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- My possible theory on MSSJ
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| My possible theory on MSSJ | ||||||||||||||||
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| Tweet Topic Started: Jun 25 2013, 07:12 AM (994 Views) | ||||||||||||||||
| + miguelnuva | Jun 25 2013, 07:12 AM Post #1 | |||||||||||||||
 
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Okay I've been thinking on this theory on MSSJ(also called Full-Power SUper saiyan, SSJ grade 4). When Goku is normal and then goes SSJ he gets a 50x increase but at the same time his stamina is drained and he has to use ki to hold the form. Goku Power: 1 Speed; 1 Ki: 1 Stamina:100 Goku goes SSJ and gets a 50x increase but has a slight stamina drain. SSJ Goku Power: 50 Speed; 50 Ki: 47 Stamina: 98 Now SSJ works in till we get to the Android saga and Cell saga where the ascended stages come at. First up is SSJ Gr2 or Ascended Super Saiyan. ASSJ's only weaknesses were an increase stamina drain and the speed did not increase as much the power, it also uses more Ki then SSJ to maintain. ASSJ Goku Power: 62.5 Speed; 57.5 Ki: 40 Stamina: 75 Next is SSJ GR3 or Ultra Super Saiyan. In this form it has major flaws of low speed and a huge ki drain as well as a huge stamina drain. USSJ Goku Power:87.5 Speed; 35-40 Ki: 20 Stamina: 25 Now we get to MSSJ who is the SSJ form where the stamina drain is gone and the ki is fully use able to the user. MSSJ Goku Power: 50 Speed; 50 Ki: 50 Stamina: 99-100 Now here is where my theory comes in. I believe that ASSJ and USSJ are all the available power of the first SSJ form. ASSJ and USSJ are merely short cuts to this power while MSSJ is the right way to gain the full power of the SSJ form. In a way the stats will look like this. MSSJ Goku Power: 87.5 Speed; 87.5 Ki: 87.5 Stamina: 99-100 A MSSJ would have the same power of the same person going USSJ if they didn't master the SSJ form. By taking the long route the users's base form is increased hugly allowing for the USSJ levels of power in the normal ssj form. Example: Two Goku's fight, One goes MSSJ the other would have to go USSJ to match MSSJ Goku in power despite the other advantages MSSJ gives. MSSJ is simply a balanced USSJ form but in the regular SSJ form basically. So what do you think? Could be why it was called SSJ grade 4 at first. |
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Jun 25 2013, 09:32 AM Post #2 | |||||||||||||||
 
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Mssj and Fpssj is not the same. Mastered super saiyan means that they got used to ssj form and that they can control it without problems. Full power super saiyan is when Goku and Gohan go full power in super saiyan form against Cell. |
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Jun 25 2013, 04:08 PM Post #3 | |||||||||||||||
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I disagree with virtually all of your claims. See my ssj transformation list in the resource thread. | |||||||||||||||
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| Sam | Jun 25 2013, 06:15 PM Post #4 | |||||||||||||||
It takes a mere second for treasure to turn to trash.
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I disagree as well. USSj/ASSj are simply forms that enhance bulk and size in order to gain raw power/chi. The Z-Fighters, particularly Trunks, took massive amounts of chi and bulk as true power and tried to use it against Cell. Unfortunately for him, as Cell pointed out, no matter how much raw chi and power you have, it's all just for show if there is no speed (which cannot be sensed/measured outside of combat) to execute it with. MSSj is just the regular SSj form held until the stamina drain is nonexistent. In this way, it's simply just the Super Saiyan form... mastered. MSSj is not the proper utilization of the USSj/ASSj forms, it's simply getting comfortable as a transformed Super Saiyan. USSj/ASSj are easy transformations (as Cell demonstrated) that put all of their emphasis on power and bulk, which greatly drains speed and stamina. They just weren't practical transformations, and they were their own separate branch off of the Super Saiyan tree. Edited by Sam, Jun 25 2013, 06:16 PM.
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WoW Legion Ending - Thank you Darker for making this into one, big incredible gif! <3 | ||||||||||||||||
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| + Pointer | Jun 25 2013, 06:19 PM Post #5 | |||||||||||||||
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I think mssj is the same /power boost wise/ as regular ssj ....without power drain | |||||||||||||||
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| Sam | Jun 25 2013, 06:24 PM Post #6 | |||||||||||||||
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It takes a mere second for treasure to turn to trash.
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Yeah. As Goku explained it rather simply, it's just to get used to the Super Saiyan form and get rid of that restless feeling. To take control over it on a physical and mental level. The bloodlust of the SSj forms can be overwhelming and can cause some seriously bad situations, like SSj2 Gohan's pride in the fight vs. Cell. I think part of mastering Super Saiyan is overcoming that. | |||||||||||||||
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WoW Legion Ending - Thank you Darker for making this into one, big incredible gif! <3 | ||||||||||||||||
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| DEY DID DIS 2 ME | Jun 25 2013, 06:26 PM Post #7 | |||||||||||||||
MY FACE!
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To add to what others are stating, as far as MSSJ is concerned, I'd go even farther and state that training as a Super Saiyan merely raises all other stats to match that of Super Saiyan power, as if SSJ is the "natural state." question to ponder: If, on Namek, Son Goku's Kaio-Ken ×10 is like Kaio-Ken ×2 from his Vegeta fight, then would his other stats (physical, focus, etc) not match his power at Kaioken ×5? Overall, hypothetical:
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Jun 25 2013, 07:08 PM Post #8 | |||||||||||||||
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Goku himself explains that MSSJ is when a Super Saiyan can maintain the SSJ form without using his or her ki, so that the form can be used indefinitely even when sleeping, because you are so relaxed. A hyper sense of self. | |||||||||||||||
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| * Ketchup Revenge | Jun 26 2013, 02:07 AM Post #9 | |||||||||||||||
"Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the war room!"
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FPSSj is not entirely void of ki usage, and there's absolutely no canon evidence that it can be used during sleep. FPSSj still uses ki to transform, and an almost non-existent amount to sustain the transformation. Evidence to this is Gohan reverting to base after his final Kamehameha push that ended up killing Cell. He was completely drained because he's not even able to keep aloft. Another instance is Goku not being able to transform to SSj against Kid Boo until his ki was restored during the Genki Dama push. Both instances point to at least a minimal amount of ki being needed to transform, and stay transformed. And it's true that MSSj and FPSSj are the same thing. MSSj is simply the fan term. Edited by Ketchup Revenge, Jun 26 2013, 02:16 AM.
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 The vengeance is her's for as long as she stands by Him. | ||||||||||||||||
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| Sam | Jun 26 2013, 05:14 AM Post #10 | |||||||||||||||
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It takes a mere second for treasure to turn to trash.
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I believe they are both fan terms, as the form is never really given a name canonically? Unless you're referring to the Daizenshuu, I suppose. | |||||||||||||||
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WoW Legion Ending - Thank you Darker for making this into one, big incredible gif! <3 | ||||||||||||||||
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| DEY DID DIS 2 ME | Jun 26 2013, 05:43 AM Post #11 | |||||||||||||||
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MY FACE!
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I'll be controversial and state that I don't think Super Saiyan state "drains ki" so to speak. I believe that it takes ki to transform and that the state itself is strenuous on the body because of low stats compared to maintaining high power; otherwise, users seem to be able to fight and use ki attacks just fine. Stabilizing Super Saiyan by raising stats to match its power, makes transforming seem effortless because the ki needed to transform seemed like a lot when stats were low, whereas stats are now relative to Super Saiyan power and make ki used to transform seem trivial:
Furthermore, sense stats like stamina and focus match power, it would make sense that Super Saiyan power would only be as strenuous as Fighting Power, and as easy to raise and lower as Ready Power. Edited by DEY DID DIS 2 ME, Jun 26 2013, 05:43 AM.
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| * Ketchup Revenge | Jun 27 2013, 02:53 AM Post #12 | |||||||||||||||
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"Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the war room!"
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The official name for it as far as I know that's listed in the Daizenshuu is "Supa Saiya-jin Furu Powa" (Super Saiyan Full Power in English). |
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The vengeance is her's for as long as she stands by Him. | ||||||||||||||||
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| + Pyrus | Jun 27 2013, 03:08 AM Post #13 | |||||||||||||||
 
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"Grade 4" and "Super Saiyan Full-Power" are the only official names ever given in supplemental material, while the form is simply "Super Saiyan" in the manga and "Mastered Super Saiyan" to a large chunk of the fan base. | |||||||||||||||
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