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| Akira confirmed Cell's a Solar System Buster? | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: May 28 2013, 10:31 PM (8,567 Views) | |
| NavonWise | May 29 2013, 03:40 PM Post #31 |
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Realist Rapper Alive
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Ok so basically, Cell can't do it because it is not logical in reality, even thought this is a fantasy world. Yup, let's bring out the rules of reality and mix it with a cartoon, because talking dogs is also logical right? Bro this is not a case of reality, I don't understand how it's hard to get this; this is a fantasy story, a story that when a statement is made, you have to assume it is true unless proven wrong in the story. You guys are saying Cell is lying and provide no evidence of this claim, and the only one that actually did was miguelnuva. |
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| * Yu Narukami | May 29 2013, 03:53 PM Post #32 |
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Izanagi!
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Right then. The speed of light in DBZ is, say, 400 MPH. It's fantasy, not reality. You tell me how Cell can destroy a Solar System. Go on. Don't just say ''Oh, it's fantasy''. I can take the 'fantasy' stuff to a certain degree, but when it blatantly goes against every single thing we're aware of, no. |
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| EMIYA | May 29 2013, 03:58 PM Post #33 |
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"I am the bone of my sword."
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It doesn't work like that. A person doesn't say something and automatically its true, it's the essense of the statement and how it flows along with everything else. When Cell says he can destroy a solar system then unless AT or some official source gives us the DBZverse of the solar system we have to assume he means the realistic, light years part massive 9 planet+sun solar system. And at no point has anyone, before or after has anyone produced that level of attack. Freeza himself couldn't even destroy a planet without hitting the core and even though there's a multi difference between him and Cell, there's an even massive multi-difference in the size of the solar system. Kid Boo could not blow up a solar system, nobody could. The biggest blast radius in the series was arguably planet size. Cell can say all he wants. It's words are purely contradicted to what we see You can call it lying, you can call it poor writing, you can call it anything you want, you can argue that the DBZverse has a solar system the length between Earth and Mars (and even that's potentially arguable) but when it comes to the actual solar system, Cell isn't doing it and nothing shows he ever could beyond his words which of course are a contradiction. |
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| + Solid Snake | May 29 2013, 06:42 PM Post #34 |
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滅Are you frightened?
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Thanks, this is pretty much all I needed to hear. A mod can close this now if they wish. |
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| NavonWise | May 29 2013, 08:17 PM Post #35 |
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Bro, we know the DBZ universe is different because there are planets in that universe that do not exist in our REAL universe. Again, this is not a matter of whether it is illogical or not, this is a matter of disproving Cell's statement. The only legitimate evidence is Kid Buu not blowing up the whole solar system, this whole, "it's not logical" argument don't work. |
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| EMIYA | May 29 2013, 08:56 PM Post #36 |
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"I am the bone of my sword."
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I have disproven though, multiple times. Cell says he can destroy the solar system, his KHH is subsequently overpowered by Gohan who in turn did not destroy the solar system. Kid Boo hit the planet and didn't blow up the solar system. The blast radius of the entire series that we've seen wouldn't even dent the real sun. Super Boo's earth shattering blast against Gotenks didn't decimate the solar system when it was unleashed. Cell statement alone means nothing. People can say whatever they want, it means jack. You're acting as if something stated in the manga makes it automatically true because its in the manga so it must be true. When in fact that's not the way it works. You have to look at how the statement is and how the context of the statement is. Otherwise Boo is truly an immortal freak. Vegeta said it, it's right there in the manga. But Boo's not an immortal freak, because the statement there is a contradiction to what really happens. Boo dies, thus Boo is not immortal. You can't take statements at face value unless their probably claim to them. Cell says he can destroy the solar system and he doesn't just say "a solar system" he says "the solar system" indicating the sun and 9 planets kind of solar system. Throughout countless evidence nobody has ever produced that level of attack. I've disproven Cell's statement through the sheer evidence surrounding it. This isn't about fantasy, Cell makes a statement and you have to compare that to the closest thing you can. Cell says the solar system, we don't have the DBZverse equivalent in a guidebook that says the solar system, we can only use the realistic solar system as a guide. Unless you want to say the DBZverse solar system is massively smaller than the real one, Cell's not destroying it. |
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| + Clearin | May 29 2013, 08:59 PM Post #37 |
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How much damage a blast does seems to be greatly up to the user. Saiyan saga Vegeta can destroy the Earth with a Galick Gun yet his big bang attack did nothing. If Gohan didn't want to blow up the solar system it seems he has the power to make it so his kamehameha won't do that. |
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May 29 2013, 09:05 PM Post #38 |
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I agree that the user has control over his own ki, that's how they do energy waves/volleys/balls in the first place. But I think it's quite a stretch to say someone can destroy an entire solar system or galaxy with said blast. For instance; if Cell had the power to do this in the first place, or ANY character for that matter..why don't they? If Vegeta has the power to destroy planets with a single attack, why not focus that ki and pinpoint on Goku's head and one shot KO him instead of having a 2100 page manga battle? 15 episodes worth? If Gohan has the power to destroy the planet with a single Kamehameha, or the solar system for that matter, why not just instantly kill cell by focusing his energy into a single attack that would kill him? Because we're talking about control, right? |
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| EMIYA | May 29 2013, 09:16 PM Post #39 |
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"I am the bone of my sword."
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As I mentioned before it probably go to the point where it wasn't the size of the blast that matter but the ki density. You don't need a planet sized Genki Dama to destroy Boo, you just need a Genki Dama with right amount and or more ki density inside of it to get the job done. It would be like a balloon and all of the air inside of it is pushing itself outwards. The balloon itself becomes larger but it also becomes less dense, it's not as compact with air as before. There's a point when it gets too much that the balloon pops. Similar aspect with a ki blast radius. The explosion lasts as long as the ki density can hold, afterwards the blast dissipates. If you want to increase the size of the blast, you have to increase the amount of ki inside. In fact by the time Cell created a large enough radius to even get near the solar system busting level, all the ki density would be away and it wouldn't be nothing more than hot air. As another example, take a bunch of marbles and pack them all together. Now spread em all out, the first one is far denser than the second and that's what matters with ki. |
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| NavonWise | May 29 2013, 10:07 PM Post #40 |
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Are you reading my posts clearly? Vegeta's comment about Buu being an immortal freak WAS contradicted, that is why it was proven that he wasn't. If Buu had lived, then Vegeta was right, but since it was proven that he CAN die, Vegeta's comments are then wrong. And no, you're missing the point, if a statement is made and that statement is not contradicted, how can you NOT assume it's fact? Vegeta says Gohan's amazing powers most likely comes from him being a hybrid; nothing contradicts that statement, and therefore we take it as fact. Frieza says he's the strongest, but we know this to be false because he was beaten. Goku says the earrings stopped working inside of Buu probably because of the nasty air inside of Buu at least according to Viz; can anyone get Herms in here? Anyway, is that statement contradicted? If not, how are you going to say it's false because it doesn't make sense? If a statement can be proven to be wrong in the story, then it's wrong, if you can't disprove the statement within the story, it's a fact. |
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| EMIYA | May 29 2013, 10:33 PM Post #41 |
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"I am the bone of my sword."
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What do you honestly think I've been doing through these past posts. I've already disproven Cell's solar busting statement using both in-story evidence and out of story evidence. I also bring up my "Reasonable Claims argument from before"
It's called a contradiction, both from the standpoint in the story itself and in the standpoint of the logic that surrounds it.
I again repeat, reasonable claim argument.
Reasonable Claim Argument Cell's solar busting is not only a contradiction to what we see but it is neither a reasonable claim to make. Vegeta can say Gohan's power is from being a hybrid and we can take that as truth because for one it's not contradicted but also it's actually supported later on in the story such as with Goten and Trunks. Goku can say that the essence of Boo caused the Patora to defuse because one it's not contradicted and two it's only relative to the story itself. There's nothing to compare it to and thus we take it as fact until its contradicted. I repeat again to my Freeza comment. If Freeza stated he destroyed 100 planets and it's not contradicted later on in some way, we can take it as the truth. Because it's a reasonable claim that can be made. There's a major difference when you compare statements that only relate to the story itself and a statement that potentially relates the story and outside aspects (in this case the solar system) Certain claims have more value to them than others.. You literally can't just pick a random statement and say its true, you have to look at the whole thing. You have to look at the statement and how it flows with the context. Does it make sense? Is it a reasonable claim? Is it contradicted in any way? Now tell me, how is Cell going to do it? Despite the fact that nobody else those multi-folds stronger than him has managed it? Because a statement alone only holds so much value. Especially when this is a comparison between two opposing points. A statement made in the manga and it's comparison to a real world issue. |
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| NavonWise | May 29 2013, 11:05 PM Post #42 |
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Like I said before, Vegeta self-destructed attempting to destroy Buu and the Earth was left unharmed. Frieza at a level WAY below Vegeta at that time destroyed planet Vegeta with little effort; Vegeta put everything he had, I mean he killed himself so wouldn't that count as putting everything he had in there? That blast did nothing to Earth, while a MUCH weaker Frieza destroyed a planet who I assume was tougher than Earth. |
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| + Solid Snake | May 29 2013, 11:33 PM Post #43 |
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滅Are you frightened?
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You have a point the ki must have been controlled otherwise the planet should have been nothing more than space dust cause Vegeta at that time was far stronger than even Mech Frieza. |
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| bardock1990 | May 29 2013, 11:57 PM Post #44 |
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Like I said, it wasn't directed at the earth but fat Buu. It left a gigantic crater, but it did not go into the ground to reach the core of the planet. To destroy a planet the KI must reach the core atleast or go deep enough to cause a chain reaction. |
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| * Yu Narukami | May 30 2013, 12:07 AM Post #45 |
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Izanagi!
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Supernova argument is pointless anyway. Chapter 415 (DBZ 221), P3.2, P4.2 Context : while charging the Kamehameha Cell : "I've already gathered enough ki to blow away not only the Earth, but the Solar System as well!" He says his ki, meaning that he isn't thinking of blowing up the sun. Again, destroying a solar system is impossible. Edited by Yu Narukami, May 30 2013, 12:07 AM.
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