Welcome Guest [Log In] [Register]
Rotation Advertisements



We hope you enjoy your visit to this forum.


If you are reading this then it means you are currently browsing the forum as a guest, we don’t limit any of the content posted from guests however if you join, you will have the ability to join the discussions! We are always happy to see new faces at this forum and we would like to hear your opinion, so why not register now? It doesn’t take long and you can get posting right away.


Click here to Register!

If you are having difficulties validating your account please email us at admin@dbzf.co.uk


If you're already a member please log in to your account:

Username:   Password:
Add Reply
  • Pages:
  • 1
  • 5
  • 9
Piccolo and Base Saiyans
Topic Started: Jul 9 2013, 04:51 PM (6,966 Views)
+ Pyrus
Member Avatar


Lord Magus
Jul 24 2013, 12:35 AM
ObsessiveFanGuy
Jul 24 2013, 12:27 AM
Lord Magus
Jul 24 2013, 12:21 AM
Well, I shouldn't discuss, because my opinion is extremely biased. My opinion, even if AT says Base Saiyans > Piccolo himself, would be Piccolo > Base Saiyans.

That's unfortunate. You should work to put aside personal bias. I know it can be difficult; I do it every time I defend Gotenks. But it really helps produce a much more fair and honest debate. I mean, where would we be if everybody stuck to their guns throughout this series' run?
Well, I am generally neutral when it comes to DBZ, but when it comes to Piccolo, I have the instinct to defend.


Anyway, from what I understand, I'll try to break it down in a logical and non-biased way;

- Base Kids are believed to be equal with Android 18.
- We know for a fact that Piccolo is stronger than her, he already was in his fight with Android 17.
- Goten is believed to be pretty close to Gohan Pre-tournament.
- Piccolo should have gotten at least twice as strong from his fight with 17 to Cell Games.

Therefore, the only people who could get close to Piccolo (based on personal gaps) is Goku. Goku is stronger than what Gohan was against Cell, and Vegeta is believed to be not too far behind.

A sidenote; AT confirms that Piccolo did in fact train in the 7 years from CG to Boo arc. His gains are only conjecture though, but it's thought to be minimal.

Piccolo (Boo Arc) > Piccolo (CG) > Base Saiyans > Piccolo (17) > Base Kids ~ Android 18.
That's generally the way I see it too, although I differ a bit on Goten/Trunks compared to No.18 (I have them both slightly-moderately ahead of her). Nonetheless, the layout is basically the same. It's hard getting Gohan, Vegeta, and Goku above Piccolo without the use of Super Saiyan unless you pull some strings.
Spoiler: click to toggle
Member Online View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
+ Emmeth
Member Avatar
I Yoeri

ObsessiveFanGuy
Jul 24 2013, 12:39 AM
That's generally the way I see it too, although I differ a bit on Goten/Trunks compared to No.18 (I have them both slightly-moderately ahead of her). Nonetheless, the layout is basically the same. It's hard getting Gohan, Vegeta, and Goku above Piccolo without the use of Super Saiyan unless you pull some strings.
Yeah. People could argue that Base Kids are WAY above Android 18 and that the disguise is restricting them majorly, but that's far-fetched, imo.
Posted Image
My Twitch Page
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Zenet
Default Avatar


If the Base Saiyans are stronger than Piccolo I just go with The whole thing with the MSSJ multiplier shrinking for Vegeta , Goku and Gohan giving them a much stronger Base.

Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
+ Emmeth
Member Avatar
I Yoeri

Cenet
Jul 24 2013, 12:48 AM
If the Base Saiyans are stronger than Piccolo I just go with The whole thing with the MSSJ multiplier shrinking for Vegeta , Goku and Gohan giving them a much stronger Base.

Then what about Goten and Trunks?
Posted Image
My Twitch Page
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Zenet
Default Avatar


Lord Magus
Jul 24 2013, 12:50 AM
Cenet
Jul 24 2013, 12:48 AM
If the Base Saiyans are stronger than Piccolo I just go with The whole thing with the MSSJ multiplier shrinking for Vegeta , Goku and Gohan giving them a much stronger Base.

Then what about Goten and Trunks?
Except them since they were fighting on par with 18.
Edited by Zenet, Jul 24 2013, 12:55 AM.
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
+ Emmeth
Member Avatar
I Yoeri

Cenet
Jul 24 2013, 12:55 AM
Lord Magus
Jul 24 2013, 12:50 AM
Cenet
Jul 24 2013, 12:48 AM
If the Base Saiyans are stronger than Piccolo I just go with The whole thing with the MSSJ multiplier shrinking for Vegeta , Goku and Gohan giving them a much stronger Base.

Then what about Goten and Trunks?
Except them since they were fighting on par with 18.
Goten was not very far away from Gohan when they were sparring before the tournament.
Posted Image
My Twitch Page
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
+ Kyouks
Member Avatar


Lord Magus
Jul 24 2013, 12:40 AM
Yeah. People could argue that Base Kids are WAY above Android 18 and that the disguise is restricting them majorly, but that's far-fetched, imo.
In my books any advantage is fine so long as the kids aren't pseudo-tanking #18 (or more), though I do agree that anything outside of the rivaling range isn't really necessary.

Some of the base Saiyan > Piccolo believers 'solve' the issue by outright ignoring Goten's closeness to Gohan, though, and/or they do what zenet does with the SSJ multipliers and so on.

So aside from thinking that Piccolo > base Saiyans makes more sense I also think it makes other things easier to work with.
Posted Image
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Zenet
Default Avatar


Lord Magus
Jul 24 2013, 12:56 AM
Cenet
Jul 24 2013, 12:55 AM
Lord Magus
Jul 24 2013, 12:50 AM
Cenet
Jul 24 2013, 12:48 AM
If the Base Saiyans are stronger than Piccolo I just go with The whole thing with the MSSJ multiplier shrinking for Vegeta , Goku and Gohan giving them a much stronger Base.

Then what about Goten and Trunks?
Except them since they were fighting on par with 18.
Goten was not very far away from Gohan when they were sparring before the tournament.


Gohan would have a smaller MSSJ multiplier that Goten making them almost equal in that form. Though that only applies if Base Gohan is stronger than Piccolo and Base Goten is on par with 18.
Edited by Zenet, Jul 24 2013, 01:05 AM.
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
+ Pyrus
Member Avatar


I don't think Toriyama cared about exact multipliers beyond the Freeza arc.
Spoiler: click to toggle
Member Online View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
FamousBueller
Member Avatar
Super Asian

All the Supreme Kai's are 10x stronger than Frieza right?

East Supreme Kai (the weakest): 1,200,000,000 > Frieza (100%): 120,000,000

So depending on your power levels, statements and gains you can place Piccolo where you want and I pretty much have Piccolo > Base Saiyans

I also have no Base Saiyan in the billions

If Piccolo thought Supreme Kai was Grand Kai then that makes no sense, since Grand Kai is weaker than Supreme KAIS, but if Piccolo thought Supreme Kai was Grand Supreme Kai then that makes sense because I have Grand Supreme Kai > South Supreme Kai (who is state to be the strongest among the supreme kais, but I don't think that includes Grand)
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
+ Emmeth
Member Avatar
I Yoeri

FamousBueller
Jul 24 2013, 12:32 PM
If Piccolo thought Supreme Kai was Grand Kai then that makes no sense, since Grand Kai is weaker than Supreme KAIS, but if Piccolo thought Supreme Kai was Grand Supreme Kai then that makes sense because I have Grand Supreme Kai > South Supreme Kai (who is state to be the strongest among the supreme kais, but I don't think that includes Grand)
Where is it stated that all Supreme Kais > Grand Kai? For all we know, Dai Kaio could be stronger than Kaioshin.
Posted Image
My Twitch Page
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
FamousBueller
Member Avatar
Super Asian

Doesn't King Kai state the Supreme Kai is on a higher level than he is?, you're right its never stated that the supreme kais are stronger

But somewhere it has King Kai's power level around 3,000-4,000? and the supreme kais are 10x stronger than frieza, king kai was scared of frieza

If Grand Kai was stronger than Supreme Kais how come he didn't help fight against Kid Buu 5 million years ago?

and im positive Grand Supreme Kai > Grand Kai or his name wouldn't be SUPREME
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
+ Emmeth
Member Avatar
I Yoeri

Higher level as in higher rank. Also, Kaio-Sama is weaker than Kaioshin, no question. Dai Kaio was mentioned once in the manga, and only shown in filler, so he could be anywhere.
Posted Image
My Twitch Page
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
+ Ginyu
Member Avatar
Leve Feyenoord 1!

When Piccolo fused with Kami he was the strongest Z Fighter, surpassing Goku's and Vegeta's Super Saiyan powers, I don't see base kids being stronger than Piccolo, no way
Posted ImagePosted ImagePosted ImagePosted ImagePosted Image
Posted Image
Ask GinyuTokusentai
Member Offline View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
+ Pyrus
Member Avatar


FamousBueller
Jul 24 2013, 12:32 PM
All the Supreme Kai's are 10x stronger than Frieza right?

No. That was never said. Even in the FUNi dub, it was 1,000x.
tomessi666
Jul 24 2013, 02:00 PM
When Piccolo fused with Kami he was the strongest Z Fighter, surpassing Goku's and Vegeta's Super Saiyan powers, I don't see base kids being stronger than Piccolo, no way

That's not much of a reason.
Spoiler: click to toggle
Member Online View Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
0 users reading this topic
ZetaBoards - Free Forum Hosting
Create your own social network with a free forum.
Go to Next Page
« Previous Topic · Dragon Ball/Z Discussion · Next Topic »
Add Reply
  • Pages:
  • 1
  • 5
  • 9

Theme Designed by McKee91