (post Kamehameha) > Ssj Goku > 19

that makes perfect sense
It makes sense when you just look at it as a chain. It doesn't really make sense numerically unless you make 19 or the KHH far weaker than they seem.
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SuperSaiyan1993
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Super Saiyan among Super Saiyans

ObsessiveFanGuy
Jul 28 2013, 06:14 PM
Indestructible Super Gohan
 
According to the quote he says that he’ll be able to win against Vegeta, not surpass him:

Chapter: 345 (DBZ 151), P14.7
Context: after seeing that Gohan, Tenshinhan, Piccolo, and Kuririn had followed him
No.20: “If I collect their energy and add it to my own, I’ll be able to win against Vegeta!”

#20 is shown to have rudimentary understanding of Ki and whatever readings he may have gotten could not be taken accurately. Had he been so confident in his calculations, he wouldn’t have retreated when Vegeta was at a clearly disadvantaged state. His function is to steal energy, and that’s what the terrain gives a potential leverage on; his goal is not to best Vegeta in combat.

Oh, to answer your original question, Piccolo stated himself that he was suppressed, so the power No.20 took was meaningless. His suppressed power was below Base Vegeta.
Ah, that makes perfect sense. Thanks
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Coolest
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Another example of people trying to apply math and logic to a plot device.
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POOHEAD189
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Coolest
Jul 28 2013, 10:44 PM
Another example of people trying to apply math and logic to a plot device.
We can't help it. LOGIC AND REASON GUIDE OUR LIVES IN THIS CHAOTIC STATE WE CALL LIFE
Tha gaol agam ort. <3
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Coolest
Jul 28 2013, 10:44 PM
Another example of people trying to apply math and logic to a plot device.
What's the plot device?
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* Ketchup Revenge
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"Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the war room!"

If Vegeta's blast was concentrated, than it makes perfect sense. With concentrated blasts, it's not the ki amount that makes it strong, but the concentration of the ki that does.
Gero himself can only absorb ki amount. Ki amount itself does not equate to battle power. Think of "battle power" less as ki amount and more as the "damage potential" from that ki.

For example: Think of snow, and then think of the damage potential of snow being thrown at someone as the "power level".
If you have a handful of snow and throw it at someone, it wouldn't do much damage. The "power level" is low.
But take that exact same amount of snow and pack it into a ball (concentrating it). The potential for it to cause damage goes up. The tighter its packed, the higher chance for damage, but it's still the exact same amount of snow that it's always been.

Vegeta could've had the same amount of ki in that blast that he would've had in a basic one, but increased the concentration.
Gero himself can only absorb the ki amount used. Whether or not he can concentrate that ki and get the same damage rate as Vegeta depends on Gero's ability.

We also have to consider that Piccolo was in a suppressed state. His ki didn't actually drop, but with a lower concentration or flow, it would take longer for Gero to absorb a lot of it. Gohan interrupting them no doubt saved Gero from getting a lot of ki as well.
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Mihawk
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Coolest
Jul 28 2013, 10:44 PM
Another example of people trying to apply math and logic to a plot device.
Weren't you the one trying to say Bills isn't a galaxy buster because of science? Same thing different perspective (even if you're going to try to differentiate them).

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IllogicalGlory
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Furious

Does #19 ever surpass #20 (initial)?
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"Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the war room!"

IllogicalGlory
Jul 28 2013, 11:48 PM
Does #19 ever surpass #20 (initial)?
I think he would after he absorbed Goku's ki as well as the chunk he got from Vegeta when he grabbed him.
Edited by Ketchup Revenge, Jul 28 2013, 11:52 PM.
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SSJ
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IllogicalGlory
Jul 28 2013, 11:48 PM
Does #19 ever surpass #20 (initial)?
No. 20 was worried about 19 getting greedy, hence why he wanted the rest of the Z fighter's energy.
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