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MSSJ/FPSSJ3 Theory
Topic Started: Jun 2 2012, 06:39 AM (1,597 Views)
Billa
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Thala na Gethu!

I'll try to provide definitions before statin my doubts. Pls bear with it.

FPSSJ/MSSJ is the perfection of the SSJ state. It controls the rage/anger which is the access to SSJ. Thus, it results in strategical fightin style, energy being the precursor of power is regulated, stamina, speed as well as power conservation or balance. Practically, its a learned state of SSJ form, which was discovered durin Cell Saga.

SSJ2 is SSJ state raised a notch higher. Triggered by intense emotional upheaval as well as sufficient amount of power (gained via training), it leads to the Saiyan losing their mental or emotional stability, the Saiyan race's barbaric, remorseless nature is magnified.

Keepin this 2 in mind, SSJ2 Kid Gohan was the 1st to acheive SSJ2.

Next was Goku & Vegeta. They seem to have pretty much perfected or mastered the SSJ2 form, given their relaxed facial expressions in both manga & anime.

Now, SSJ3 is a different form. I mean, despite granting its user insane amount of power boost, stamina, endurance, its serious setback was its toll on its user's body. Fact.

The raw power, constantly pushed beyond its predecessors results in the form to show its negatives. Similar to USSJ.

Now, my doubt is, can SSJ3 in fact be mastered?

I know its a different case or topic, but its like askin can USSJ me mastered or perfected.

Back to the topic, while SSJ or SSJ2 has virtually no setbacks in the battlefield as stamina or strain to maintain the stress as SSJ3, its plausible that those forms have space/room for perfection.

SSJ3 on the other hand, is critically serious as evidenced durin the fight with Kid Boo.

So, my opinion is, FPSSJ3 is practically imposible.

Opinions?
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Ryuuzaki
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Goku can use FPSSJ3 just in Other World , my opinion. And FPSSJ3 means 4xSSJ2. Against Fat Buu i guess Goku use 3xSSJ2 , my opinion. I don't see a FPSSJ3 to be strong than the normal multiply , and the multiply is really powwefull.
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no name
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USSJ was not used,because it could not be perfected.
Vegeta was jealous of Goku going SSJ3,which means it was not useless like USSJ.
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Super Vegetto
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Is it stated in daizenshuu that FPSSJ is control of rage ? Also what SSJ2 form has to do with mental/emotionl stability ?

Btw nothing is imposible in dbz. SSJ3 can be mastered.
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InterWebZ
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I'd say that SSJ3 can be mastered just like the previous levels of SSJ, going by Z logic anyway. Both the others can be mastered, so there seems no reason why SSJ3 couldn't be. It would, however, take a while to do, so it would be easy enough to explain the situation in Z by saying that Goku simply hasn't mastered it yet, as opposed to not being able to.

GT seems to ignore that and Goku never masters SSJ3 despite having plenty of time (then again, Vegeta also had plenty of time to achieve SSJ3 and never did that either- another mistake GT made).

I'd say that SSJ and SSJ2 both have their limitations as well; they both use up more energy and will eventually drain the user out. Goku mentioned that it would be difficult to maintain SSJ for a day or more, and we don't know for sure how long unmastered SSJ2 can be sustained, as Gohan only stayed in that state for less than an hour. So I'd say that the further you go, the greater the strain and the harder it is to master, but it's not impossible.
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Billa
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Thala na Gethu!

no name
Jun 2 2012, 12:23 PM
USSJ was not used,because it could not be perfected.
Vegeta was jealous of Goku going SSJ3,which means it was not useless like USSJ.
Vegeta's case was different. He always has some rivalry in terms of power & discoverin his arch rival to have surpassed him even beyond SSJ2 was the reason for his jealousy. That don't really factor IMO.
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Billa
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Thala na Gethu!

Super Vegetto
Jun 2 2012, 12:56 PM
Is it stated in daizenshuu that FPSSJ is control of rage ? Also what SSJ2 form has to do with mental/emotionl stability ?

Btw nothing is imposible in dbz. SSJ3 can be mastered.
Pal, I absolutely love to answer your questions with passion. So here we go!

It isn't stated in Daiz. It isn't stated in Kanzentai either.

My interpretation of a mastered form of SSJ is simply a mastery over every aspect of the form. I mean, as we all know, a Saiyan's anger or rage which consumes oneself is the triggerin factor of the transformation. Subsequently, we've seen how ASSJ & USSJ forms that magnifies its user's Saiyan nature, say in this case: ASSJ Vegeta vs Perfect Cell & USSJ Trunks vs Perfect Cell.

If you notice, most of their actions are repulsive. Prone to anger, they tend to make themselves prey for their opponents.

Most of the time, Goku & Gohan were relaxed as FPSSJ. That alone stands as the testimony.

Next SSJ2. Take Gohan as example here. His ascension into SSJ2 was triggered by the intense emotional upheaval, 16's death which altered his characteristics. He was a completly different person as SSJ2. Remember how he wanna Cell to suffer instead of one-shottin him? Remember how he remorselessly slaughtered each & every single Cell Jr's without hesitation?

I guess all these answers your question.
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Nimbo-Bimbo lord of all noobs
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Chou Supa Saiyajin Suri
Jun 2 2012, 01:30 PM
Super Vegetto
Jun 2 2012, 12:56 PM
Is it stated in daizenshuu that FPSSJ is control of rage ? Also what SSJ2 form has to do with mental/emotionl stability ?

Btw nothing is imposible in dbz. SSJ3 can be mastered.
Pal, I absolutely love to answer your questions with passion. So here we go!

It isn't stated in Daiz. It isn't stated in Kanzentai either.

My interpretation of a mastered form of SSJ is simply a mastery over every aspect of the form. I mean, as we all know, a Saiyan's anger or rage which consumes oneself is the triggerin factor of the transformation. Subsequently, we've seen how ASSJ & USSJ forms that magnifies its user's Saiyan nature, say in this case: ASSJ Vegeta vs Perfect Cell & USSJ Trunks vs Perfect Cell.

If you notice, most of their actions are repulsive. Prone to anger, they tend to make themselves prey for their opponents.

Most of the time, Goku & Gohan were relaxed as FPSSJ. That alone stands as the testimony.

Next SSJ2. Take Gohan as example here. His ascension into SSJ2 was triggered by the intense emotional upheaval, 16's death which altered his characteristics. He was a completly different person as SSJ2. Remember how he wanna Cell to suffer instead of one-shottin him? Remember how he remorselessly slaughtered each & every single Cell Jr's without hesitation?

I guess all these answers your question.
I remember some source, I think it was either Goku actually saying it himself, or one of the Daizenshuus, that SSjin 3 isn't attained through emotional upheaval, but through actually training as hard as you can to reach it.

So, mastering the emotions wouldn't be something you'd need to do for SSjin 3. You would have to master the stamina drain.
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Super Vegetto
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Man it doesnt work like that. Vegeta and Trunks had faild procces in achiving more power. Nothing says that anger/rage is what makes them ASSJ,USSJ.

You still didnt realized Gohan was angry because Cell tortured his friends. It has nothing to do with SSJ2 form.
Same like Goku angry SSJ on Namek. Frieza killd his friend so ofc that he will act angry. Goten and Trunks are just examples for achiving SSJ forms without beeing pushed.

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Billa
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Thala na Gethu!

Well, Goku was stoic as he first transformed to SSJ3 in his attempt of intimidatin Fat Boo & Babidi.

Gotenks was relaxed/cool as well.

The thing is its stamina drain which taxed on its users body. Its somethin which triggers sponetaneously due to the great boost of raw power the form grants its user.

Thats what I meant pal. I guess you skipped my post? ;)
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Super Vegetto
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You ignore the most important thing. There is easy and hard way for achiving something.

Also wrong and right way for achiving something.
Edited by Super Vegetto, Jun 2 2012, 02:03 PM.
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FamousBueller
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Super Asian

I thought gotenks mastered ssj3
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Billa
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Thala na Gethu!

FamousBueller
Jun 2 2012, 02:05 PM
I thought gotenks mastered ssj3
I dont think so.

Maybe they never experienced the stamina drain or strain but thats probably due to their limited Fusion time-span, 30 minutes...
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Chou Supa Saiyajin Suri
Jun 2 2012, 02:31 PM
FamousBueller
Jun 2 2012, 02:05 PM
I thought gotenks mastered ssj3
I dont think so.

Maybe they never experienced the stamina drain or strain but thats probably due to their limited Fusion time-span, 30 minutes...
Not feeling stamina drain is mastering SSJ3

But they did experience it, since it shortened fusion time.

True mastery of SSJ3 would mean Gotenks fusion time would not be shortened as much from going SSJ3
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Billa
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Thala na Gethu!

Son Gohan
Jun 2 2012, 02:36 PM
Chou Supa Saiyajin Suri
Jun 2 2012, 02:31 PM
FamousBueller
Jun 2 2012, 02:05 PM
I thought gotenks mastered ssj3
I dont think so.

Maybe they never experienced the stamina drain or strain but thats probably due to their limited Fusion time-span, 30 minutes...
Not feeling stamina drain is mastering SSJ3

But they did experience it, since it shortened fusion time.

True mastery of SSJ3 would mean Gotenks fusion time would not be shortened as much from going SSJ3
Thats debateable.

I mean, its no one's secret that the Gotenks fight with Super Boo as Toriyama's favourite fight.

I doubt it'll have so much thought was put into the fight, once gags came into the play.

My opinions...

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