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Tien's Shin Kikoho on Cell
Topic Started: Jul 9 2013, 07:43 PM (10,898 Views)
+ Pyrus
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Nichel
Jul 10 2013, 07:29 PM
ObsessiveFanGuy
Jul 10 2013, 07:27 PM
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I suggest you sit the hell down and save your breath for when I'm choking the life out of you with my superior debating skills, kid!
Well I think I brought all of my points up already. :p I'll waste my breath is something of new comes up. :)
There's still one seed I have planted yet. Posted Image
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Super Vegetto
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Nichel
Jul 10 2013, 07:24 PM
Super Vegetto
Jul 10 2013, 07:23 PM
12 pages of same topic we had not long ago.

Wtf is going on in here ?

Why can't everyone simply accept that Shin Kikoho doesn't deal damage and didn't even hurt Cell but only pushed him down.

Is it because of Tien's fanboys or what ?

You ignored 12 pages and expect to settle the debate with this? :lol:

We've brought some good points why what you said maybe isn't true. I suggest you go read them.
There is no nead for me to read because i said what works the best.

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* Stark
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Rock Lobster

Super Vegetto
Jul 10 2013, 07:31 PM
Nichel
Jul 10 2013, 07:24 PM
Super Vegetto
Jul 10 2013, 07:23 PM
12 pages of same topic we had not long ago.

Wtf is going on in here ?

Why can't everyone simply accept that Shin Kikoho doesn't deal damage and didn't even hurt Cell but only pushed him down.

Is it because of Tien's fanboys or what ?

You ignored 12 pages and expect to settle the debate with this? :lol:

We've brought some good points why what you said maybe isn't true. I suggest you go read them.
There is no nead for me to read because i said what works the best.

Maybe in your opinion. :lol:
It was heavily implied that the Shin Kikoho hurt Cell a lot more than 16's punch did. Of course, there are some points to argue otherwise, but the fact that Cell showed pain in his expression while he was like "-_- oh no you didnt" when 16 punched him.


The Shin Kikoho is described as a very powerful destroying technique, I can definetly see it hurting Cell a little even with the huge gap.
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Mihawk
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I still don't think it hurt him - what happened was the equivalent of your little cousin drowning you at the pool.

However, no matter what side you're on, you have to agree the Kihoho is one strong attack if not the strongest regardless if it uses life force/span.

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Kaboom
 
Uh, anyway... what RandomGuy96 pointed out is pretty much the way I figure it too. The Kikoho is a powerful attack, to be sure, but it's still just Tenshinhan's own ki being amplified. It's not so powerful that it could actually injure someone tens or hundreds of times stronger than Ten himself, much less kill them. That'd include Freeza, the Androids, and so forth. As was already pointed out, it didn't even hurt Nappa, who even with Ten gravely injured at the time and only using one hand, wouldn't have been any more than 4-5 times stronger than him.

What the attack seemingly CAN do, however, is put out enough sheer concussive force to push around and inhibit the movements of whatever foe it hits, even if the amount of energy behind it can't actually hurt them. Which makes a lot of sense given its position as the king of all shockwave/kiai-type techniques. This not only let Tenshinhan use the attack to temporarily push back Cell, but later he apparently used it to even intercept and detonate an attack from Majin Boo.

In a nutshell, it seems to be a special property of the attack that makes it so useful, rather than the power of the user or the attack's degree of ki amplification. Similar to how Kuririn can slice opponents leagues stronger than himself with the Kienzan because of how the attack is formed.

Son_Gohan
 
Cell wasn't pushed back when he actually braced himself for the attack. I think the speed and the area that covers when fired successively is why it was so effective in restraining him.

Kaboom
 
Don't forget that this is the Shin Kikoho we're talking about. Even if it's categorized along with them, it's not ordinary kiai-type attack. If your average kiai is like smacking someone with a foam pool noodle... then the Kikoho is like swinging down a huge king-size mattress on their heads instead.

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Zenet
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More like Tien Haterz yoPosted Image
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Cenet
Jul 10 2013, 07:38 PM
More like Tien Haterz yoPosted Image
Tenshinhan gets enough poon from his fans. He could use the haters.
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EMIYA
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"I am the bone of my sword."

I think we can agree that the Shin Kikoho indeed has a great amount of destructive power (I mean the original did, you'd think this one would too) It's just that Cell was still way beyond Tenshinhan's capabilities. But with the attack's incredible concussive force, added with the potential that Ten may have just continued to bombard Cell unexpectedly while Cell wasn't concentrating and his "Shoukii" (Which apparently is quite important) was lowered. You could say that Cell just didn't have the right state of mind, something hitting him over and over again, the cyborgs are escaping, Ten coming out of nowhere when everything was literally right in the palm of his hands.

We know the attack can be damaging, if anyone is seriously suggesting that the Shin Kikoho is just meant to push, you're out of your mind. And if this attack was used on someone like No. 16 it certainly have much more of an effect and even more so on No. 17, Piccolo and people below them.
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Zenet
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I would say it would have vaporized 16 and anyone below. Tri Beam was very close to Semi Cell in terms of power. If Tri Beam was a fighter it would fight evenly with Cell.
Edited by Zenet, Jul 10 2013, 07:56 PM.
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+ Pyrus
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It doesn't have the power to vaporize anybody. It would crush them to death (Freeza is arguable), but that's about it.
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+ Emmeth
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I Yoeri

Can someone post the statement that states Shin Kikoho is an advanced, more powerful version than the Kikoho? I have difficulties believing it.
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+ Pyrus
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D7 about Shin Kikoho
 
A technique that increases the force of the Kikoho. An attack that becomes possible when one has improved their abilities through intense training. Tenshinhan fired this technique to stop Cell from moving when Cell was trying to absorb No. 18, but he used up all of his power and collapsed.

D4 about the regular Kikoho
 
A technique that puts out a kiai. Most of the body's ki is depleted.

D4 about Shin Kikoho
 
The Shin Kikoho, which continuously fires the kiai-type Kihoho.

D4 about kiais
 
As opposed to the other techniques here, which can bee seen in the shape of energy bullets, this category of technique cannot be directly seen by the naked eye. Things like the Kikoho and shockwaves are techniques included in this category.

The first quote is interesting because it says Ten used it to stop Cell from moving, not to inflict damage to him.
Edited by Pyrus, Jul 10 2013, 08:11 PM.
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Zenet
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ObsessiveFanGuy
Jul 10 2013, 07:39 PM
Cenet
Jul 10 2013, 07:38 PM
More like Tien Haterz yoPosted Image
Tenshinhan gets enough poon from his fans. He could use the haters.
We got this guy I found on our side http://tenshinhanpowerlevels.blogspot.co.uk/2008/10/tenshinhan-versus-krillin.html he or she is our secret weapon.
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+ Emmeth
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I Yoeri

Hmm... I see that D7 states this, but...

See, I felt it was something like this.

http://dbzf.co.uk/single/?p=8781874&t=8422732

At least it's what it seems like.
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Mihawk
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ObsessiveFanGuy
Jul 10 2013, 07:37 PM
Kaboom
 
Uh, anyway... what RandomGuy96 pointed out is pretty much the way I figure it too. The Kikoho is a powerful attack, to be sure, but it's still just Tenshinhan's own ki being amplified. It's not so powerful that it could actually injure someone tens or hundreds of times stronger than Ten himself, much less kill them. That'd include Freeza, the Androids, and so forth. As was already pointed out, it didn't even hurt Nappa, who even with Ten gravely injured at the time and only using one hand, wouldn't have been any more than 4-5 times stronger than him.

What the attack seemingly CAN do, however, is put out enough sheer concussive force to push around and inhibit the movements of whatever foe it hits, even if the amount of energy behind it can't actually hurt them. Which makes a lot of sense given its position as the king of all shockwave/kiai-type techniques. This not only let Tenshinhan use the attack to temporarily push back Cell, but later he apparently used it to even intercept and detonate an attack from Majin Boo.

In a nutshell, it seems to be a special property of the attack that makes it so useful, rather than the power of the user or the attack's degree of ki amplification. Similar to how Kuririn can slice opponents leagues stronger than himself with the Kienzan because of how the attack is formed.

Son_Gohan
 
Cell wasn't pushed back when he actually braced himself for the attack. I think the speed and the area that covers when fired successively is why it was so effective in restraining him.

Kaboom
 
Don't forget that this is the Shin Kikoho we're talking about. Even if it's categorized along with them, it's not ordinary kiai-type attack. If your average kiai is like smacking someone with a foam pool noodle... then the Kikoho is like swinging down a huge king-size mattress on their heads instead.

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To add to this:

We know Toriyama tried to squeeze in as much real martial arts as he could before going off tangent with supernovas and what not. Wikipedia says

"Students of Japanese martial arts such as aikido, karate, kobudo, kendo, or judo (or related arts such as taiko drumming) use kiai to startle an opponent...".
Edited by Mihawk, Jul 10 2013, 08:19 PM.

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