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Why Gohan was a SSJ vs Dabura
Topic Started: May 25 2012, 01:28 PM (35,106 Views)
pakl123456
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Super Vegetto
May 30 2012, 06:36 PM
pakl123456
May 30 2012, 06:31 PM
Super Vegetto
May 30 2012, 06:23 PM
Goku talks about strenght he draws from anger not SSJ2. You still dont realize his true power is anger which can be in base also.
Cell had lightening since he was SSJ2 Tier. Also, Gohan's anger makes him go SSJ2, His full power was his SS2. How do you think Gohan beat Cell? He used his anger and hidden powers which are his full power SSJ2 form. Gohan never used his full power SSJ2 vs Dabura. This is why Goku told him to get angry. You are just making yourself look dumb when you show me Cell. That proves you have no proof.
Man he can be in base and went enraged. Why is it Mystic Gohan and not SSJ2 Mystic Gohan ?

SSJ2 is just transformation. He is born with his dorment powers ( his true powers ) and not SSJ2.




Btw this is going no where and someone should close this topic.
His dormant powers are beyond his normal limits while SSJ2 is his full normal limits. Goku basically talked about the SSJ2 form. If he wanted Gohan to get mad so his power would increase, he would't mention the Cell Games since according to you Gohan can get even higher than that. He meant to SSJ2 and said "I am angry" transformed and said "but not like the last time" Why didn't he say he is angry enough while he was at SSJ2?? He was in base and transformed into SSJ since he was not mad enough to go SSJ2.
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Ryuuzaki
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Super Vegetto
May 30 2012, 06:14 PM
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Really now , this page isn't a fake ?
And Gohan was SSJ2 at Dabura. The hair proves that.
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GridZero
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No, the page is a fake, but it's created to put the SSJ2 logic into perspective.

It does its job well.
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pakl123456
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Ninjajp247
May 30 2012, 06:51 PM
pakl123456
May 30 2012, 05:58 PM
FamousBueller
May 30 2012, 05:47 PM
Goku told gohan to unleash his full power against cell when he was already ssj2 FACT, you havent provided any facts just your own opinion, everything youve shown is proof he was ssj2 in my eyes & many others, show me in the manga where gohan says "im ssj1" u cant end of story. So until there is REAL proof you can believe what u like

Edit: also goku could mean the cell he fought, but he was alive when cell fought ssj2 gohan, if he believes dabura was as strong as thst cell or stronger & gohan was weaker than he was then, then what ur sayin is gohan was superweak against dabura if he was only ssj
You are hypocrite. I showed every point in my first post. What power vs Cell. He told him to get mad like he did against Cell so he can unleash his true strength (SSJ2) Gohan's true strength is his full power SSJ2. Full power SSJ2 Gohan in the Buu Arc is weaker than SSJ2 Gohan in the Cell Games. Gohan can't be as strong as he was in the Cell Games. Giku meant to his full power (SSJ2). hOW DID i PROVE HE WAS A ssj2? Gohan and Dabura were unable to damage Buu's cacoon but Gooku and Dabura immidietly did. That proves Gohan was a SSJ. SSJ2 Gohan filled almost half od the needed power to revive Buu but was unable to inflict any damage during the fight. That proves he was a SSJ since the same Dabura was also unable to do any damage. Goku mean to Perfect Cell and probably the Cell he fought. because he said it will be easy to beat Dabura which means he only needs SSJ since SSJ2 was not that famous in that time or releaved for Goku and Vegeta. Gohan was anyway super weak this is why Vegeta was mad and Dabura said Gohan was trsh because he was SSJ. He wouldn't said he was trash if he was a SSJ2. I just showed factw hen they were unable to inflict any damage. You are just ignoring everything.
No, you are taking this out of context, and lucky for YOU, i have the scan to prove it.


Posted Image

yeah, its pretty obvious that goku means that Gohan in order to release his full hidden power, needs to get angry like he did with cell.

Clearly gohan went beyond super saiyan at cell, so goku doesnt need to be THAT specific.

Clearly they are discussing going beyond super saiyan here, as gohan drew forth all of his strength in the finale against cell and blew him away so hard Cell couldnt even fight it. He just blew up, apart, and away.

Like discussed previous, gohan at cell for MSSJ was BELOW FPCELL. A weaker gohan that isnt the same is going to be weaker, gokus advice about the rage boost is advisable to gohan in his mind because he knows that gohans recent fighting and training might have shaken loose the rust thats grown on him.

Otherwise, discussing going beyond super saiyan has been the topic the entire time these guys have been fighting.

IMO, gohan was drawn an MSSj, but the narrative tells a different view.

Everyone standing there knows who cell is, and that gohan beat him in beyond super saiyan form.

Only the FANS pick apart cell and give him different names. NONE of the Z fighters, and especially goku, give the villains these special names.

Cell was all he was called, and cells final form is known by all.

so discussing cell only means cell as he was, and not some cell from before then. It makes no sense.

meaning that fighting cell as GOHAN was is also necessary, as Goku compared Dabra TO cell and then said that Dabra was stronger, in relation to finding out he had magic powers also.

Gohan was beyond super saiyan at Super perfect cell, thinking of it any other way is just splitting hairs. Thats what vegeta keeps referring to and thats what goku referred to.

its clear what needs to be believed. The narrrative is whats more important, and throught out my At interview search last night. I read him quote MANy times that the Art and fight scenes in DBZ were NOT as important to him as the story line. So changing faces, haircolor, and styles were nothing to him, as he only progresses forward. Saying on more than one occasion that he always thinks his newest work is better than the last, always thinking he messed up in some way. The guys a nut.

But whats being discussed here is clear. dabra is an SSj2 level character and is stronger than Spc.

which is why teen gohan is having issues with him. According to the narrative? gohan is getting his butt kicked, and hes already at full power, breathing hard, panting and sweating. Something he didnt do in MSSJ against goten not a couple days before, and goten was going all out on him, and even though gohan dodged all the shots, and blocked alot, he was still on the defensive the entire time, and realized how rusty he was.

if you are really reading the manga then take another look, and stop pestering people.


Dabura is not stronger than SPC. If he was so explain why was he unable to inflict any damage to Buu's cacoon and Goku and Vegete did? Goku probably talkerd about the Cel he fought since he even said it will be easy to beat Dabura which means only SSJ sunce SSJ2 was not that famous at that time. Goku tells Gohan to draw all of his power like he did with Cell means to use full power but Gohan's full power in the Buu arc was weaker any way.

It was Goten's first appearance so he ahd to look pretty strong even though the same Goten admitted he can't kay a hit on Gohan was frustrated. Kaioshin was afraid of Pui Pui and Base Vegeta>Pui Pui so Base Vegeta>Kaioshin who can beat Frieza with 1 blast. Base Goten is barely Semi Perfect Cell's level and Accorfding to the Kaioshin's arc
Base Vegeta should be at least Semi Perfect Cell's level so Goten and Trunks were apperently giving troubles to Vegeta and Gohan since it was his first appeaance so it had to show they were strong for their age. Anyway Gohan was a SSJ.
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Super Vegetto
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pakl123456
May 30 2012, 06:57 PM
Super Vegetto
May 30 2012, 06:36 PM
pakl123456
May 30 2012, 06:31 PM
Super Vegetto
May 30 2012, 06:23 PM
Goku talks about strenght he draws from anger not SSJ2. You still dont realize his true power is anger which can be in base also.
Cell had lightening since he was SSJ2 Tier. Also, Gohan's anger makes him go SSJ2, His full power was his SS2. How do you think Gohan beat Cell? He used his anger and hidden powers which are his full power SSJ2 form. Gohan never used his full power SSJ2 vs Dabura. This is why Goku told him to get angry. You are just making yourself look dumb when you show me Cell. That proves you have no proof.
Man he can be in base and went enraged. Why is it Mystic Gohan and not SSJ2 Mystic Gohan ?

SSJ2 is just transformation. He is born with his dorment powers ( his true powers ) and not SSJ2.




Btw this is going no where and someone should close this topic.
His dormant powers are beyond his normal limits while SSJ2 is his full normal limits. Goku basically talked about the SSJ2 form. If he wanted Gohan to get mad so his power would increase, he would't mention the Cell Games since according to you Gohan can get even higher than that. He meant to SSJ2 and said "I am angry" transformed and said "but not like the last time" Why didn't he say he is angry enough while he was at SSJ2?? He was in base and transformed into SSJ since he was not mad enough to go SSJ2.
Idea of thinking that Gohan or any saiyan neads anger every time to tranform is why it doesnt work.

I think that you whatched to much movie 9 where Gohan neads push from someone to transform.


Btw going by your logic Vegeta probably didnt achived SSJ2 because he neads push from someone like Babidi, right ?
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pakl123456
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Vegeta SSJ2
May 30 2012, 07:01 PM
Super Vegetto
May 30 2012, 06:14 PM
Posted Image
Really now , this page isn't a fake ?
And Gohan was SSJ2 at Dabura. The hair proves that.
Okay I am done with that silly argument. How many times do I have to eplain you that Gohan's hair as a SSJ and SSJ2was the same since the world tourment??? Gohan had one bang stands when he saw Videl's beatdown and was a SSJ. This poster shows the confussion of Gohan's fight vs Dabura. Nowhere was it said he was a SSJ. Vegeta even said in the end "unless you talked about the Cell you fought" which means Vegeta thinks Gohanw as a SSJ2 ONLY BECAUSE OF GOKU'S JUDGEMENT ABOUT DBURA'S POWER.
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+ Clearin
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I'm just going to elaborate on my last post.

Gohan did not need rage to turn into a super saiyan 2.

He was not mad when he turned Super Saiyan 2 for Kibito.

And lets just say he was mad at Kibito for whatever reason. Why would he be more mad at some stranger asking him to turn Super Saiyan rather than the guy who turned his 2 best friends into statues and was now attempting to kill him?

Think he's MSSj if you want but it's clear that he doesn't need anger to turn Super Saiyan 2, and if he does then he'd be more angry at Dabura and Buu than at Kibito. Just watch the panels of him right before he transforms, he's all shy and crap.

That's the last time I'll say that, if you still want to think Gohan needs anger AND he was more angry at Kibito then go ahead.
Edited by Clearin, May 30 2012, 07:12 PM.
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pakl123456
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Super Vegetto
May 30 2012, 07:06 PM
pakl123456
May 30 2012, 06:57 PM
Super Vegetto
May 30 2012, 06:36 PM
pakl123456
May 30 2012, 06:31 PM
Super Vegetto
May 30 2012, 06:23 PM
Goku talks about strenght he draws from anger not SSJ2. You still dont realize his true power is anger which can be in base also.
Cell had lightening since he was SSJ2 Tier. Also, Gohan's anger makes him go SSJ2, His full power was his SS2. How do you think Gohan beat Cell? He used his anger and hidden powers which are his full power SSJ2 form. Gohan never used his full power SSJ2 vs Dabura. This is why Goku told him to get angry. You are just making yourself look dumb when you show me Cell. That proves you have no proof.
Man he can be in base and went enraged. Why is it Mystic Gohan and not SSJ2 Mystic Gohan ?

SSJ2 is just transformation. He is born with his dorment powers ( his true powers ) and not SSJ2.




Btw this is going no where and someone should close this topic.
His dormant powers are beyond his normal limits while SSJ2 is his full normal limits. Goku basically talked about the SSJ2 form. If he wanted Gohan to get mad so his power would increase, he would't mention the Cell Games since according to you Gohan can get even higher than that. He meant to SSJ2 and said "I am angry" transformed and said "but not like the last time" Why didn't he say he is angry enough while he was at SSJ2?? He was in base and transformed into SSJ since he was not mad enough to go SSJ2.
Idea of thinking that Gohan or any saiyan neads anger every time to tranform is why it doesnt work.

I think that you whatched to much movie 9 where Gohan neads push from someone to transform.


Btw going by your logic Vegeta probably didnt achived SSJ2 because he neads push from someone like Babidi, right ?
Gohan needs anger since he acheived this form by his anger and never masteredit after the Cell Games so it makes no sense for him to be able to go SSJ2 with ease if he never trained or mastered the form. Now you are just making excuses. Vegeta doesn't need push since he acheived the form during training and mastered it. You really have no proof so you decide to twist my words now?? :huh:
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pakl123456
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Teen GohanZ
May 30 2012, 07:08 PM
I'm just going to elaborate on my last post.

Gohan did not need rage to turn into a super saiyan 2.

He was not mad when he turned Super Saiyan 2 for Kibito.

And lets just say he was mad at Kibito for whatever reason. Why would he be more mad at some stranger asking him to turn Super Saiyan 2 rather than the guy who turned his 2 best friends into statues and was now attempting to kill him?

Think he's MSSj if you want but it's clear that he doesn't need anger to turn Super Saiyan 2, and if he does then he'd be more angry at Dabura and Buu than at Kibito.

That's the last time I'll say that, if you still want to think Gohan needs anger AND he was more angry at Kibito then go ahead.
I am not saying he was angry vs Kibito at that moment when he fought him. I am saying he had the anger wth him after seeing Videl's beatdown. That made his emotions too strong so jhe was able to go SSJ2, That's all. Why do you even think AT showed Gohan was mad after seeing Videl?? It's for a reason don't you think?? :=]:
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Super Vegetto
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I dont know who is twisting words for 17 pages.
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pakl123456
May 30 2012, 07:13 PM
Teen GohanZ
May 30 2012, 07:08 PM
I'm just going to elaborate on my last post.

Gohan did not need rage to turn into a super saiyan 2.

He was not mad when he turned Super Saiyan 2 for Kibito.

And lets just say he was mad at Kibito for whatever reason. Why would he be more mad at some stranger asking him to turn Super Saiyan 2 rather than the guy who turned his 2 best friends into statues and was now attempting to kill him?

Think he's MSSj if you want but it's clear that he doesn't need anger to turn Super Saiyan 2, and if he does then he'd be more angry at Dabura and Buu than at Kibito.

That's the last time I'll say that, if you still want to think Gohan needs anger AND he was more angry at Kibito then go ahead.
I am not saying he was angry vs Kibito at that moment when he fought him. I am saying he had the anger wth him after seeing Videl's beatdown. That made his emotions too strong so jhe was able to go SSJ2, That's all. Why do you even think AT showed Gohan was mad after seeing Videl?? It's for a reason don't you think?? :=]:
Yes he was mad when Videl was getting beat up but right before he turned Super Saiyan 2 he was completely calm.

Spoiler: click to toggle


Does that look mad to you?
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GridZero
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He wasn't mad.

Anyone who thinks he was mad knows nothing about human expressions.
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Super Vegetto
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Teen GohanZ
May 30 2012, 07:14 PM
pakl123456
May 30 2012, 07:13 PM
Teen GohanZ
May 30 2012, 07:08 PM
I'm just going to elaborate on my last post.

Gohan did not need rage to turn into a super saiyan 2.

He was not mad when he turned Super Saiyan 2 for Kibito.

And lets just say he was mad at Kibito for whatever reason. Why would he be more mad at some stranger asking him to turn Super Saiyan 2 rather than the guy who turned his 2 best friends into statues and was now attempting to kill him?

Think he's MSSj if you want but it's clear that he doesn't need anger to turn Super Saiyan 2, and if he does then he'd be more angry at Dabura and Buu than at Kibito.

That's the last time I'll say that, if you still want to think Gohan needs anger AND he was more angry at Kibito then go ahead.
I am not saying he was angry vs Kibito at that moment when he fought him. I am saying he had the anger wth him after seeing Videl's beatdown. That made his emotions too strong so jhe was able to go SSJ2, That's all. Why do you even think AT showed Gohan was mad after seeing Videl?? It's for a reason don't you think?? :=]:
Yes he was mad when Videl was getting beat up but right before he turned Super Saiyan 2 he was completely calm.

Spoiler: click to toggle


Does that look mad to you?
Posted Image

He probably thinks that this is mad while its pretty obvious nervous mode.

Why did Vegeta sad that he got weaker if he was enraged like in Cell games ?

Why did he sad same thing while Gohan fought Dabura ? Pretty obvious that he talks about Gohans SSJ2 power ( without anger ).

He even sad in ship how Gohans frenzy mode could surpass them all, but pakl just dont get it.


If he was mad on world tournament, Vegeta would never sad something about his anger surpassing Goku and Vegeta in powers.
Edited by Super Vegetto, May 30 2012, 07:19 PM.
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pakl123456
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Teen GohanZ
May 30 2012, 07:14 PM
pakl123456
May 30 2012, 07:13 PM
Teen GohanZ
May 30 2012, 07:08 PM
I'm just going to elaborate on my last post.

Gohan did not need rage to turn into a super saiyan 2.

He was not mad when he turned Super Saiyan 2 for Kibito.

And lets just say he was mad at Kibito for whatever reason. Why would he be more mad at some stranger asking him to turn Super Saiyan 2 rather than the guy who turned his 2 best friends into statues and was now attempting to kill him?

Think he's MSSj if you want but it's clear that he doesn't need anger to turn Super Saiyan 2, and if he does then he'd be more angry at Dabura and Buu than at Kibito.

That's the last time I'll say that, if you still want to think Gohan needs anger AND he was more angry at Kibito then go ahead.
I am not saying he was angry vs Kibito at that moment when he fought him. I am saying he had the anger wth him after seeing Videl's beatdown. That made his emotions too strong so jhe was able to go SSJ2, That's all. Why do you even think AT showed Gohan was mad after seeing Videl?? It's for a reason don't you think?? :=]:
Yes he was mad when Videl was getting beat up but right before he turned Super Saiyan 2 he was completely calm.

Spoiler: click to toggle


Does that look mad to you?
Look for the next panels when he looks pretty seerious and had an angry expression when he transfornmed. he had the angry with him and showed it when he transformed.

[/spoiler]http://www.mangareader.net/105-3094-3/dragon-ball/chapter-445.htm
Spoiler: click to toggle
Edited by pakl123456, May 30 2012, 07:23 PM.
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pakl123456
May 30 2012, 07:22 PM
Teen GohanZ
May 30 2012, 07:14 PM
pakl123456
May 30 2012, 07:13 PM
Teen GohanZ
May 30 2012, 07:08 PM
I'm just going to elaborate on my last post.

Gohan did not need rage to turn into a super saiyan 2.

He was not mad when he turned Super Saiyan 2 for Kibito.

And lets just say he was mad at Kibito for whatever reason. Why would he be more mad at some stranger asking him to turn Super Saiyan 2 rather than the guy who turned his 2 best friends into statues and was now attempting to kill him?

Think he's MSSj if you want but it's clear that he doesn't need anger to turn Super Saiyan 2, and if he does then he'd be more angry at Dabura and Buu than at Kibito.

That's the last time I'll say that, if you still want to think Gohan needs anger AND he was more angry at Kibito then go ahead.
I am not saying he was angry vs Kibito at that moment when he fought him. I am saying he had the anger wth him after seeing Videl's beatdown. That made his emotions too strong so jhe was able to go SSJ2, That's all. Why do you even think AT showed Gohan was mad after seeing Videl?? It's for a reason don't you think?? :=]:
Yes he was mad when Videl was getting beat up but right before he turned Super Saiyan 2 he was completely calm.

Spoiler: click to toggle


Does that look mad to you?
Look for the next panels when he looks pretty seerious and had an angry expression when he transfornmed. he had the angry with him and showed it when he transformed.

http://www.mangareader.net/105-3094-3/dragon-ball/chapter-445.html
A lot of characters have a serious face when they transform regardless of their current mood.
Spoiler: click to toggle
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