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- Do 23rd Krillin and Yamcha surpass Piccolo Daimao?
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| Do 23rd Krillin and Yamcha surpass Piccolo Daimao? | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Feb 15 2013, 11:27 PM (3,691 Views) | |
| * Ketchup Revenge | Feb 16 2013, 08:40 PM Post #31 |
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I don't know if AT ever said that, but I know Nappa did. I'm thinking that it could be an average estimation from Nappa. He couldn't judge exact levels without a scouter anyway. If you can cite where AT said that, I'd be willing to believe you. |
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| Alex D. Boss | Feb 16 2013, 08:46 PM Post #32 |
 
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| + Emmeth | Feb 16 2013, 08:50 PM Post #33 |
I ♥ Yoeri
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I just realized something. In the 23rd Budokai, Kami directly interfers with Goku and Piccolo Jr's fight and stops Piccolo's powerful punch without too much trouble. I guess I could believe Kami > Popo, but I still don't believe King Piccolo was surpassed by Krillin, much less Yamcha. |
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| + Kyouks | Feb 16 2013, 08:53 PM Post #34 |
 
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You mean you really didn't believe it before? |
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| + Emmeth | Feb 16 2013, 08:55 PM Post #35 |
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I ♥ Yoeri
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I never gave it much thought, honestly. |
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| Alex D. Boss | Feb 16 2013, 08:59 PM Post #36 |
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Kyouks > My logic > Daizenshuu Seriously , its funny how they state King Piccolo > Tien 23nd Budokai |
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| Animelover5487 | Feb 16 2013, 10:24 PM Post #37 |
 
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Goku said that Initial Piccolo was far stronger than his last counterpart im going to assume he means Piccolo Daimao and said it looks like his done some substaintial training. Chapter: 168, P4.2-P.5.1 Yamcha: “That guy’s pretty darn good too…” Kuririn: “Man, I give up…why does this tournament have to be a collection of such incredible guys?...” Goku: “Piccolo’s doppelganger, huh?...But his power is way greater than the previous Piccolo…Seems that he’s done some substantial training too…” So based on that even Initial Piccolo was stronger than Piccolo Daimao. Initial Piccolo was barely any stronger than Krillin they were evenly matched. He had a hard time blocking his hits.  And had to retreat up in the air.  No way is Piccolo going to have to fly up in the air from someone way weaker than him like Piccolo Daimao. Chapter: 171, P12.5, P13.1-2 Piccolo: “Frankly, I’m surprised…Not by your Bukujutsu, but by your technique and movement…And your toughness…To apologize for calling you a small fry, I’ll show you just a little bit…” Kuririn: “What? What will you show me?!” Piccolo: “The true power of the great Ma Junior…” And he took a hard hit from a Piccolo that's using even more power so at this point it should be obvious Krillin > Piccolo Daimao. Piccolo said his fodder compared to how powerful he is now and we know from Piccolo thinking that taking over the world was going to harder that Krillin isn't. Now as for Yamcha, Shen said that Yamcha was a good fighter and Shen is a stronger opponent than Mr. Popo so the gap between him and Shen is lower than the gap between Goku and Popo. Shen also felt that he would have to run away from Yamcha's Spirit Ball, There's a statement about Kami being nerfed while in Shen's body but I doubt it was by that much and Shen would still one shot Piccolo Daimao so if Yamcha was weaker he should have been able to tank it. Shen said that Yamcha only needed a LITTLE training to get to his level a 2x gap and up wouldn't be a little training. Chapter: 175, P4.5, 5.1 Yamcha: “What’s happening? I’m being treated just like a baby.” Shen: “No no, you’re strong, already quite so. I can tell by your movements. It’s just unfortunate that I’m much, much stronger still. Train just a little bit more, and you’ll soon catch up to me.” |
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| Captain Cadaver | Feb 17 2013, 01:10 AM Post #38 |
Absolute End of Century Conquerer
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Plus, Piccolo even stated after defeating Kuririn that world domination wouldn't be as easy as he planned, despite having viewed what he'd seen of Goku's power as nothing impressive, yet never made any mention of it being less than that which he fought Daimao with. |
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| + Emmeth | Feb 17 2013, 01:41 AM Post #39 |
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I ♥ Yoeri
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My judgement may be clouded, since I love both Piccolo and Piccolo Daimao so much. I guess it has been intended for the heroes to get stronger and stronger, and I guess that they could take on Daimao and take him down. |
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| Kblo247 | Feb 17 2013, 01:43 AM Post #40 |
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I think its fair to see Goku Majunior Kami Tien Krillin King Piccolo Yamcha Tao Yajirobe Chaozu Roshi Chi Chi Everyone else Based off statements and what we are shown. And yes I think Tao is inferior, its just that Yamcha and Krillin can't sense power at the time. Only Kami, Majunior, and Goku can, so they freak at the knife which would still kill Tien being that he's a human. I would say Tien is comfortably over the king, whereas Krillin is over him (15% or so) but would still have to put up effort in a fight. I'd have Yamcha below him but in a gap that allows him to be able to fight him and possibly win, maybe 10% weaker. Edited by Kblo247, Feb 17 2013, 01:47 AM.
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| + Emmeth | Feb 17 2013, 01:48 AM Post #41 |
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I ♥ Yoeri
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Makes sense. I am willing to agree that Yamcha MIGHT be just above Tao, but not by very much. I'd like to think they are pretty even. Krillin's progress over the 3 years was amazing, so I really want to commend him. |
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| Battle Power | Feb 17 2013, 01:54 AM Post #42 |
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Hmm, all interesting points, I'm going to take them all into consideration next time I redo my list. From all I can gather and remember (which isn't much): Yamucha Defending he's stronger than Daimao 1) Kami said he'd reach him with a bit of training. If the gap isn't that big, then he's (Yamucha) sure to be already stronger than Daimao. 2) Kami said he was a good fighter. Defending he's weaker than Daimao 1) Kami saying he was a good fighter isn't much to go on. He was impressed by Yamucha's Sokidan, other than that, Yamucha got trashed. Besides, Yamucha's supposed to be (as much as people pick on him) a great fighter, he's one of the strongest people on Earth at the time. Popo saying Goku is pathetic doesn't necessarily means Kami is gonna trash-talk too. 2) Junior said he could take out everyone but Goku at the same time, if you go by that, there's not much room for Kuririn / Yamucha to be stronger than Daimao without going overboard their Z PLs. * Kuririn Defending he's stronger than Daimao 1) Piccolo commented as him not being just a weakling. If he's not a weakling to Junior's standards, than he's stronger than Daimao. 2) Kuririn kept up with Piccolo (Initial) untill Piccolo showed him "a bit of his true powers". He'd have to be at least stronger than Daimao to do this. Defending he's weaker than Daimao 1) Same reason as Kami complementing Yamucha, technique. Piccolo wasn't expecting a technique as creative as Kakusandan, which gave Kuririn an opening. He actually commented on Kuririn's cunning, not raw power. 2) Since characters aren't shown to actually suppress / power-up in DB in terms of raw ki, Goku sensing that Piccolo (Initial) was stronger than Daimao didn't matter. Characters in DB don't gradually power-up mid-fight, but simply punch lighter, run slower compared to their full strenght, untill they feel required to punch harder, etc. 3) Junior said he could take out everyone but Goku at the same time, if you go by that, there's not much room for Kuririn / Yamucha to be stronger than Daimao without going overboard their Z PLs. * *Most people have Daimao (Young) around 200+ or so. Considering that: Junior >> Kami >> Popo >> Daimao If you put Kuririn / Yamucha above Daimao, then the chain would be like this: Junior >> Kami >> Tenshinhan >> Kuririn > Yamucha > Daimao, with Popo being somewhere in the middle of Kami and Daimao. Considering the stomp range at 20% (some people use 33% or even more), then: 385 >> 320 >> 265 >> 220 > 210 > 200, making them all above their BoZ readings. I still have Kuririn and Yamucha weaker than Daimao, but I might change this next time I work on my list, good discussion. |
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| Captain Cadaver | Feb 17 2013, 01:58 AM Post #43 |
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Absolute End of Century Conquerer
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I wouldn't really see there as being enough of a gap between Yamcha and Kuririn to squeeze Daimao into, especially when Kami commended Yamcha, compared to Popo talking down to Goku and calling him weak. The list is missing Popo. I don't see Chichi being that weak. Even if taking into account Goku being confused about her anger, do you really see someone weaker than Roshi making Goku sweat from dodging their attacks? Not only that, but Chichi performing better against Goku than Tao did against Ten says something. |
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| Kblo247 | Feb 17 2013, 02:47 AM Post #44 |
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All irate women made Goku sweat. Case and point Launch and Bulma when they are in a mood. The fact Chi Chi can fight and he's genuinely confused why she's so pissed at him makes me think that. When he hears she will tell him who she is if he wins, he ends it effortlessly. I think it was Goku being Goku, and Akira making it so the irate women would still scare them no matter how powerful they are, which is what we are shown. Bulma does it to Vegeta, Videl to Gohan, Chi Chi to Goku, Chi and Bulma to Krillin ... It's just a thing he does IMO. --- I'd also place Popo between Krillin and Kami btw. And as far as Krillin and Yamcha, Krillin has always been superior. Yamcha could improve but Krillins always improved more than him and shocked guys in DB. In Z, we see him improve at an even bigger rate than the other humans and become more useful. It isn't a knock on Yamcha, just an I think Krillin is smarter training by himself than the other humans |
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| Nanho | Feb 17 2013, 02:56 AM Post #45 |
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Spoiler: click to toggle hmm, this is way after his fight with krillin. ''I'm warning you I'm not at the same level I was 3 years ago'' its a stretch, but this could be implying he wasn't using a power greater power than king piccolo yet. |
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