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SSJ Gotenks (Post-ROSAT) Vs SSJ Gogeta
Topic Started: Jul 25 2013, 02:26 PM (6,748 Views)
AA500 Jul 26 2013, 07:10 AM Post #181
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Hurry My Curry
Jul 26 2013, 06:51 AM
Well let me ask you something. When you say that small individual gains -> big gains fused, that would mean the amount of power Goten gained (only Goten, because Trunks is still stronger) led them from being weaker to Super Boo as SSjin's to being on par or stronger in base. That's a 10 or 50x difference in power AT LEAST.

That said, you can see why I'm skeptical to believe that smaller gains individually = big gains fused. That would lead to there being an absurd power difference between Gogeta and Gotenks. I'm of the mindset that we cannot make all the statements work, they're not supposed to as fusion doesn't really make sense anyway.
You can make the argument that the fusion it self makes the gains while the unfused form gains nothing, this can be supported with the fact that Gotenks was shown training most of the time, rather than Goten or Trunks
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Hurry My Curry Jul 26 2013, 07:10 AM Post #182
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Master Troll

 Enough with the riddles man, you ain't the riddles hahah! Explain thyself LOL.

Edit - This was aimed at Obsessivefanguy.

And the guy above, Gotenks can only be fused for 30 minutes. For the next hour (is it an hour?) they have to be unfused.
Edited by Hurry My Curry, Jul 26 2013, 07:15 AM.
Miles for mod
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EMIYA Jul 26 2013, 07:12 AM Post #183
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"I am the bone of my sword."

 @KP so you actually have a fairly large gap between Gogeta and Pre-Gotenks to start out with, 44x if I did my math correctly.
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+ Pyrus Jul 26 2013, 07:27 AM Post #184
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 Not really. I completely made those levels up on the spot. I don't have a BP list these days. I just wanted to see reactions.

HMC, it all has to do with mastering fusion.
Spoiler: click to toggle
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Hurry My Curry Jul 26 2013, 07:37 AM Post #185
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Master Troll

 I've been out of the loop for longer than I had hoped, I'm gonna need you to be more specific LOL!
Miles for mod
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Sjk8 Jul 26 2013, 09:01 AM Post #186
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史上最強の孫悟空

 It has been probably already said in one of the 13 pages before, but Gogeta has to be, at least, on par with Gotenks, because of this:

Chapter: 506 (DBZ 312), P13.1
Context: still talking about how they're no match for Boo
Goku: "...But there is one way we can win!"
Vegeta: "You want to say Fusion, right? Well who cares about that?!"
Goku: "Huh? You know about it?"
Vegeta: "I saw it from the afterlife... You've got to be joking! You think I'd perform those ugly poses...?! Anyway, I thought I told you that I'm not going to merge with you a second time."
A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has even a chance to get its pants on
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Dartlard Jul 26 2013, 01:54 PM Post #187
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Ssj Gogeta by that
Ssj Gogeta > Super Boo
Ssj Vegito > Super Gohan-Boo, seems a fair gap between 2 same people, with different methods.
Edited by Dartlard, Jul 26 2013, 01:55 PM.
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Sjk8 Jul 26 2013, 02:08 PM Post #188
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史上最強の孫悟空
Dartlard
Jul 26 2013, 01:54 PM
Ssj Gogeta by that
Ssj Gogeta > Super Boo
Ssj Vegito > Super Gohan-Boo, seems a fair gap between 2 same people, with different methods.


It actually doesn't imply the Ssj form, it simply says "Gogeta would win".
But we can be pretty sure it isn't Ssj Gogeta because, against Boohan, Goku said Potara was the only way to win, while Boohan himself states a fusion of Goku and Vegeta wouldn't stop him.
Since the gap between Boohan and plain Super Boo is way smaller than the gap between Ssj and Ssj3, it's strongly implied that Ssj Gogeta wouldn't get the job done against Super Boo.
A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has even a chance to get its pants on
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Never argue with ignorant people, because they drag you down to their level and then they beat you with experience
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Dartlard Jul 26 2013, 02:16 PM Post #189
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Sjk8
Jul 26 2013, 02:08 PM
Dartlard
Jul 26 2013, 01:54 PM
Ssj Gogeta by that
Ssj Gogeta > Super Boo
Ssj Vegito > Super Gohan-Boo, seems a fair gap between 2 same people, with different methods.


It actually doesn't imply the Ssj form, it simply says "Gogeta would win".
But we can be pretty sure it isn't Ssj Gogeta because, against Boohan, Goku said Potara was the only way to win, while Boohan himself states a fusion of Goku and Vegeta wouldn't stop him.
Since the gap between Boohan and plain Super Boo is way smaller than the gap between Ssj and Ssj3, it's strongly implied that Ssj Gogeta wouldn't get the job done against Super Boo.
Maybe you forgot that Old Kai didn't want Goku to fuse with Gohan using the dance, since Super Bootenks wouldn't allow them to.

And Super Boohan definately had no interest of letting Goku and Vegeta fuse since he was trying to stop their fusion all together.
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Sjk8 Jul 26 2013, 02:29 PM Post #190
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史上最強の孫悟空
Dartlard
Jul 26 2013, 02:16 PM
Sjk8
Jul 26 2013, 02:08 PM
Dartlard
Jul 26 2013, 01:54 PM
Ssj Gogeta by that
Ssj Gogeta > Super Boo
Ssj Vegito > Super Gohan-Boo, seems a fair gap between 2 same people, with different methods.


It actually doesn't imply the Ssj form, it simply says "Gogeta would win".
But we can be pretty sure it isn't Ssj Gogeta because, against Boohan, Goku said Potara was the only way to win, while Boohan himself states a fusion of Goku and Vegeta wouldn't stop him.
Since the gap between Boohan and plain Super Boo is way smaller than the gap between Ssj and Ssj3, it's strongly implied that Ssj Gogeta wouldn't get the job done against Super Boo.
Maybe you forgot that Old Kai didn't want Goku to fuse with Gohan using the dance, since Super Bootenks wouldn't allow them to.

And Super Boohan definately had no interest of letting Goku and Vegeta fuse since he was trying to stop their fusion all together.


Bootenks has nothing to do here since it's never contradicted that a fusion dance of Goku and Gohan (which should be equal to Gogeta) would beat him, indeed it's Gogeta (in general terms) > Bootenks.
As for Boohan, it's a different thing, since we have two statements never contradicted against Gogeta, one from Goku and one from Boohan himself.
Boohan initially gave some minutes to Goku so that he could choose who to fuse with; after that, he simply wanted to kill him.
Then, he sensed Vegeta, and stated that a fusion of Goku and Vegeta wouldn't beat him (never contradicted, and, unlike Bootenks, he was 100% sure of that).
Also, Boohan was far away when Goku and Vegeta were talking, so they could have used the fusion dance: Goku knew Potara was forever (like a Swarovski), so why disappear in a new body forever when a 30 minutes fusion would have been enough?
Despite all that, Goku told Vegeta that Potara was their only chance (second statement never contradicted).

There's evidence for Gogeta to be > Super Boo and probably Bootenks, but there's no evidence at all for him to be > Boohan.
A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has even a chance to get its pants on
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Dartlard Jul 26 2013, 02:33 PM Post #191
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You are talking without the context how Vegeta hated Goku.
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Sjk8 Jul 26 2013, 02:40 PM Post #192
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史上最強の孫悟空
Dartlard
Jul 26 2013, 02:33 PM
You are talking without the context how Vegeta hated Goku.


And despite that, in that situation of danger, he fused with him, putting aside his pride.
That's not a point.
A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has even a chance to get its pants on
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Never argue with ignorant people, because they drag you down to their level and then they beat you with experience
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Dartlard Jul 26 2013, 02:45 PM Post #193
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Sjk8
Jul 26 2013, 02:40 PM
Dartlard
Jul 26 2013, 02:33 PM
You are talking without the context how Vegeta hated Goku.


And despite that, in that situation of danger, he fused with him, putting aside his pride.
That's not a point.
Uhh, it definately was a point.

Goku: ''Hey Vegeta, let's do this dance ok?''
Vegeta: ''Hey Goku, how about you forgot that you held back against me in our fight''?
Goku: ''Just follow these steps, and do this pose with me ok?''
Vegeta: ''I ain't posing like that!! Where's your pride Kakarot?!''

In meanwhile, Super Gohan-Boo is next to them and have no time to fuse anymore.
Earring was simply the easiest thing to do at that point.
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Sjk8 Jul 26 2013, 03:04 PM Post #194
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史上最強の孫悟空
Dartlard
Jul 26 2013, 02:45 PM
Sjk8
Jul 26 2013, 02:40 PM
Dartlard
Jul 26 2013, 02:33 PM
You are talking without the context how Vegeta hated Goku.


And despite that, in that situation of danger, he fused with him, putting aside his pride.
That's not a point.
Uhh, it definately was a point.

Goku: ''Hey Vegeta, let's do this dance ok?''
Vegeta: ''Hey Goku, how about you forgot that you held back against me in our fight''?
Goku: ''Just follow these steps, and do this pose with me ok?''
Vegeta: ''I ain't posing like that!! Where's your pride Kakarot?!''

In meanwhile, Super Gohan-Boo is next to them and have no time to fuse anymore.
Earring was simply the easiest thing to do at that point.


Actually Goku never brought back the fusion dance against Boohan.
When he teleported to Vegeta, he immediately asked him to put on the earring, and Vegeta initially refused; indeed, he accepted only when in close danger.
The fact is that Goku never thought from the beginning to use the fusion dance against Boohan.
A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has even a chance to get its pants on
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Never argue with ignorant people, because they drag you down to their level and then they beat you with experience
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Dartlard Jul 26 2013, 03:10 PM Post #195
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Sjk8
Jul 26 2013, 03:04 PM
Dartlard
Jul 26 2013, 02:45 PM
Sjk8
Jul 26 2013, 02:40 PM
Dartlard
Jul 26 2013, 02:33 PM
You are talking without the context how Vegeta hated Goku.


And despite that, in that situation of danger, he fused with him, putting aside his pride.
That's not a point.
Uhh, it definately was a point.

Goku: ''Hey Vegeta, let's do this dance ok?''
Vegeta: ''Hey Goku, how about you forgot that you held back against me in our fight''?
Goku: ''Just follow these steps, and do this pose with me ok?''
Vegeta: ''I ain't posing like that!! Where's your pride Kakarot?!''

In meanwhile, Super Gohan-Boo is next to them and have no time to fuse anymore.
Earring was simply the easiest thing to do at that point.


Actually Goku never brought back the fusion dance against Boohan.
When he teleported to Vegeta, he immediately asked him to put on the earring, and Vegeta initially refused; indeed, he accepted only when in close danger.
The fact is that Goku never thought from the beginning to use the fusion dance against Boohan.
It was a hypothetical situation if he were to offer the fusion dance before earrings.
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