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End of Z Tien vs. Healthy Android Saga SSjin Goku
Topic Started: Jul 22 2013, 05:29 AM (1,835 Views)
Revious83 Jul 22 2013, 12:22 PM Post #16
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 Manga wise Tenshinhan never reaches any of the SSJs, Anime-wise he could beat Android Saga SSJ Goku with the Spirit Burst Technique.
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mechasilver3000 Jul 22 2013, 04:32 PM Post #17
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Tien gets stomped, Goku>>>>>Frieza>>>EoZ tien
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+ Clearin Jul 22 2013, 05:05 PM Post #18
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 There's not really any proof at all for humans comparable to Freeza (And thus anyone stronger) after the android arc so I think this could go either way.

Either guess is as baseless and likely as the other imo.
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AA500 Jul 22 2013, 06:00 PM Post #19
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Yardrat SSJ Goku takes him down, Android Goku is even more of a stomp. There isn't evidence for anyone other than Goku making huge gains for EoZ
Edited by AA500, Jul 22 2013, 06:01 PM.
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+ Pyrus Jul 23 2013, 01:24 AM Post #20
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 Tenshinhan wasn't stronger than Freeza during the android saga, and in fact acted like he was still a frightening power. Seven years later and he hadn't surpassed Krillin. A few years after Boo's defeat, when Toriyama stated the characters were all getting too old and reaching their max strength, I doubt he'd have reached a power like Goku's.
Edited by Pyrus, Jul 23 2013, 01:24 AM.
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+ supersaqer Jul 23 2013, 01:50 AM Post #21
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First, via statements, he should be about 10% Frieza. Being only 1/10 of Frieza's power isn't a stretch for Tien during the Cell Arc, and he trained 17 years after that. 17 years! Even Boo commented on him being a master, and he even survived a kick. I doubt people way below Frieza would do that. I can see him surpassing Frieza by a small margin by the Boo Saga at most, and then he trained 10 years after that.
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+ Pyrus Jul 23 2013, 01:56 AM Post #22
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First, via statements, he should be about 10% Frieza.

What makes you say 10%?
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Being only 1/10 of Frieza's power isn't a stretch for Tien during the Cell Arc, and he trained 17 years after that. 17 years!

Those first seven years didn't put him above Krillin, and taking Toriyama's quote at face value, neither did the other ten years. Krillin stayed on top for most of the manga.
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Even Boo commented on him being a master,

That was more than likely Piccolo's knowledge coming through since Boo had never encountered Tenshinhan before.
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and he even survived a kick.

It's not like Toriyama was going to have Boo kick Tenshinhan's head off. Only the gunmen received such treatment.
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I can see him surpassing Frieza by a small margin by the Boo Saga at most, and then he trained 10 years after that.

That would only be if you thought Krillin surpassed Freeza, too, which I personally don't think happened.

Regardless, if he only surpassed Freeza by a small amount, then he wouldn't be any match for this Goku.
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+ supersaqer Jul 23 2013, 02:03 AM Post #23
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ObsessiveFanGuy
Jul 23 2013, 01:56 AM
Quote:
 
First, via statements, he should be about 10% Frieza.

What makes you say 10%?
Quote:
 
Being only 1/10 of Frieza's power isn't a stretch for Tien during the Cell Arc, and he trained 17 years after that. 17 years!

Those first seven years didn't put him above Krillin, and taking Toriyama's quote at face value, neither did the other ten years. Krillin stayed on top for most of the manga.
Quote:
 
Even Boo commented on him being a master,

That was more than likely Piccolo's knowledge coming through since Boo had never encountered Tenshinhan before.
Quote:
 
and he even survived a kick.

It's not like Toriyama was going to have Boo kick Tenshinhan's head off. Only the gunmen received such treatment.
Quote:
 
I can see him surpassing Frieza by a small margin by the Boo Saga at most, and then he trained 10 years after that.

That would only be if you thought Krillin surpassed Freeza, too, which I personally don't think happened.

Regardless, if he only surpassed Freeza by a small amount, then he wouldn't be any match for this Goku.
That level of Frieza should be on par with Tien from the Cell Arc.

That just implies that Krillin trained.

I think, too.

Because probably he couldn't? His legs wouldn't kick Tien's head, his gut is the most reasonable place. Tien would have dodged that face attack if it happened.

It happened. Krillin knew that he'd face guys above Frieza's level, and came, only to sense Dabura.

That's Boo Saga Tien, and I think EoZ Tien blows him out of the water.

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+ Pyrus Jul 23 2013, 02:18 AM Post #24
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That level of Frieza should be on par with Tien from the Cell Arc.

But how did you arrive at that conclusion? You're only using circular logic right now.
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That just implies that Krillin trained.

It's stated that he stopped.
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Because probably he couldn't? His legs wouldn't kick Tien's head, his gut is the most reasonable place. Tien would have dodged that face attack if it happened.

Nappa blitzed Ten and punched his arm off. Boo could do the same thing.
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It happened. Krillin knew that he'd face guys above Frieza's level, and came, only to sense Dabura.

Kaboom
 
Just like how he jumped in and went mano-a-mano with Nappa to save Gohan. Or how he followed Gohan back to help Goku against Vegeta. Or how he decided to follow Freeza and his whole posse to the Namekian village. Or how he stayed behind to stall Vegeta so Gohan could get his dormant power unlocked. Or how he attacked Recoome to save Vegeta. Or how he attacked and distracted 2nd-form Freeza to save Gohan. Or how he and Gohan attacked Freeza so Goku could finish the Spirit Bomb. Or how he showed up when Freeza arrived on Earth despite knowing how powerful he was. Or how he likewise showed up to help against the Androids. Or how he went ahead to catch up with Goku and the Androids when Yamcha was chickening out. Or how he flared up his ki, essentially painting himself as a target, so the others could track him to Gero's lab. Or how he berated and questioned the Androids after they just kicked the snot out of Super Saiyans. Or how he went along with Trunks right to where Piccolo was fighting Cell. Or how he infiltrated the site of Vegeta and Cell's battle with the Android-deactivating remote (which, keep in mind, wouldn't have deactivated Sixteen). Or how he attacked Cell after Eighteen was absorbed. Or how he helped Trunks by getting the unconscious Vegeta to safety. Or how he ignored stupid Trunks and his suggestion to heal Goku and gang up on Cell. Or how he tried going on the offensive against his Cell Junior.


Kuririn tagging along with Kaioshin and the others is, get this, not a feat or indication of power. It's an indication of character. Kuririn does this kind of stuff because he's brave, not because he's powerful.

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That's Boo Saga Tien, and I think EoZ Tien blows him out of the water.

Not if Toriyama meant overall.
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+ supersaqer Jul 23 2013, 05:03 AM Post #25
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ObsessiveFanGuy
Jul 23 2013, 02:18 AM
Quote:
 
That level of Frieza should be on par with Tien from the Cell Arc.

But how did you arrive at that conclusion? You're only using circular logic right now.
Quote:
 
That just implies that Krillin trained.

It's stated that he stopped.
Quote:
 
Because probably he couldn't? His legs wouldn't kick Tien's head, his gut is the most reasonable place. Tien would have dodged that face attack if it happened.

Nappa blitzed Ten and punched his arm off. Boo could do the same thing.
Quote:
 
It happened. Krillin knew that he'd face guys above Frieza's level, and came, only to sense Dabura.

Kaboom
 
Just like how he jumped in and went mano-a-mano with Nappa to save Gohan. Or how he followed Gohan back to help Goku against Vegeta. Or how he decided to follow Freeza and his whole posse to the Namekian village. Or how he stayed behind to stall Vegeta so Gohan could get his dormant power unlocked. Or how he attacked Recoome to save Vegeta. Or how he attacked and distracted 2nd-form Freeza to save Gohan. Or how he and Gohan attacked Freeza so Goku could finish the Spirit Bomb. Or how he showed up when Freeza arrived on Earth despite knowing how powerful he was. Or how he likewise showed up to help against the Androids. Or how he went ahead to catch up with Goku and the Androids when Yamcha was chickening out. Or how he flared up his ki, essentially painting himself as a target, so the others could track him to Gero's lab. Or how he berated and questioned the Androids after they just kicked the snot out of Super Saiyans. Or how he went along with Trunks right to where Piccolo was fighting Cell. Or how he infiltrated the site of Vegeta and Cell's battle with the Android-deactivating remote (which, keep in mind, wouldn't have deactivated Sixteen). Or how he attacked Cell after Eighteen was absorbed. Or how he helped Trunks by getting the unconscious Vegeta to safety. Or how he ignored stupid Trunks and his suggestion to heal Goku and gang up on Cell. Or how he tried going on the offensive against his Cell Junior.


Kuririn tagging along with Kaioshin and the others is, get this, not a feat or indication of power. It's an indication of character. Kuririn does this kind of stuff because he's brave, not because he's powerful.

Quote:
 
That's Boo Saga Tien, and I think EoZ Tien blows him out of the water.

Not if Toriyama meant overall.
Well, that's an estimation. He could be anywhere from Initial Final Form Frieza's level up to Mecha Frieza's level during the Cell Arc. I figured that going by statements, and how he went with them. If he was weaker than even Frieza who took on SSjin Goku head on, then he must have stayed back there. He's just strong, but not that strong.

Where?

I know, but that was Saiyan Arc Tien. I was just trolling right there :p

But in the cases Nuke was talking about, Krillin was angry, having an adrenalin rush, or stuff like that. If someone you cared about got killed, you would certainly rush to take revenge. That's how adrenalin work in our bodies. But in Dabura's case, he was calm until he sensed Dabura. Indicating that facing Frieza level guys aren't life threatening.



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+ Pyrus Jul 23 2013, 06:39 AM Post #26
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 Krillin goes regardless of the situation. He supports his friends. That's who he is. It's not an indication of his power.
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+ Emmeth Jul 23 2013, 10:40 AM Post #27
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 It's stated that he stopped fighting. Not training.

Chapter: 426 (DBZ 232), P8.3
Gohan: “This is Kuririn. He no longer fights, so he stopped shaving his head.”
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+ Pyrus Jul 23 2013, 03:33 PM Post #28
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 Why would I assume he continued training, then? Alas:
Daizenshuu 2
 
After the battle with Cell, he peacefully lives with No. 18 at Kame House. Even having a daughter now, he has thoroughly distanced himself from battle.
[1]
Daizenshuu 2
 
No longer training, his hair has grown out.
[2]
It would seem logical that that makes sense with what's shown in the manga.
[1] http://web.archive.org/web/20111103165624/http://kanzentai.com/trans-daiz02.php?m=04&id=grow_up#link
[2] http://web.archive.org/web/20111103165624/http://kanzentai.com/trans-daiz02.php?m=04&id=grow_up#link
Edited by Pyrus, Jul 23 2013, 03:42 PM.
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+ Clearin Jul 23 2013, 03:44 PM Post #29
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 He did train for the tournament. At first this just seems like an obvious "Well he's going to be entering a tournament, of course he's going to train". But when you look at it, Krillin had no reason to train for it. The next strongest person in the tournament, #18, was too strong for him to catch up to, while the next weakest, which woulda been a regular human would be way to weak to do anything to him whether he trained or not. His 1 month of training would be pointless if he did it solely for the tournament.

We also don't know how long he continued to train after the Cell saga, if he ever stopped.
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+ Emmeth Jul 23 2013, 04:06 PM Post #30
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 It specifically says in the manga "no longer fights". Just because he stopped fighting doesn't mean he stopped exercising. I don't take everything from the daiz seriously.

Good page, btw, I'm bookmarking it.
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