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| Gains From Training(Training Discussion) | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Oct 21 2012, 03:27 AM (807 Views) | |
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Oct 21 2012, 03:27 AM Post #1 |
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I would like to talk about how strong these characters below have become during some of these different sessions of training or time gaps. How much stronger they have become than their old self after the training, and how/why the training "itself" was so effective. Gohan Z Sword training Goku's trip to to Namek(Gravity Machines, weights, etc.) Gohan(Piccolo training), and Piccolo and Gohan training together EoZ Goten and Trunks- iirc I think I've came across that they didn't exactly quit training, but they still trained a little. Goku during 10 year gap(EoZ) Goku during 5 year gap(BoGT) Gohan(BoGT)- (He continued to train, and even achieved his Super Saiyan forms back. I wonder how strong he could have gotten just by going off his EoZ self, and his fight against Piccolo and Goten. Also depends how strong you think the Bebi infection boost is though.) Goten training with Gohan for the Budokai Piccolo's training in the RoSaT for Cell Games Vegeta during 3 year gap for Androids Goku, Piccolo, and Gohan's training during 3 year gap for androids Gohan and Goku's RoSaT trip(how strong did they become from android arc to start of Cell Games) Vegeta training for SSJ4(Bulma training including gravity bike, and all that kind of stuff she came up with.) I know it's a lot, but I'm really interested to hear some of your thoughts on whichever ones ones you decide to answer if it's all too much for you. |
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| + Kyouks | Oct 21 2012, 04:06 AM Post #2 |
 
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k
Training was very effective, oddly enough, even though it's sorta toned down once the sword breaks. Goku doubts he can beat Boo, Kaioshin thinks "why not"; note that Goku never says Gohan can't. Gohan essentially goes from being fairly easy prey to the likes of SPC to >>> the other SSJ2s. Very big power-up for a single day.
8000+ - 90,000 in 6 days..effective as well. Though zenkais were also a factor, I would think.
wut. Do you mean like in the Saiyan Saga, and then later on in the Androids Saga or something? I'll go with Saiyan Saga. Considering that Gohan essentially learns all the basics of DB/Z martial arts...I'd say it did wonders for him. Also, before, a calm Gohan = 1; later, suppressed Gohan = 981. Quite a progression in chi control. I guess it also has a bit to do with Gohan being Gohan and all. 
They didn't, they just slacked off. Or at least that's the case for Goten. They're still scared of Good Boo, but then again, Good Boo started off leagues ahead of 'em, so IDK.
Everything points to a massive power-up, IMO, despite this not being the case pre-Androids arc, and pre-Boo arc. Perhaps it was because of Goku's determination, as he states that he'll train so that a threat like Boo won't be a threat again. Somehow, this allowed him to surpass his gains prior the Androids arc...SECRET TRAINING.
Whatever he did, it was ridiculous; SSJ Goku @Rilldo would be >>/>>> Gohan-Boo. Not much to say on the matter, really.
IDK, EoZ self was a scholar and was never stated to train, I think. Let's just say EoZ Gohan = U. Gohan, and GT Gohan spent more of his time gaining back his SSJ forms (this allowed Goten to catch up, because towards the end of their fight, Goten actually forces Gohan to go SSJ; a strong indication that Goten progressed far more than Gohan)
He went from calling Gohan amazing to fighting a bit more on par with Gohan. Nothing special IMO, as he had such short time to improve on basics, anyways
Trunks was surprised that Piccolo would be no help to Perfect Cell. Piccolo considered Semi-Cell unreachable. RoSaT training is haxed, and Piccolo got stupid strong. To hell with Base Saiyans > Piccolo.
He most likely was too behind Goku's base; but his gains were bigger by a moderate amount due to training methods. IDK how to describe it, though.
Goku, due to training with two people far weaker than him at first, and doing just plain-old Earth training, DID NOT get any more than roughly 2x stronger. I can elaborate more on this later if you wish. Gohan must've gotten pretty strong, for someone who wasn't SSJ-level, as Goku insisted that he was needed, while Piccolo called the humans useless. Though Goku could've been talkin' 'bout rage boosts. IDK. Piccolo, Piccolo, Piccolo...he must have trained with Goku more, or trained more intensely, or something, because his gains DWARF that of Gohan and the humans, most likely because of how much stronger Goku started off in comparison
Immensely powerful, honestly. Goku called himself useless to the Androids; he comes about able to take on Perfect Cell, albeit a suppressed one, but still. RoSaT and MSSJ mastery did wonders for him. Again, RoSaT for the win. But Gohan....man. Goes from being poop to >> all other Z Senshi. His potential must be a determining factor here, besides just the RoSaT - think of what Gohan could become if he trained before the Boo Saga. This has more to do with Gohan, really, rather than the RoSaT
Well, he went from << SSJ Goku, to >>> Majuub. Musta been crazy, but not much else to go on. Damn GT, getting so strong off a gravity bike of all things. Ah, well. 
wut Edited by Kyouks, Oct 21 2012, 04:14 AM.
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| Kblo247 | Oct 21 2012, 07:54 AM Post #3 |
 
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I wouldn't say GT Goten was amazing enough to force Gohan to transform, as much as he transformed to stop Baby from blowing Gotens body up. To me it always looked like a version of final atonement, and Gohan transformed and contained the blast thus protecting his brothers body from dying |
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Oct 21 2012, 04:03 PM Post #4 |
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Yeah, and Bebi was more eager to have Gohan's body over Goten's. Do you think Goten is still somewhere around Buutenks or Buuhan? Or did he pass them in GT? Bebi in his teen form still wasn't where he needed to be at being on par with Goten. |
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| + Pyrus | Oct 21 2012, 04:51 PM Post #5 |
 
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Well, this is what we get about Goten (the relevant stuff) from his fights with Baby and Gohan. Episode 25 Time: around 20m5s Subject: Baby Narrator: "W-what's this? Baby has appeared on Earth! Goten stands alone to face him. However, will Goten alone be all right against Baby, who has powered up one step higher?" Episode 26 Time: 0m40s Context: Recapping the events of Episode 25 Narrator: "Baby, having powered up, had come to a point where not even Goten could take him lightly." Episode 26 Time: around 2m5s Context: Baby is scoping Goten out Baby: (to himself) "Saiya power! The Ki you are radiating from your body is just like Goku's!" Note: In the dub, Baby says Goten isn't "even half as strong" as he expected. Episode 26 Time: around 4m15s Context: After Goten's chi barrage Baby: "Is that the extent of your Saiya power?" Goten: "What?" Episode 26 Time: around 5m25s Context: Baby has just possessed Goten's body Baby: (to himself) "Power! He's filled with power! So this is Saiya power, huh? I may have failed with Trunks, but I have finally obtained it!" Edited by Pyrus, Oct 21 2012, 04:51 PM.
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| + Kyouks | Oct 21 2012, 05:10 PM Post #6 |
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Depends on where you have Gohan, and methinks that Base Gohan > SSJ Goten, or something like that. |
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| + Pyrus | Oct 21 2012, 05:11 PM Post #7 |
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Yeah, a holding back Base Gohan made Goten go all the way to SSjin2 IMO. |
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Oct 21 2012, 05:13 PM Post #8 |
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You really think that was a SSJ2 huh? I really didn't think those kids were capable of doing something like that. Especially Goten. Are you sure? Edited by Professor Gohan, Oct 21 2012, 05:15 PM.
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| + Pyrus | Oct 21 2012, 05:19 PM Post #9 |
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That's what I'm thinking. Goten alone may not have had the ability, but Baby could've pushed him to it. That's the only point where Gohan was in trouble, and Goten seemed to be different appearance-wise; bigger aura, darker yellow hair, even small lightning. Kblo's theory works, too, though. |
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Oct 21 2012, 05:25 PM Post #10 |
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So that may have worked for Trunk as well? The two times he was taken over? |
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| + Pyrus | Oct 21 2012, 05:34 PM Post #11 |
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I don't know. Trunks may have had it on his own. He displayed similar characteristics when he forced Baby out of him, and he seemed to display two levels of power when facing Golden Ape Baby. |
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| + Kyouks | Oct 21 2012, 05:40 PM Post #12 |
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Goten and Trunks' auras look similar to Gohan/Vegeta's auras at some points, the Super 17 fight for one, and they all seem to have the SSJ2-ish aura there. |
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| Battle Power | Oct 21 2012, 06:07 PM Post #13 |
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I can elaborate on a few, don't know much about Boo Saga, EoZ and GT though, so nothing to add there.Possibly from 10,666 ~ 11,333 (If you consider Goku having around the same zenkai as Vegeta) to 90,000. High gravity and zenkais, it's the best possible training for a lone saiya-jin. Gohan in this case wasn't gaining that much from what I see, but learning to use his own power. I believe whatever he really 'gained' was a matter of growing up. Piccolo went from 408 to 1220 (relaxed), I have him gaining less than the earthlings because he had to sacrifice at least some (possibly half) of his training time to Gohan. Piccolo is shown to be one of the best trainers on the series, either #2 or #3, so I have him gaining a big deal here, even alone. High gravity training, which is either the #1 or #2 method in terms of effectiveness. It's implied that Goku trained as a Super Saiya-jin (since Piccolo wasn't impressed by SSJ Goku vs #19), so probably Piccolo had the toughest training of his life. It's possible Goku didn't turn SSJ for Gohan, which in this case would justify why Gohan didn't gain as much as Piccolo. As for Goku, unless he sometimes trained in base, wouldn't be more than a workout, or a practice on how to act when you're stomping someone. Piccolo had (possibly) the toughest training of his life between Trunks and Android Saga, I believe this was Gohan's. Gohan took some time to achieve SSJ, but when he did, he was able to catch up to Goku in no time. The benefits of having a good sparring partner for training is already massive as the manga itself showed multiple times, and it's very possible that the gravity (even if low) from the RoSaT boosts that even further (Goku himself stated he couldn't rest effectively inside, so that means they still feel the 'pressure'). That's all I got. |
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Every villain is the hero of their own story. [Power Level List] Dragon Ball - Updated [Power Level List] Saiya-jin Saga [Power Level List] Freeza Saga [Comparative Power List] Cell Saga | |
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Oct 21 2012, 08:27 PM Post #14 |
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Gohan z sword-More than 10x stronger in a day.Maybe because the sword was magic Gohan's strength increased so fast. Piccolo between Frieza/Android Saga-Hundreds of times stronger in three years.Maybe the power he gained when fused with Nail was slowly surfaced during that period. Goku between Buu/EOZ-200x stronger in 10 years.Maybe,at that point,he had reached the age when a Saiyan's body is at its peak and gets the fastest gains.In human terms,he was considered middle aged,but,since Saiyans live longer,maybe the age of their peak is after their 30s. Vegeta between Frieza/Android Sagas-After all that suicidal gravity training,i think he deserved to be a little ahead of Goku. Those are the only logical explanations i can give.About the rest,i don't know. |
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