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Family Kamehameha vs Father And Son Kamehameha
Topic Started: Dec 24 2012, 06:14 PM (14,507 Views)
Nimbo-Bimbo lord of all noobs
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K.O.A.N Antirebel
Dec 24 2012, 11:26 PM
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Look at Goten. Now look at Goku. Goten's hair is Super Saiyan hair. Goku's hair is not. I am pointing a cross and Bible at my laptop and hissing.
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Kamikaze Pyro
Dec 24 2012, 11:20 PM
It doesn't pay to bing up Movie 4. He doesn't understand that it DOESNT'T MATTER what Toei based their version of Super Saiyan off of - it's the fact that they were given permission and a little physical guidance from Toriyama to reveal the big transformation in the movie before The Man Himself had even drawn it in the manga. It doesn't matter that he went with a different design in the end.
No, it's you who doesn't understand that Toei wanted the SSJ to begin with becasue Movie 4 refers to the Ginyu Arc where Goku was described as the SSJ so Toei just made their own form of the SSJ. Your logic would make sense if SSJ2 Goku was known to be in the Anime already by Vegeta just like when Vegeta also stated in the Ginyu Arc about the SSJ so no. Sadly how it is.
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EMIYA
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"I am the bone of my sword."

Damn, even the new guy "BalrogTheBeast" is pounding this guy's logic like its nothing. Save some tuna for the rest of us please.
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BalrogTheBeast
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Sir?
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LET JESUS ***** YOU!


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K.O.A.N Antirebel
Dec 24 2012, 11:26 PM
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Look at Goten. Now look at Goku. Goten's hair is Super Saiyan hair. Goku's hair is not. I am pointing a cross and Bible at my laptop and hissing.
gOTEN'S HAIR STANDS MORE THAN NORMAL THOUGH AND i ALSO POSTED A PICTURE FROM THE dAIZENSHUU WHERE gOHAN LOOKS LIKE A ssj. tHE same Daizenshuu which also inisinuates Goku was an illusion in Movie 10.
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+ Pyrus
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Dragon Ball Z
Dec 24 2012, 11:31 PM
Kamikaze Pyro
Dec 24 2012, 11:20 PM
It doesn't pay to bing up Movie 4. He doesn't understand that it DOESNT'T MATTER what Toei based their version of Super Saiyan off of - it's the fact that they were given permission and a little physical guidance from Toriyama to reveal the big transformation in the movie before The Man Himself had even drawn it in the manga. It doesn't matter that he went with a different design in the end.
No, it's you who doesn't understand that Toei wanted the SSJ to begin with becasue Movie 4 refers to the Ginyu Arc where Goku was described as the SSJ so Toei just made their own form of the SSJ. Your logic would make sense if SSJ2 Goku was known to be in the Anime already by Vegeta just like when Vegeta also stated in the Ginyu Arc about the SSJ so no. Sadly how it is.
Do you have inside knowledge that the rest of us don't? I've never read anywhere that Toei asked for it.

By the way, how tall do you think the Family Kamehameha is at a vertical angle?
Spoiler: click to toggle
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Brofist
Dec 24 2012, 11:27 PM
Dragon Ball Z
Dec 24 2012, 11:19 PM
Brofist
Dec 24 2012, 10:45 PM
No point in debating with you, should we just troll/spam this topic until it gets closed too?
Yeah, after I was just debating, you guys started trolling me for no good reason. Nice to see how you do so with the facts. Anyway, I have already posted all the evidence and you never even read it. That's called terrible debating skills and also bias.
:x

:o

:w00t:

:'( No...no...I wlil not laugh...I will not...

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That's called terrible debating skills and also bias.


:)

>_<

:lol:

Sorry, I lost...I could not handle myself while reading your vastly intelligent post.
I was not saying it to you and you know, I want to apologize if I insulted anyone or something. It's just that some of you here started talking badly to me without any reason so it was pretty annoying so sorry. :yay:
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Nimbo-Bimbo lord of all noobs
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it's called a 3-Man-Kamehameha by the Daizenshuu

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BalrogTheBeast
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Sir? Have you ignored the posts I have been given towards thee? The Daizenshuu never called Goku's appearance an illusion either. They went as far as to call it a "three man Kamehameha"...

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http://i.imgur.com/I6Yv9.png

http://www.kanzentai.com/trans-daiz06.php?m=13&id=dbz10#link
Edited by BalrogTheBeast, Dec 24 2012, 11:37 PM.
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LET JESUS ***** YOU!


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Nimbo-Bimbo lord of all noobs
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Also note the quote: "Goku assists as well" in 24 ~ 25
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BalrogTheBeast
Dec 24 2012, 11:27 PM
Dragon Ball Z
Dec 24 2012, 11:23 PM
BalrogTheBeast
Dec 24 2012, 11:10 PM
First off, I would like to agree with K.O.A.N Antirebel, that wonderful fair beast of a man.
And I would also like to agree with Naked Snake, so wonderful to show us his cleavage and true beliefs.
I would also like to agree with Kyouka, for his newly developed testicles.

I would like to disagree with DragonBallZ. He seems to have a bit of a misinforming sense towards all this mumbojumbo about the great and almighty fair Broly.

You see, Goku was a True Super Saiyajin 2.

The controversial Kamehameha wave...

Now, the Daizenshuu confirms, itself, that Goku was there, calling it a three-man Kamehameha.

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Now, lets inspect the wind factor of each KHH wave first:

Spoiler: click to toggle


now, there is also this picture:

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Gohan's hair went SSj2 in this pic and the movie
Goten's hair is unaffected by the wind in the pic and the movie
Goku's hair went SSj2, in this pic and the movie.

Contradictory? I think not.

Broly survives it, then proceeds to hit the sun.
I like when you neglect the end of the page which asks if Goku was an illusion or not which indicates and insinuates he was not rally there. Anyway, his present was there like in the Cell Games when Gohan eat Cell. In both fights, the Daizenshuu and Anime state he donated his ki.

There have been much debates over Goku was a SSJ2 or just a SSJ in the end of the beam struggle. I am going to prove that he was actually a SSJ until the very end.

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Goku, Gohan and Goten are all shown as SSJs in this picture.

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This is a Movie 10 drawing from the Daizenshuu which shows Gohan as a SSJ and Goku's hair like SSJ style.

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However, this is another Daizenshuu drawing which shows Goku like a SSJ2. However, Goten's hair also stands more than normal. That proves that posters like that from the Daizenshuu can't be taken too seriously because they contradict themselves all the time.

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However, this is a picture from the movie showing Gohan has two bangs stand after Goku said "now" implying he might had been SSJ till the end.

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Another poster showing Goku and Goten are SSJs while Gohan was SSJ2.

As you can see, there are posters which support that Gohan and Goku were just SSJs and others which show Goku and Gohan have SSJ2 hair which means they contradict themselves and can't really be used for a total proof.

Now, let's get into the SSJ2 appearance.

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As you can see, SSJ2 Goku has 1 bang in the middle of his har and 1 small bang in any side of his hair. However, Goku in Movie 10 just had 1 bang stands after saying "now" which indicates that the reason why his hair changed was just because it got pushed back by the attack after saying "now"and there are far more evidence to support it as true.

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This is Goku in the Rosat when he powered up, you can clearly see that his hair changed into just 1 bang in the middle of his hair, similliar to Goku in Movie 10.

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Goku fired a Kamehameha at Frieza and had one bang stands just like in the Rosat and in Movie 10. Where I get into that, basically when Gokuy powers up to FP, his hair chages into one bang stands as seen in the events I just showed while SSJ2 has two small bangs in the sides. Goku's hair in Movie 10 is the same thing like in the Rosat and when he attacked Frieza which is just the result of going FP. If Gokudid use SSJ2 in Movie 10 so he should have the same appearance he had vs Fat Buu.

Goku haveing one bang is either when he uses max power, goes all out or fires a Kamehameha. Goku having 1 bang stands in the middle of his hair and two small bamgs in the sides is SSJ2.

Now, let's get into the real argument to why Goku was not SSJ2.

Movie 10 was revealed when SSJ2 Goku was barely finished to be drawn in the Manga. It makes no sense that Goku can go SSJ2 in Movie 10 if the Manga just revealed his SSJ2 a few days before. Plus, Toei overall shows the forms in the Anime before showing it in the movies because the Anime came first. SSJ2 Goku was revealed in the Anime far after Movie 10 was revealed. Toei never even showed SSJ3 Gotenks and Mystic Gohan in Movie 12 because they were not revealed in the Anime. Saying Toei showing a form in the movie before showing it in the Anime is like saying the Anime can show the events before the Manga did. Toei even waited until SSJ Vegeta would be introduced in the Anime so they can release Movie 6 despite the fact they copied his look from the Manga. Same case happened in Movie 10. Toei copied SSJ2 Gohan from the Manga but waited until his SSJ2 would be shown in the Anime. Toei showed the concept art for SSJ2 Gohan but never did with Goku implying he never was a SSJ2 somply because it was barely drawn in the Manga.

Manga > Anime > Movies.

Since SSJ2 Goku was barely drawn in the Manga, it makes no sense he can exist in Movie 10. Think about it, why would Goku go SSJ2 if the Omega Blaster got weaker and was most likely as weak as the first one when Goku arrived and they overpowered it? It makes no sense.

There are even evidence to support Goku's appearance in the movie being the same like Gohan when he beat Cell.

Goten never said "I wish dad was here" In the Japanese dub, Goten says "Shenron, help us" and the DragonBalls SEEMINGLY hear Goten. Then, Goku arrives. Notice when Goku arrives, he has a strange aura surrounding his body which shows it was just his spirit. Goku encourging his sons like he did with Gohan vs Cell and Trunks distracted Broly like Vegeta did vs Cell is the same so why should Goku's appearance be any different?

Goku is shown to be behind Gohan and Goten in the end of the beam struggle. Why is he behind? Yes, he is behind them, supporting them so they can use FP just like he did with Gohan vs Cell. In fact if you watch the Japanese dub, whenever someone transforms or goes FP, there is a background noise and Goku said "now" very quitely after his hair changed. The Daizenshuu even says "Is the Goku who appeared was real or not?" insinuating Goku's appearance there was just like with Gohan when he beat Cell. Goku doesn't have vody so he can't be real. Plus, the Dragon Balls should grant two wishes while it seemingly granted one and scattered. The Daizenshuu also says that Goku was donating his ki to Gohan which is also stated by Gohan in the Anime. That can easily be the case for Movie 10 Goku as his sons felt his present and ki in both events. Broly seeing Goku is also just to show that they are rivals IMO. Goku is after all Broly's number 1 enemy since they were babies.

Broly was beaten by SSJ2 Gohan + SSJ Goten + MSSJ Goku donating his ki like he did with Gohan vs Cell is implied.

Now, I amgoing to counter some points that I know Broly Supporters would bring in a debate.

1. Goku was shown as a SSJ in Movie 4 despite the fact that he was not in the Manga so Toei just shows their forms as they lie. That means Goku can easily be SSJ2 in Movie 101.

Counter Argument: The only reason why Goku had appeared as a SSJ is because Movie 4 is based on the Ginyu Saga where Vegeta describes Goku as the SSJ. This is why King Kai's words are the same like Vegeta when he saw Goku on Namek. There were statements about SSJ Goku in the Anime while there is absoluterly no statement or hint in the Anime that Goku has SSJ2. Plus, it's not like Toei showed the real SSJ design. They just showed their own form based on the Ginyu Saga events.

2. Goku used Kaioken X10 in the Movie 3 so thatshows Toei can do what they want.

Counter Argument: Showing a Kaioken Multiplier is very different than showing a form since it was not drawn yet. Besides, Toei most likely followed the logic of Saiyan Saga Goku who used Kaioken X4 at 8,200 so most likely followed math logic but never knew it was the case based on the fact that Toriyama had not made the Frieza Saga at that time and Goku being able to use Kaioken X20.

3. Goku's hair did change while Goten's hair didn't proving Goku was a SSJ2 in the end of the Kamehameha.

Counter Argument: If you notice, Goten's hair overall almost doesn't change like Goku when he powered up. Goku's hair changes when he fires a Kamehameha or power up to max like in the Rosat and vs Frieza but Goten's hair almost never did.

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Goten's hair doesn't change when he powers up or uses Kamehameha at FP like Goku.

With all of this, I think Goku being SSJ2 in Movie 10 is unlikely. I can agree that Gohan went SSJ2 in the end because Goku told him to go all out which means using his SSJ2 which is his FP but Goku being SSJ2 makes no sense.
Great sir, I have not seen the rightful evidence you have ever been loving.

Shall you dare to explain the pictures I have first ever so have loved to post? Or this newfound love I bare with this lustful picture?

http://www.zerochan.net/718418#full

http://static.zerochan.net/Dragonball.full.718418.jpg

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Your second image doesn't work. I also showed images which show them different which should tell you posters contradict themselves. Hell, I even showed a picture from the movie.
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BalrogTheBeast
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Sir, sir, I do not comprehend how it doesn't work, when the concept art that has them all MSSj does.

Clearly 2 different concepts > 1 concept art.

And sir, sir, Goku and Gohan went SSj2 towards the end of the blast if you freeze the frame and such. Sir, you're wrong.
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LET JESUS ***** YOU!


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Brofist
Dec 24 2012, 11:32 PM
Damn, even the new guy "BalrogTheBeast" is pounding this guy's logic like its nothing. Save some tuna for the rest of us please.
How is my logic wrong when I provide evidence? Seriously, this way of debating just points toward your bias.
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BalrogTheBeast
Dec 24 2012, 11:33 PM
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Sir?
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ0227gQ1oZ9ngvZqEypIBEVLMDSD9bIqXuE4xSXCMeA9zReptl

Sir?
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BalrogTheBeast
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Sir, no.

The movie compels you.
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LET JESUS ***** YOU!


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