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SSj Gogeta > SSj3 Gotenks
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Topic Started: Sep 23 2012, 06:53 PM (3,723 Views)
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+ Clearin
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Sep 24 2012, 12:02 PM
Post #46
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- miguelnuva
- Sep 24 2012, 06:40 AM
Because he had the Potara why would Goku use the Dance if Potara was stronger? It wasn't that Gogeta couldn't do it it was Vegito would do it.
Because not being stuck together would be a huge bonus for both of them.
I'd say doing a silly dance is the better option compared to being merged together with your rival forever, especially when both of them have wives.
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Saberoph
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Sep 24 2012, 03:35 PM
Post #47
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I use to think Base Vegetto=MSS Gogeta>>>SS3 Gotenks.
However, given certain conversations and looking at certain Threads...I'm not so sure anymore...
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The Dragon Slayer
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Sep 24 2012, 04:04 PM
Post #48
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Feel like a sir
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Movies are completely illogical. SSJ3 Goku > Hildegarn > Mystic gohan ? What?
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Saberoph
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Sep 24 2012, 04:09 PM
Post #49
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What does this has to do with the MSS Gogeta>SS3 Gotenks debate?
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Paikuan extreme
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Sep 24 2012, 07:20 PM
Post #50
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- Saberoph
- Sep 24 2012, 03:35 PM
I use to think Base Vegetto=MSS Gogeta>>>SS3 Gotenks.
However, given certain conversations and looking at certain Threads...I'm not so sure anymore... nah, in truth gotenks is still right behind ssj gogeta, who in the past had him right behind buutenks still. But ultimate gohan or stronger.
Otherwise i have ssj2 gogeta beating on buuhan.
Its just that gogeta has more power and potential than gotenks. Gotenks at his maximum wouldnt match a fusion made from their dads. Thats clowning fusion.
I think the dance just takes to long. Boo almost killed goten and trunks when they tried to do it the first time.
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+ Pyrus
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Sep 24 2012, 08:11 PM
Post #51
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- miguelnuva
- Sep 24 2012, 06:40 AM
Because he had the Potara why would Goku use the Dance if Potara was stronger? It wasn't that Gogeta couldn't do it it was Vegito would do it.
Plus AT wanted to use the Potara to build Suspense. If Gogeta had begun beating Buu what's to stop Buu from running intill the 30 mins were up or even letting Goku and Vegeta fuse in the first place? Versus using a fusion that is permanent and the only way for Buu to win as absorption.
That's great and all, except they had plenty of time to do the Fusion Dance as Gohan-Boo was still a ways away from them when they were arguing about the Potaras. Boo didn't care, hence why he said "even if they merge, they still couldn't beat me."
And Boo running until the 30 minutes is up? Come on. That's a weak cop-out. You're forgetting that Goku has Shunkan Ido. He'd track Boo anywhere.
- Paikuan extreme
- Sep 24 2012, 06:55 AM
- Kamikaze Pyro
- Sep 24 2012, 03:32 AM
- Paikuan extreme
- Sep 24 2012, 03:23 AM
ok then, why harp on something he said to vegeta to get him to do what was necessary? piccolo was right vegeta wasnt going for it, and wanted to fight separately. Not in fusion. Goku suggested Fusion inside Super Boo, meaning he still considered it an option against Super Boo, no matter how unlikely it was. He didn't even consider it against Gohan-Boo.
now we're just guessing. is weskur going to agree with everything you say? vegeta didnt want to fuse, and as a matter of fact BROKE the earring to keep it from being used again. goku then blames vegeta FOR breaking the potarra so they could fuse again while popping out of boo. Still doesnt cover vegeta not wanting to fuse, and the potarra being the true option. It was pretty obvious, that once the potarras were introduced then it would be moot to even discuss what would be the better option. They were never compared or brought up again as it didnt matter. doing the fusion dance would have gotten them killed. ala gotenks in the rosat. They had to intrigue boo and make him stop so they could do the dance. it takes too long. Boo doesnt have that kind of patience and never fell for the same trick twice.
He brought up merging twice inside Boo, with no specification as to which method, implying it didn't matter which method they used against regular Super Boo. He specified Potara against Gohan-Boo. Again, why the difference of consideration if they could've both beaten Boo?
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Paikuan extreme
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Sep 24 2012, 08:14 PM
Post #52
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In the manga goku outright said fusion WOULD have worked. He blamed vegeta for taking that option away. Then they were being set upon by super boo doubles.
Then super boo himself.
Im sufficing IMHO to say that even if they had tried to do the dance, boo would have stopped them. He knows what it is and what it can do.
But it didnt matter to toriyama, who proved his point by having goku and vegeta devise another plan. Depowering boo.
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+ miguelnuva
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Sep 24 2012, 08:18 PM
Post #53
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- Kamikaze Pyro
- Sep 24 2012, 08:11 PM
- miguelnuva
- Sep 24 2012, 06:40 AM
Because he had the Potara why would Goku use the Dance if Potara was stronger? It wasn't that Gogeta couldn't do it it was Vegito would do it.
Plus AT wanted to use the Potara to build Suspense. If Gogeta had begun beating Buu what's to stop Buu from running intill the 30 mins were up or even letting Goku and Vegeta fuse in the first place? Versus using a fusion that is permanent and the only way for Buu to win as absorption.
That's great and all, except they had plenty of time to do the Fusion Dance as Gohan-Boo was still a ways away from them when they were arguing about the Potaras. Boo didn't care, hence why he said "even if they merge, they still couldn't beat me."
And Boo running until the 30 minutes is up? Come on. That's a weak cop-out. You're forgetting that Goku has Shunkan Ido. He'd track Boo anywhere. If Buu started getting beat by Gogeta and just flew into to Space how would Gogeta get to him, Gogeta can't breath in space.
Arguing with Vegeta, getting the power right and then doing the dance would have taken much longer especially with the way Old Kai sold it.
And Buu is an idiot.
First he says SSJ3 Gotenks can't beat him, then Gohan can't beat him and then he says Vegito couldn't beat him. What happens in all these fights?
AT wanted to use the original Super Saiyan form against Buu even with Gohan absorbed simple as that, thus the potara and Vegito were created.
MSSJ Gogeta> SSJ3 Gotenks is still where I stand.
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Gogeta power placement
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+ Pyrus
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Sep 24 2012, 08:41 PM
Post #54
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- Paikuan extreme
- Sep 24 2012, 08:14 PM
In the manga goku outright said fusion WOULD have worked. He blamed vegeta for taking that option away. Then they were being set upon by super boo doubles.
Then super boo himself.
Goku said that after they removed the kids and Piccolo from Boo, weakening him to a level where Fusion would have worked, yes.
- Quote:
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Im sufficing IMHO to say that even if they had tried to do the dance, boo would have stopped them. He knows what it is and what it can do.
But it didnt matter to toriyama, who proved his point by having goku and vegeta devise another plan. Depowering boo.
Boo didn't seem to care if they merged. He didn't throw any attacks or try to fly faster. He seemed content either way.
- miguelnuva
- Sep 24 2012, 08:18 PM
- Kamikaze Pyro
- Sep 24 2012, 08:11 PM
- miguelnuva
- Sep 24 2012, 06:40 AM
Because he had the Potara why would Goku use the Dance if Potara was stronger? It wasn't that Gogeta couldn't do it it was Vegito would do it.
Plus AT wanted to use the Potara to build Suspense. If Gogeta had begun beating Buu what's to stop Buu from running intill the 30 mins were up or even letting Goku and Vegeta fuse in the first place? Versus using a fusion that is permanent and the only way for Buu to win as absorption.
That's great and all, except they had plenty of time to do the Fusion Dance as Gohan-Boo was still a ways away from them when they were arguing about the Potaras. Boo didn't care, hence why he said "even if they merge, they still couldn't beat me."
And Boo running until the 30 minutes is up? Come on. That's a weak cop-out. You're forgetting that Goku has Shunkan Ido. He'd track Boo anywhere.
If Buu started getting beat by Gogeta and just flew into to Space how would Gogeta get to him, Gogeta can't breath in space.
So why didn't Boo do this against Gohan or Vegetto?
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Arguing with Vegeta, getting the power right and then doing the dance would have taken much longer especially with the way Old Kai sold it.
Vegeta saw the dance from Otherworld, and he's a chi master so equalizing his power wouldn't be a problem. Piccolo and Krillin did it after seeing it once, and you think Vegeta can't? Don't hate on Vegeta, bro. He'll kill you. Besides that, arguing with Vegeta? You mean like he argued with Vegeta over the Potara, and Boo still hadn't caught up to them? Right, right.
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And Buu is an idiot.
First he says SSJ3 Gotenks can't beat him, then Gohan can't beat him and then he says Vegito couldn't beat him. What happens in all these fights?
He beat them all by absorbing them.
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AT wanted to use the original Super Saiyan form against Buu even with Gohan absorbed simple as that, thus the potara and Vegito were created.
MSSJ Gogeta> SSJ3 Gotenks is still where I stand.
Toriyama created Vegetto because Gogeta was already made in Movie 12, and he wanted something better. Getcho facts straight, broseph!
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+ miguelnuva
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Sep 24 2012, 10:50 PM
Post #55
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- Kamikaze Pyro
- Sep 24 2012, 08:41 PM
- Paikuan extreme
- Sep 24 2012, 08:14 PM
In the manga goku outright said fusion WOULD have worked. He blamed vegeta for taking that option away. Then they were being set upon by super boo doubles.
Then super boo himself. Goku said that after they removed the kids and Piccolo from Boo, weakening him to a level where Fusion would have worked, yes.- Quote:
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Im sufficing IMHO to say that even if they had tried to do the dance, boo would have stopped them. He knows what it is and what it can do.
But it didnt matter to toriyama, who proved his point by having goku and vegeta devise another plan. Depowering boo. Boo didn't seem to care if they merged. He didn't throw any attacks or try to fly faster. He seemed content either way.- miguelnuva
- Sep 24 2012, 08:18 PM
- Kamikaze Pyro
- Sep 24 2012, 08:11 PM
- miguelnuva
- Sep 24 2012, 06:40 AM
Because he had the Potara why would Goku use the Dance if Potara was stronger? It wasn't that Gogeta couldn't do it it was Vegito would do it.
Plus AT wanted to use the Potara to build Suspense. If Gogeta had begun beating Buu what's to stop Buu from running intill the 30 mins were up or even letting Goku and Vegeta fuse in the first place? Versus using a fusion that is permanent and the only way for Buu to win as absorption.
That's great and all, except they had plenty of time to do the Fusion Dance as Gohan-Boo was still a ways away from them when they were arguing about the Potaras. Boo didn't care, hence why he said "even if they merge, they still couldn't beat me."
And Boo running until the 30 minutes is up? Come on. That's a weak cop-out. You're forgetting that Goku has Shunkan Ido. He'd track Boo anywhere.
If Buu started getting beat by Gogeta and just flew into to Space how would Gogeta get to him, Gogeta can't breath in space. So why didn't Boo do this against Gohan or Vegetto? - Quote:
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Arguing with Vegeta, getting the power right and then doing the dance would have taken much longer especially with the way Old Kai sold it. Vegeta saw the dance from Otherworld, and he's a chi master so equalizing his power wouldn't be a problem. Piccolo and Krillin did it after seeing it once, and you think Vegeta can't? Don't hate on Vegeta, bro. He'll kill you. Besides that, arguing with Vegeta? You mean like he argued with Vegeta over the Potara, and Boo still hadn't caught up to them? Right, right.- Quote:
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And Buu is an idiot.
First he says SSJ3 Gotenks can't beat him, then Gohan can't beat him and then he says Vegito couldn't beat him. What happens in all these fights? He beat them all by absorbing them. - Quote:
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AT wanted to use the original Super Saiyan form against Buu even with Gohan absorbed simple as that, thus the potara and Vegito were created.
MSSJ Gogeta> SSJ3 Gotenks is still where I stand. Toriyama created Vegetto because Gogeta was already made in Movie 12, and he wanted something better. Getcho facts straight, broseph! AT created Vegito because he wanted a stronger fusion, he felt that Gogeta couldn't beat the new Super Buu with just SSJ 1 but Vegito could thus the Potara were brought in.
Now why didn't Buu fly into to Space against Vegito or Gohan because of the absorption like you said. Buu stated he had enough power once he absorbed Gohan he would have either absorbed Gogeta as well or he would held him off for 30 mins.
As for Vegeta I didn't argue he didn't no the dance or Goku lowering his power, I'm arguing that it would take more time to set up the dance then it was to use the Potara.
Buu was not going to take a chance on Goku and Vegeta beating him with fusion. He was overconfident when he stated the fusion wouldn't work but he isn't an idoit he wouldn't take a chance on them surpassing him as Gogeta using the Potara was the only way to beat Buu.
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Gogeta power placement
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Paikuan extreme
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Sep 24 2012, 11:16 PM
Post #56
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Uh thats interesting, that AT supports your theory, this is the first ive heard of that.
he created vegetto because he could. Its not that he didnt like gogeta, its just not how he would have done it, and proved that, fusion was HIS idea. Toei just took it one step further and tried to put a face to it, like the super saiyan form in movie 4.
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Saberoph
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Sep 24 2012, 11:29 PM
Post #57
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Yeah, so you really can't blame Toei for being creative and doing something that was only mentioned, but was never shown in the Manga.
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+ Kyouks
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Sep 25 2012, 12:28 AM
Post #58
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- miguelnuva
- Sep 24 2012, 08:18 PM
And Buu is an idiot.
First he says SSJ3 Gotenks can't beat him, then Gohan can't beat him and then he says Vegito couldn't beat him. What happens in all these fights?
1 - He didn't know what the crap fusion was at that time, not to mention that he had the brain the size of a pea back then.
2 - He felt Gohan's chi and he had a back-up plan in case Gohan beat him. This is using his pea-sized brain, mind you.
3 - Because as far as he was considered, Potara was no different from the dance.
No need to address the rest, as those have been argued to no end already......(either that or they're just ridiculous....flying up to space, really? )
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+ miguelnuva
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Sep 25 2012, 01:05 AM
Post #59
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- Paikuan extreme
- Sep 24 2012, 11:16 PM
Uh thats interesting, that AT supports your theory, this is the first ive heard of that.
he created vegetto because he could. Its not that he didnt like gogeta, its just not how he would have done it, and proved that, fusion was HIS idea. Toei just took it one step further and tried to put a face to it, like the super saiyan form in movie 4. Do you mean AT is following my logic?
AT said in a interview he wanted something cooler then the dance(Gogeta) and he wanted the new fusion to only use the original super saiyan form against Buu so he created Vegito.
As far as where their ranked AT has only said this about Vegito and Gogeta
MSSJ Vegito is stronger than MSSJ Gogeta.
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Gogeta power placement
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+ Pyrus
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Sep 25 2012, 02:03 AM
Post #60
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- miguelnuva
- Sep 24 2012, 10:50 PM
- Kamikaze Pyro
- Sep 24 2012, 08:41 PM
- Paikuan extreme
- Sep 24 2012, 08:14 PM
In the manga goku outright said fusion WOULD have worked. He blamed vegeta for taking that option away. Then they were being set upon by super boo doubles.
Then super boo himself. Goku said that after they removed the kids and Piccolo from Boo, weakening him to a level where Fusion would have worked, yes.- Quote:
-
Im sufficing IMHO to say that even if they had tried to do the dance, boo would have stopped them. He knows what it is and what it can do.
But it didnt matter to toriyama, who proved his point by having goku and vegeta devise another plan. Depowering boo. Boo didn't seem to care if they merged. He didn't throw any attacks or try to fly faster. He seemed content either way.- miguelnuva
- Sep 24 2012, 08:18 PM
- Kamikaze Pyro
- Sep 24 2012, 08:11 PM
- miguelnuva
- Sep 24 2012, 06:40 AM
Because he had the Potara why would Goku use the Dance if Potara was stronger? It wasn't that Gogeta couldn't do it it was Vegito would do it.
Plus AT wanted to use the Potara to build Suspense. If Gogeta had begun beating Buu what's to stop Buu from running intill the 30 mins were up or even letting Goku and Vegeta fuse in the first place? Versus using a fusion that is permanent and the only way for Buu to win as absorption.
That's great and all, except they had plenty of time to do the Fusion Dance as Gohan-Boo was still a ways away from them when they were arguing about the Potaras. Boo didn't care, hence why he said "even if they merge, they still couldn't beat me."
And Boo running until the 30 minutes is up? Come on. That's a weak cop-out. You're forgetting that Goku has Shunkan Ido. He'd track Boo anywhere.
If Buu started getting beat by Gogeta and just flew into to Space how would Gogeta get to him, Gogeta can't breath in space. So why didn't Boo do this against Gohan or Vegetto? - Quote:
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Arguing with Vegeta, getting the power right and then doing the dance would have taken much longer especially with the way Old Kai sold it. Vegeta saw the dance from Otherworld, and he's a chi master so equalizing his power wouldn't be a problem. Piccolo and Krillin did it after seeing it once, and you think Vegeta can't? Don't hate on Vegeta, bro. He'll kill you. Besides that, arguing with Vegeta? You mean like he argued with Vegeta over the Potara, and Boo still hadn't caught up to them? Right, right.- Quote:
-
And Buu is an idiot.
First he says SSJ3 Gotenks can't beat him, then Gohan can't beat him and then he says Vegito couldn't beat him. What happens in all these fights? He beat them all by absorbing them. - Quote:
-
AT wanted to use the original Super Saiyan form against Buu even with Gohan absorbed simple as that, thus the potara and Vegito were created.
MSSJ Gogeta> SSJ3 Gotenks is still where I stand. Toriyama created Vegetto because Gogeta was already made in Movie 12, and he wanted something better. Getcho facts straight, broseph!
AT created Vegito because he wanted a stronger fusion, he felt that Gogeta couldn't beat the new Super Buu with just SSJ 1 but Vegito could thus the Potara were brought in. Now why didn't Buu fly into to Space against Vegito or Gohan because of the absorption like you said. Buu stated he had enough power once he absorbed Gohan he would have either absorbed Gogeta as well or he would held him off for 30 mins.
So he wouldn't fly into space regardless. I don't know why you're claiming he would. Nobody has ever thought of doing this except for Freeza, and he took it to a planetary level.
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As for Vegeta I didn't argue he didn't no the dance or Goku lowering his power, I'm arguing that it would take more time to set up the dance then it was to use the Potara.
Buu was not going to take a chance on Goku and Vegeta beating him with fusion. He was overconfident when he stated the fusion wouldn't work but he isn't an idoit he wouldn't take a chance on them surpassing him as Gogeta using the Potara was the only way to beat Buu.
Goku and Vegeta literally stood there arguing for panels before Boo actually showed up. You're trying to tell me they couldn't do the dance, which both of them knew and could full well accomplish, in the same amount of time they had to bicker with each other? I somehow don't buy that.
- Paikuan extreme
- Sep 24 2012, 11:16 PM
Uh thats interesting, that AT supports your theory, this is the first ive heard of that.
he created vegetto because he could. Its not that he didnt like gogeta, its just not how he would have done it, and proved that, fusion was HIS idea. Toei just took it one step further and tried to put a face to it, like the super saiyan form in movie 4.
Are you agreeing with me...? I can't tell.
- miguelnuva
- Sep 25 2012, 01:05 AM
- Paikuan extreme
- Sep 24 2012, 11:16 PM
Uh thats interesting, that AT supports your theory, this is the first ive heard of that.
he created vegetto because he could. Its not that he didnt like gogeta, its just not how he would have done it, and proved that, fusion was HIS idea. Toei just took it one step further and tried to put a face to it, like the super saiyan form in movie 4.
Do you mean AT is following my logic? AT said in a interview he wanted something cooler then the dance(Gogeta) and he wanted the new fusion to only use the original super saiyan form against Buu so he created Vegito. As far as where their ranked AT has only said this about Vegito and Gogeta MSSJ Vegito is stronger than MSSJ Gogeta.
The bolded. Show me where he said this. The rest is right, I've seen that much. The bold is completely new and not something I've ever heard of before...seems like you adding it in to satisfy your belief on Gogeta, man!
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