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Ultimate Trunkten vs. SSj Vegito
Topic Started: Sep 14 2012, 12:13 AM (3,899 Views)
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Slayerslice
Oct 13 2012, 03:00 PM
Victorious Unstoppable
Oct 13 2012, 05:41 AM
Slayerslice
Oct 12 2012, 11:07 PM
Base Vegito was whooping Gohan-Buu though, so there might be truth in that A x B thing.
Sigh....That is what we call filler. Base Vegetto never fights in the manga.
I don't care if it's filler, he was whooping GohanBuu, he even stopped Buu's energya attack with ease.

I am talking anime here.

Boo was holding back. After all that supposed whooping, he still had the confidence to say Vegetto hadn't surpassed him, to which Vegetto said something like, "Oh? Then how's this?" and transformed.
Slayerslice
Oct 13 2012, 04:41 PM
Victorious Unstoppable
Oct 13 2012, 04:39 PM
Slayerslice
Oct 13 2012, 03:00 PM
Victorious Unstoppable
Oct 13 2012, 05:41 AM
Slayerslice
Oct 12 2012, 11:07 PM
Base Vegito was whooping Gohan-Buu though, so there might be truth in that A x B thing.
Sigh....That is what we call filler. Base Vegetto never fights in the manga.
I don't care if it's filler, he was whooping GohanBuu, he even stopped Buu's energya attack with ease.

I am talking anime here.
Anime SSjin 3 Goku > Gohan-Buu?
EoZ SSJ3 Goku? Most definately.

Goku wouldn't even pass Gohan at the end of Z, let alone Gohan-Boo. The halfbreed's potential way brought far beyond its limits, and its natural limit was far beyond Goku's to begin with. I just don't find any basis in people claiming Goku surpassed Gohan at the end of Z when nothing supports it, other than the cop-out of Goku being the main character.
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Sjk8
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史上最強の孫悟空

Victorious Unstoppable
Oct 12 2012, 10:38 PM
Base Goku x Base Vegeta would already be >>> Gohan-Buu IMO. SSjin is overkill. There is no way the fusion formula is A x B. Anyway, Halfbreeds have more potential than Full Blooded saiyans. So Ultimate Trunkten would be > Vegetto, BUT there is that rival's boost. I think it is pretty large...


But Vegetto IS overkill, in any form.
Vegetto transformed in order to be safe, because, when he was made, he didn't know his own power at all, and, furthermore, Buuhan was rushing to him at full speed. So, why would he have to risk? He realized later how really uber-strong he was.
Goku already knew Potara > dance, because he was said a potara Gokhan would have beaten Buutenks (who is close to Buuhan) in base, but a fusion of him and Vegeta was expected to be inferior in power (Because Ultimate Gohan >>>..> Vegeta), indeed Vegetto himself told Buuhan he didn't think to be (so) stronger than him.
Vegetto never really fought: the only thing he had done, it had been to stop every attack of Buhhan with his feet while telling him how weak he was... The only time he has been a little more serious, he showed he could have disintegrated Buuhan with a generic energy attack from his hand.
Even more, from Herms, Vegetto is said to be "definitely strongest" by Old Kai.
Him being A X B suits perfectly with the manga.
So, if Trunkten is not Goten X Trunks, then, ultimate or not, he would die horribly under base Vegetto's shoes.

crashbreaka
Oct 12 2012, 11:14 PM
Well that's just a difference of opinion then, I don't use SEG :p


Well, you can choose to ignore it, but it doesn't mean it is not official, and thus true, at least until proven otherwise. ;)
Edited by Sjk8, Oct 13 2012, 08:40 PM.
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Slayerslice
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Goku fought Oob who was a SSJ3 equal, x50 and you have a Super Saiyan's that's x50 the SSJ3 from Buu Saga, is it wrong then to say that SSJ3 Goku surpassed Gohan in the end of Z?
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Hurry My Curry
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Sjk8
Oct 13 2012, 07:07 PM
Victorious Unstoppable
Oct 12 2012, 10:38 PM
Base Goku x Base Vegeta would already be >>> Gohan-Buu IMO. SSjin is overkill. There is no way the fusion formula is A x B. Anyway, Halfbreeds have more potential than Full Blooded saiyans. So Ultimate Trunkten would be > Vegetto, BUT there is that rival's boost. I think it is pretty large...


But Vegetto IS overkill, in any form.
Vegetto transformed in order to be safe, because, when he was made, he didn't know his own power at all, and, furthermore, Buuhan was rushing to him at full speed. So, why would he have to risk? He realized later how really uber-strong he was.
Goku already knew Potara > dance, because he was said a potara Gokhan would have beaten Buutenks (who is close to Buuhan) in base, but a fusion of him and Vegeta was expected to be inferior in power (Because Ultimate Gohan >>>..> Vegeta), indeed Vegetto himself told Buuhan he didn't think to be (so) stronger than him.
Vegetto never really fought: the only thing he had done, it had been to stop every attack of Buhhan with his feet while telling him how weak he was... The only time he has been a little more serious, he showed he could have disintegrated Buuhan with a generic energy attack from his hand.
Even more, from Herms, Vegetto is said to be "definitely strongest" by Old Kai.
Him being A X B suits perfectly with the manga.
So, if Trunkten is not Goten X Trunks, then, ultimate or not, he would die horribly under base Vegetto's shoes.

crashbreaka
Oct 12 2012, 11:14 PM
Well that's just a difference of opinion then, I don't use SEG :p


Well, you can choose to ignore it, but it doesn't mean it is not official, and thus true, at least until proven otherwise. ;)
Vegetto doesn't know his own power.....Seriously? If his SSjin is that much overkill, why not revert back to base? Save energy..The
SEG implies something that the manga never hints at. Why should I take someone's word for it if it's not hinted at all in the manga. I've said it before, I'll say it again. Use the guidebook to support an argument, not create it.
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Sjk8
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史上最強の孫悟空

Victorious Unstoppable
Oct 13 2012, 09:57 PM
Sjk8
Oct 13 2012, 07:07 PM
Victorious Unstoppable
Oct 12 2012, 10:38 PM
Base Goku x Base Vegeta would already be >>> Gohan-Buu IMO. SSjin is overkill. There is no way the fusion formula is A x B. Anyway, Halfbreeds have more potential than Full Blooded saiyans. So Ultimate Trunkten would be > Vegetto, BUT there is that rival's boost. I think it is pretty large...


But Vegetto IS overkill, in any form.
Vegetto transformed in order to be safe, because, when he was made, he didn't know his own power at all, and, furthermore, Buuhan was rushing to him at full speed. So, why would he have to risk? He realized later how really uber-strong he was.
Goku already knew Potara > dance, because he was said a potara Gokhan would have beaten Buutenks (who is close to Buuhan) in base, but a fusion of him and Vegeta was expected to be inferior in power (Because Ultimate Gohan >>>..> Vegeta), indeed Vegetto himself told Buuhan he didn't think to be (so) stronger than him.
Vegetto never really fought: the only thing he had done, it had been to stop every attack of Buhhan with his feet while telling him how weak he was... The only time he has been a little more serious, he showed he could have disintegrated Buuhan with a generic energy attack from his hand.
Even more, from Herms, Vegetto is said to be "definitely strongest" by Old Kai.
Him being A X B suits perfectly with the manga.
So, if Trunkten is not Goten X Trunks, then, ultimate or not, he would die horribly under base Vegetto's shoes.

crashbreaka
Oct 12 2012, 11:14 PM
Well that's just a difference of opinion then, I don't use SEG :p


Well, you can choose to ignore it, but it doesn't mean it is not official, and thus true, at least until proven otherwise. ;)
Vegetto doesn't know his own power.....Seriously? If his SSjin is that much overkill, why not revert back to base? Save energy..The
SEG implies something that the manga never hints at. Why should I take someone's word for it if it's not hinted at all in the manga. I've said it before, I'll say it again. Use the guidebook to support an argument, not create it.
Yeah, seriously.
Tell me, why was he so surprised to be that strong, if he knew all about his power?
Not to mention that, when he transformed, less than few seconds from his birth were passed: surely Vegetto must be a prophet for knowing how exactly strong he is, 5 seconds after his birth, and after being generated by a method (Potara) he (Goku) barely knows the way it works.
I'm not creating anything, contrariwise, I've explained you why multiplication has no problems with manga.
And, even more, why should have Vegetto reverted in his base form? It would have been a completely useless move. There are at least three reasons for not reverting:
1) His goal was to force Buuhan to absorb him in order to free his friends, and once discovered that Buuhan was less than nothing to him, he had no interest at all in such a boring fighting.
2) He is a Ssj FP, so his energy drain is close to 0 and he can "set-up" his power from 0 to maximum whenever he wants.
3) Toriyama's job is way faster with "white hairs" Ssjs forms.

I suppose you won't still change your mind, but there aren't problems at all, not in the manga, not in the guides, with Vegetto being so strong.
A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has even a chance to get its pants on
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Hurry My Curry
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All it takes is a couple seconds to sense ki. I would assume it would take even less to sense your own ki lol.
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* Crashbreaka
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Sjk8
Oct 13 2012, 07:07 PM
crashbreaka
Oct 12 2012, 11:14 PM
Well that's just a difference of opinion then, I don't use SEG :p


Well, you can choose to ignore it, but it doesn't mean it is not official, and thus true, at least until proven otherwise. ;)
If it was true, Kibito Kai could have easily one-shotted Buu. Vegetto wouldn't have needed to go SSJ against buu at all. It would have been like BODB Goku against Final Form Freeza.
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crashbreaka
Oct 14 2012, 12:22 AM
Sjk8
Oct 13 2012, 07:07 PM
crashbreaka
Oct 12 2012, 11:14 PM
Well that's just a difference of opinion then, I don't use SEG :p


Well, you can choose to ignore it, but it doesn't mean it is not official, and thus true, at least until proven otherwise. ;)
If it was true, Kibito Kai could have easily one-shotted Buu. Vegetto wouldn't have needed to go SSJ against buu at all. It would have been like BODB Goku against Final Form Freeza.
He claims that the AxB multiplier only works for Vegito, he never said anything about Kibito Kai, I think. Also, I kinda agree with him that we should treat anything official true unless it's contradicted by the manga.
Edited by Super Gogito, Oct 14 2012, 12:31 AM.
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* Crashbreaka
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Maybe I should go have a look at SEG again then lol.
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crashbreaka
Oct 14 2012, 12:31 AM
Maybe I should go have a look at SEG again then lol.
Well I'm not saying that everything released from the guidebooks is "true" because it does contradict the manga sometimes, and it's just outright skeptical. Take the V Jump for example, it stated that SSJ Goku's power level is 150,000,000 at the Buu saga, and it stated that 5th from Cooler's power level is 470,000,000. Fans already don't believe in those statement. To be honest, I'm just as skeptical about the AxB multiplier just as much as you are because if it was REALLY true, then there'd no reason for Vegito to transform. Unless.... Buuhan is stronger than we thought! :o_O:
Edited by Super Gogito, Oct 14 2012, 12:47 AM.
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* Crashbreaka
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Yeah I only really go by the Daiz as far as statements go (slightly modified, of course)

I guess I'm just adverse to using guidebooks as far as what I can see in the manga.
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Double post (my bad)
Edited by Crashbreaka, Oct 14 2012, 12:49 AM.
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Buuhan > Base Vegetto is implied; Base Vegetto is probably only equal to Buuhan at best. So, unless you think Buuhan > Base Goku * Base Vegeta, it doesn't work.
Edited by Kyouks, Oct 14 2012, 12:51 AM.
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V jump is a horrible guidebook. I used to believe that everything it states was true. But I personally think that we should trust the AxB multiplier, for now. After all it doesn't contradict anything. Right?
Edited by Super Gogito, Oct 14 2012, 12:54 AM.
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Kamikaze Pyro
Oct 13 2012, 06:15 PM
Slayerslice
Oct 13 2012, 04:41 PM
Victorious Unstoppable
Oct 13 2012, 04:39 PM
Slayerslice
Oct 13 2012, 03:00 PM
Victorious Unstoppable
Oct 13 2012, 05:41 AM
Slayerslice
Oct 12 2012, 11:07 PM
Base Vegito was whooping Gohan-Buu though, so there might be truth in that A x B thing.
Sigh....That is what we call filler. Base Vegetto never fights in the manga.
I don't care if it's filler, he was whooping GohanBuu, he even stopped Buu's energya attack with ease.

I am talking anime here.
Anime SSjin 3 Goku > Gohan-Buu?
EoZ SSJ3 Goku? Most definately.

Goku wouldn't even pass Gohan at the end of Z, let alone Gohan-Boo. The halfbreed's potential way brought far beyond its limits, and its natural limit was far beyond Goku's to begin with. I just don't find any basis in people claiming Goku surpassed Gohan at the end of Z when nothing supports it, other than the cop-out of Goku being the main character.
You said it best my friend, I really don't see where people get EOZ Goku>Ultimae Gohan, even if Goku is on Good Boo's level, with the MSS Multiplier decreasing like it does (Which is heavily implied in GT, which for GT to make sense, from End of Boo arc on the MSS Multiplier would have to decrease at a somewhat steady rate, and if you follow X50 in the Boo arc, it would have to decrease very fast), having Goku's Base so high at EOZ works with a low MSS Multiplier, then SS3 Goku would still fit very comfortably under Ultimate Gohan.
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