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Vegeta stronger then Goku?
Topic Started: Jan 11 2013, 06:59 AM (2,051 Views)
+ Clearin
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Kamikaze Pyro
Jan 11 2013, 07:28 PM
Clearin
Jan 11 2013, 07:18 PM
Kamikaze Pyro
Jan 11 2013, 07:13 PM
He had one or two more hits in the manga than Goku, but that's it. You're probably thinking about the extensive filler in the anime, in which Vegeta did do a lot more damage.
Actually in the manga both Goku and Vegeta hit each other the same amount of times (It's not much at all though since we see very little of the fight).
-Goku blocks a kick.
-Goku blocks a punch.
-Vegeta blocks a punch.
-They counter their knee shots with each other's knees.
-Vegeta lands a headbutt.
-I can't tell if Goku lands that kick directly after or if Vegeta simply jumped out of the way.
[intermission]
-Vegeta lands a punch.
-Goku lands a punch.
-They block each other and then do that fast fighting stuff.

End fight.

If you think Goku landed that one kick, then yeah, they had equal hits. If not, Vegeta landed one more. Not much of a fight. :(
I'm pretty sure Goku landed the kick judging by the position of Vegeta's legs in that panel and the fact the next panel shows a huge crash.
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+ Pyrus
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Clearin
Jan 11 2013, 07:38 PM
Kamikaze Pyro
Jan 11 2013, 07:28 PM
Clearin
Jan 11 2013, 07:18 PM
Kamikaze Pyro
Jan 11 2013, 07:13 PM
He had one or two more hits in the manga than Goku, but that's it. You're probably thinking about the extensive filler in the anime, in which Vegeta did do a lot more damage.
Actually in the manga both Goku and Vegeta hit each other the same amount of times (It's not much at all though since we see very little of the fight).
-Goku blocks a kick.
-Goku blocks a punch.
-Vegeta blocks a punch.
-They counter their knee shots with each other's knees.
-Vegeta lands a headbutt.
-I can't tell if Goku lands that kick directly after or if Vegeta simply jumped out of the way.
[intermission]
-Vegeta lands a punch.
-Goku lands a punch.
-They block each other and then do that fast fighting stuff.

End fight.

If you think Goku landed that one kick, then yeah, they had equal hits. If not, Vegeta landed one more. Not much of a fight. :(
I'm pretty sure Goku landed the kick judging by the position of Vegeta's legs in that panel and the fact the next panel shows a huge crash.
I guess I could agree to that. Only helps in future debates anyhow.
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FamousBueller
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Super Asian

I'm pretty sure vegeta had the upper hand because goku had his mind somewhere else

But I have vegeta stronger at these times
Vegeta vs goku - saiyan saga
Vegeta - on namek
Vegeta - after recoome
Vegeta - after krillins blast
Vegeta - against 19
Vegeta - after htc first time
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+ Pyrus
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Goku didn't have mind anywhere else until Boo powered up.
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+ Havoc_Wreaker
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Popcorn

well to be fair there was some off screen fighting that we dont get to see

but it would be better if they did show more of the fight instead of them both agreeing to stop
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Dalmore
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I don't care if Goku was the strongest, VEGIE WAS THE COOLEST!
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+ miguelnuva
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Vegeta was stronger

Saiyan saga to Zarbon 2nd fight(Goku might gone over Vegeta here.)
After Recoome Zenkai to end of 3 year training.
Andorid battle to Goku ROSAT trip(We are told Vegeta is stronger but the characters led me to believe that gap is that big.)

And that is it.

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Gogeta power placement
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90sDBZ
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Actually Vegeta technically wasn't stronger than Goku after the Recoome Zenkai. He was clearly no match for 2nd Form Frieza who was at around 1 million. Goku was at 90,000 without Kaioken so a Kaioken x10 would take him to 900,000 so would be almost enough to match 2nd Form Frieza and a Kaioken x20 would take Goku to 180,0000 and would destroy 2nd Form Frieza and maybe even give 3rd Form Frieza a run for his money.
Edited by 90sDBZ, Jan 11 2013, 11:22 PM.
"The future of Gohan. The Future of Chi Chi. Not to mention the future of the entire universe. It all depends on me!!!! And I don't care if you're a million times stronger than me! I'm not going to let them down! So get ready Frieza because this time you're going Down!!!"
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Kblo247
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1,800,000 not 18,000,000 , which is weaker than Gohans burst and would get Goku killed.

Vegeta was superior. If you want to talk their win loss record, Goku has never beat Vegeta in a one on one fight and had to be saved from death
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90sDBZ
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Kblo247
Jan 11 2013, 11:24 PM
1,800,000 not 18,000,000 , which is weaker than Gohans burst and would get Goku killed.

Vegeta was superior. If you want to talk their win loss record, Goku has never beat Vegeta in a one on one fight and had to be saved from death
Yeah I realised my mistake with the numbers and corrected it right before you posted. But how do you have Gohan's burst being stronger than that? It's way over a million which is what Frieza was at. And Vegeta wouldn't even approach 2nd Form Frieza.

Technically speaking he did beat Vegeta in GT when Baby was in his body. The 2nd fight wasn't finished. The 1st Vegeta only won because Goku's tail was sacrificed for the good of the earth.
Edited by 90sDBZ, Jan 11 2013, 11:35 PM.
"The future of Gohan. The Future of Chi Chi. Not to mention the future of the entire universe. It all depends on me!!!! And I don't care if you're a million times stronger than me! I'm not going to let them down! So get ready Frieza because this time you're going Down!!!"
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Alex D. Boss
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90sDBZ
Jan 11 2013, 11:32 PM
Technically speaking he did beat Vegeta in GT when Baby was in his body. The 2nd fight wasn't finished. The 1st Vegeta only won because Goku's tail was sacrificed for the good of the earth.
1st fight Vegeta crushed Goku. Goku sacrificing his tail was his own choice and even if he had a tail he would lose considering he can't control his Oozaru form which Vegeta can. 2nd fight was Goku's mistake for being unguarded even if you had to know not to trust Vegeta , thats why Vegeta calls him being soft in battles.
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calivsak
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im mainly talking about raw brute strength. goku mainly used ki multipliers but im talking about, like i said, raw brute hard hitting strength.
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+ Pyrus
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90sDBZ
Jan 11 2013, 11:32 PM
Kblo247
Jan 11 2013, 11:24 PM
1,800,000 not 18,000,000 , which is weaker than Gohans burst and would get Goku killed.

Vegeta was superior. If you want to talk their win loss record, Goku has never beat Vegeta in a one on one fight and had to be saved from death
Yeah I realised my mistake with the numbers and corrected it right before you posted. But how do you have Gohan's burst being stronger than that? It's way over a million which is what Frieza was at. And Vegeta wouldn't even approach 2nd Form Frieza.

Technically speaking he did beat Vegeta in GT when Baby was in his body. The 2nd fight wasn't finished. The 1st Vegeta only won because Goku's tail was sacrificed for the good of the earth.
No, technically speaking, he beat Vegeta's body and Baby's mind, so it wasn't really Vegeta.

And so what about the tail? Vegeta won that fight decisively.
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Kblo247
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90sDBZ
Jan 11 2013, 11:32 PM
Kblo247
Jan 11 2013, 11:24 PM
1,800,000 not 18,000,000 , which is weaker than Gohans burst and would get Goku killed.

Vegeta was superior. If you want to talk their win loss record, Goku has never beat Vegeta in a one on one fight and had to be saved from death
Yeah I realised my mistake with the numbers and corrected it right before you posted. But how do you have Gohan's burst being stronger than that? It's way over a million which is what Frieza was at. And Vegeta wouldn't even approach 2nd Form Frieza.

Technically speaking he did beat Vegeta in GT when Baby was in his body. The 2nd fight wasn't finished. The 1st Vegeta only won because Goku's tail was sacrificed for the good of the earth.
Gohans burst pushed Fireza to transform into his final form right after. I thought we were talking that second enraged burst by Gohan which eclipsed the others badly. His first burst vs second form Frieza was powerful, but Goku likely can't do kaioken x 20 before that zenkai and chamber healing anyhow as his stronger body couldn't even maintain the energy upsurge.

Technically he beat Baby, but even then it wasn't clear cut. He didnt beat Vegetas mind or battle instincts, he beat the vessel. The first time they ever fought, Vegeta crushed him, and he did it with a technique. The fake moon is as much a technique as kaioken. Gohan and Krillin, literally saved his behind, and even Yajirobe had to help just to force him to retreat. The second fight they were technically even in the manga (anime showed Vegeta stomping a mud hole in him) Vegeta still knocked him out though. So point stands that Goku has never beat Vegeta on his own, in fact he's been left laying and needed to be saved each time they faced off (1 - Gohan and Krillin, 2 - Dende heals him, GT - if you count Baby, Kibitoshin stops him from being killed)
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90sDBZ
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Kblo247
Jan 12 2013, 02:53 AM
90sDBZ
Jan 11 2013, 11:32 PM
Kblo247
Jan 11 2013, 11:24 PM
1,800,000 not 18,000,000 , which is weaker than Gohans burst and would get Goku killed.

Vegeta was superior. If you want to talk their win loss record, Goku has never beat Vegeta in a one on one fight and had to be saved from death
Yeah I realised my mistake with the numbers and corrected it right before you posted. But how do you have Gohan's burst being stronger than that? It's way over a million which is what Frieza was at. And Vegeta wouldn't even approach 2nd Form Frieza.

Technically speaking he did beat Vegeta in GT when Baby was in his body. The 2nd fight wasn't finished. The 1st Vegeta only won because Goku's tail was sacrificed for the good of the earth.
Gohans burst pushed Fireza to transform into his final form right after. I thought we were talking that second enraged burst by Gohan which eclipsed the others badly. His first burst vs second form Frieza was powerful, but Goku likely can't do kaioken x 20 before that zenkai and chamber healing anyhow as his stronger body couldn't even maintain the energy upsurge.

Technically he beat Baby, but even then it wasn't clear cut. He didnt beat Vegetas mind or battle instincts, he beat the vessel. The first time they ever fought, Vegeta crushed him, and he did it with a technique. The fake moon is as much a technique as kaioken. Gohan and Krillin, literally saved his behind, and even Yajirobe had to help just to force him to retreat. The second fight they were technically even in the manga (anime showed Vegeta stomping a mud hole in him) Vegeta still knocked him out though. So point stands that Goku has never beat Vegeta on his own, in fact he's been left laying and needed to be saved each time they faced off (1 - Gohan and Krillin, 2 - Dende heals him, GT - if you count Baby, Kibitoshin stops him from being killed)
I was talking about Gohan's first burst against 2nd Form Frieza. Goku could definitely surpass that imo while Vegeta was no match for 2nd form Frieza so that means that Goku>Post Recoome Zenkai Vegeta. Obviously he wouldn't surpass Gohan's burst against 3rd form Frieza but that has nothing to do with comparing Goku to Vegeta.

I think he could manage a 20x kaioken personally. On earth he managed x4 and since then his power had increased more than tenfold so surely his body could just about handle x20 even before the zenkai. He'd trained himself to use higher levels of Kaioken on the way to namek. The zenkai he got after the Ginyu battle just increased his normal power if you ask me. Kaioken is a technique that needs to be perfected through training.
"The future of Gohan. The Future of Chi Chi. Not to mention the future of the entire universe. It all depends on me!!!! And I don't care if you're a million times stronger than me! I'm not going to let them down! So get ready Frieza because this time you're going Down!!!"
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