Pretty good episode but...that was way too easy, those guys were pathetic.

The main group had the drop on them sure but I thought these guys were going to be at least somewhat of a threat due to either experience, skill or both.

Obviously that doesn't seem to be all of them since we didn't see Neagan himself but how many more are there I wonder? That was a pretty big place and they cleared out a lot of guys. Guess they could have somewhere Jesus' group doesn't know about with even more and Neagan himself.

Random Carol romance shoved in, guess she or the guy are going to be killed then. As much as I love Carol honestly it's about time somebody died, doubt Maggie will go.
Is this how it went in the comics?


Lastly...a woman on the radio? Wut.
Would have though these goons would have all been your stereotypical bastard rapists that would only have women as slaves if anything. Suppose she might be some tough psycho that beat down one of them who made advances towards her. Or maybe she's Neagan's woman.

Wonder what they're going to do now, obviously heavily weakened here doubt they'll want to trade for that one guy.

The only spoiler I know from the comics is that one characters death, but I have no idea what events lead up to it or when it happens so I was in constant suspense all episode.

But now I'm starting to realise it likely won't happen until the season finale. Most main character deaths happens in either the season premier, season finale or mid-season premier/finale. And Negan's introduction seems to fit well for the last episode of the season, to keep people watching next season. If he doesn't appear in the last episode, I imagine he'll appear near the end of the episode just before it, so we can end on something huge, and then the finale can be just an episode of s*** going down - kinda like how the zombies were seen approaching the farm in the episode before the season 2 finale. Having him show up next week, in the middle of the 2nd half of the season just feels too random for the Walking Dead, but it's not impossible since we've had T-Dog and Lori's death in the middle of the first half of season 3.

Yeah same here I was just waiting for it, it definitely seemed like it might have happened a few times but it didn't...
I feel like they might be doing something a bit different.



Wait is it Negan? I have no idea lol I always thought it sounded like Nay-gan not Nee-gan.
Nay-gan sounds better to me.

But anyway yeah I like how it's not overly predictable, a few things from the comics have been spoiled for me but I'm really not sure if they're going to happen at all. It's awesome.

It didn't feel like any of it mattered to anything other than Carol and Maggie changing somewhat. There were no real consequences to anything and it only felt like there would be at the end when Carol and what's her face had that stupid scuffle.
Would have been so annoying if Carols character was wasted there.

Although what was with the blood dripping at the end? Don't tell me she got bit, I hope she was just for whatever reason gripping the cross real hard...


Anyway what was the point in this episode? I don't quite understand Carol's conflict is it just that she feels like the group are becoming bad people or that she is or both?

'cause as a plot point I think that's dumb, they're trying to build bridges with Hilltop and gradually restore some sort of civilization, why would anyone ever think that not killing would work in that world? We saw how being too soft went with Tyresse. They have to do bad s*** to make some progress I don't see how that isn't obvious.

Rick is obviously quite far gone but at the end of the day he's still trying to protect his family. He's the only one remotely bad among them.

It was boring and very predictable too, the ending was obviously going to happen two different ways, and both was way too easy to predict. Either they meet and get ambushed, then kill their captive, or they show up at their other complex and kill their way through to Carol and Maggie.

Am I just misremembering something, or wasn't Carol the one who wanted to kill the Wolf guy without hesitation, while Morgan tried to stop her? Why does she have this moral objection to killing again all of a sudden?

She had so much trouble killing that Saviour because she could relate to her. All of the other times that she's killed, she didn't know any of their stories; they were just people trying to kill her friends. With this woman, she knew her story, and the fact that she also lost her kids but fought on and became a new person resonates with Carol because that's exactly what she did.

Yeah, I saw it as them finally realizing, "s***, we're actually killing people." Prior to these past couple of episodes characters like Maggie and Carol were just doing whatever they had to do to save their own lives. Now they've actually stopped to think about what they're doing. The overarching theme of "are we really the good guys?" has been giving me chills lately. The writing isn't always on point with this show, but they're definitely nailing it with this theme. Rick is slowly starting to seem more and more like the bad guy, and I love that. It makes everything feel so much more realistic.

I thought the family's death was poorly done. It just didn't look right to me, I honestly felt like it was some sort of 'dream' sequence until it just kept carrying on and I thought "oh, ok, this is what happens".

There've been some really cool moments though. That 'last stand' against the zombie horde was awesome, a really great moment that cemented the community's 'togetherness'. I also really like Jesus too.

One criticism I do have is that they're making the main group way to invincible. I mean, they took on an entire horde of zombies in hand to hand combat without a scratch, then they took on Negan's stronghold without a scratch. It's getting ridiculous, there's no real tension any more because people aren't really in any real danger.

I couldn't take the woman ringleader seriously, she talked way, way too much "Oh, I'll kill you, I want to kill you, I'll do it right now, I'm hard as f***ing nails, do you know how f***ing dangerous I am?". Maybe that was supposed to be her character, trying to convince everybody and herself that she's 'the tough one', but it just didn't work for me.

Carol's character development does make sense, although it felt like it could have been dragged out over a longer span of time. They are becoming almost like the bad guys (which is why I thought that girl's 'you're not the good guys' line was very interesting), at least in some of their actions, so it makes sense that some characters would be having trouble with that.

While I agree with the first one, the second on is a bit justified. For one thing it wasn't the real Negan's base, which I'm sure contains his best fighters. And secondly Rick's group attacked in the middle of the night, all of Negan's men were abruptly woken up and forced into a gun fight against people they didn't know and without knowing how many there were, they were at a serious disadvantage.

True but in narrow corridors it'd be pretty damn hard to miss people just blindly firing.
Like the only loss they suffered in the whole thing is...Abraham got cut a bit.
Someone should have got shot at least, maybe not killed but injured.


I'm not really feeling the "are we the good guys" thing here, how are they not?
What were they meant to do with Negan? Go talk and risk someone getting captured or worse?
Why would they ever come to a reasonable conclusion?

So long as they're not enjoying it, they're the good guys here. Being pacifists would just get them all killed, it's a silly risk nobody in their right mind would take.
Rick is definitely teetering over the edge but he has a baby, a son and all these people as his responsibility so that's fair enough really.

I just don't buy the idea of them being bad, killing ain't nice for sure but the alternative is...die.

Yeah, like Steve said, I know it wasn't Negan's main force, but it was all narrow corridors and little lighting. I guess you could say that they're being consistent in that the group have been through a whole lot, so it's only natural they'd be as formidable a force as they are, but that still doesn't explain how the Alexandria people were portrayed that way too, during the zombie attack (although I am aware you agreed with me on that point).

Maybe calling them the bad guys was the wrong term. I guess it's more about the world they're living in is really blurring the lines between good and bad, basically just into surviving and not surviving, and it makes sense that some people would be having a tougher time adjusting to that way of living. Sure, the reality is as black and white as you're painting it out to be, but the thought process behind it isn't.