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- SSJ Gohan (Post Z Sword) v Base Gotenks (PRE Rosat)
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| SSJ Gohan (Post Z Sword) v Base Gotenks (PRE Rosat) | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Aug 15 2011, 02:22 AM (1,468 Views) | |
| + Havoc_Wreaker | Aug 15 2011, 09:22 PM Post #16 |
Popcorn
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this is base and pre rosat gotenks just saying btw |
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| DanielSan | Aug 15 2011, 09:40 PM Post #17 |
 
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I have Base Gotenks Pre rosat one shoting SSJ1 Gohan post Zed Sword. But SSJ2 Gohan would be beat Gotenks easily in my opinion. SSJ3 Goku> Fat Buu> SSJ2 Gohan Post Zed> Gotenks>> SSJ Gohan There is a big gap between Base Gotenks and Fat Buu but Gohan was thinking about fighting Fat Buu. Fat Buu though is probably still stronger though. |
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| Saberoph | Aug 15 2011, 09:43 PM Post #18 |
 
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But remember Goku only questioned if Gohan could beat Fat Boo, not if he was on Boo's level or not. So really Post Zeta Sword SS2 Gohan would be equal to Fat Boo...just saying. |
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| Optimus Banana | Aug 15 2011, 09:58 PM Post #19 |
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I thought Buu transformed into super buu before Gohan was done training? If so then its possible Gohan could beat Fat Buu but be weaker than Super Buu. |
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| DanielSan | Aug 15 2011, 10:00 PM Post #20 |
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Yes that is true. I would say that SSJ2 Gohan would beat base gotenks easily. But SSJ1 he would still lose but not a one shot like I said before. |
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| Wintergreen5000 | Aug 16 2011, 04:18 PM Post #21 |
WCZE
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Base Gotenks [pre-RoSaT] = SSjin 2. SSjin Gohan [Z-Sword Training] ... NOT = to SSjin 2. It's very easy. No way a Super Saiyan, even with the training of the Zeta Sword, can match a high-tier SSjin 2, which was most likely the level base Gotenks was at since he fought with Buu and managed to escape without major injuries. |
 
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Aug 16 2011, 04:30 PM Post #22 |
 
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its not that simple, gohans ssj2 form is higher than gotenks, not to mention he COULD push his mssj form to gotenks ssj2 level, the z sword training gave him an extra level. hence the complete power up from the elder kai. Gohans well ran deeeeeeeep, after the z sword training. |
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| Wintergreen5000 | Aug 16 2011, 04:40 PM Post #23 |
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WCZE
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I would agree that Gohan became stronger after the training with the Zeta Sword, but I refuse to believe that his SSjin level was boosted to the SSjin 2 level, considering the fact that, one, it seems quite farfetched, and two, it isn't stated and you really have no proof. |
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| + Clearin | Aug 16 2011, 04:44 PM Post #24 |
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If you're using the x50 SSj multiplier then I don't think Gotenks would even be on a SSj2 level. As I said in the last page using a x50 multiplier and having SSj Gotenks = SSj3 Goku then SSj Goku would stomp. I suppose Gotenks doesn't HAVE to be = SSj3 Goku, I mean nothing actually says it in the manga, only that both of them can beat Fat Buu. I'd put SSj Gotenks higher than SSj3 Goku but I'm not sure by how much... We don't even see regular Gotenks much at all, we don't get to see his entire first fight, we have no idea how he escaped, maybe he hid and Buu got bored and flew away, and when he turns SSj he doesn't fight at all. |
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| Wintergreen5000 | Aug 16 2011, 04:56 PM Post #25 |
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WCZE
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You're right that we didn't get to see his fight with Buu. However, seeing Majin Vegeta's fight with Buu, and how that went, I highly doubt that Gotenks is below the SSjin 2 level. He showed that he took quite a beating, and that means he actually engaged Buu, and then managed to escape somehow. Maybe he hid or maybe Buu thought he was dead, but it really just seems to me that for Gotenks to do any of that he would have to be on the SSjin 2 level. Gohan didn't escape Buu, and by the time Vegeta realized Buu was superior to him, he was already jacked up. So it just makes sense to me that Gotenks was on the SSjin 2 level, cause I can't see how he would be able to take that punishment and escape if he wasn't. And by the way, I don't believe in the 50x multiplier for SSjin at this point. |
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| + Clearin | Aug 16 2011, 05:03 PM Post #26 |
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Well there's also Supreme Kai who is weaker than a Suppressed Goku (Judging by his fear of Yakkon) He managed to take 4 (pretty brutal) hits from Buu and used some energy to blow up the blast that was going to kill Gohan, then I think he got caught in Vegeta's blast? After all that he could walk for a little while to find Gohan before collapsing. So Gotenks could probably take a couple of hits, get knocked into a rock or something, hide, Buu flies off and Gotenks escapes. I'm not saying that is what happened obviously, but it is an option for people who don't put Base Gotenks on a SSj2 level. |
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| Wintergreen5000 | Aug 16 2011, 05:46 PM Post #27 |
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WCZE
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I won't deny the possibility of that scenario. But here's how I see it: Gotenks comes down to face Buu with the intent to kill Buu. He engages hard and surprises him with a huge ki blast that makes Buu mad, since it likely blows off some of his body. Buu then responds hard by throwing all sorts of ki blasts at Gotenks, which Gotenks manages to barely dodge, then Buu closes in and man-handles Gotenks, giving him a proper beating. Buu then blasts Gotenks away into the water or into some kind of mountain and Gotenks just lays there until Buu leaves thinking he's dead. Gotenks is hurt but is still able to fly back to Kami's Lookout without great injuries like the Supreme Kai had, who, if I remember correctly, would've died if Kibito didn't show up in time to heal him. That's where they differ. I think the non-canon scene of Base Gotenks fighting Fat Buu in the anime is actually quite a bit accurate to what happened in the manga. But, fromt he manga's point of view, it can't exactly be said that that is what happened. Regardless, I tend to think that Gotenks being on the SSjin 2 level isn't far from the truth at all, considering that Piccolo even commented on them having great strength. I doubt he would compliment them so if they weren't at least on the SSjin 2 level. Piccolo goes on to say though that they are still not a match for Buu, who easily beat up SSjin 2 Majin Vegeta. So, "great power", but "not enough to beat Buu" means SSjin 2-tier to me. Also, even Gotenks commented and said that his current base level was enough to beat Buu. I doubt he would say that while being on the SSjin 1 level. |
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Aug 16 2011, 08:03 PM Post #28 |
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How can it seem farfetched when its closer to the truth of the real situatuion? I dont see how you could put z sword gohan beloe anyone considering in base he was stronger than mssj goku, who could barely swing the sword in base. Gohan gained an extra form when all of his potential skyrocketed in his base form for the z sword, then elder kai RELEaSED that inner power gohan had gained and amplified it with magic. All of a sudden gohan is a high tier SSj3 type character whooops!! i suppose thats all just concidence then huh? skip the whole other form he supposedly got other than his advanced ssj2 from the z sword. But nevermind ANY of that since your multiplying numbers outdo the logic of what actually happened. Base Post z sword gohan>mssj goku Post z sword gohan ssj2 eats gotenks post rosat ultimate gohan fully realized>>gotenks ssj3 POST rosat how does what i say NOT have proof, it played out right in front of you. Edited by Paikuan extreme, Aug 16 2011, 08:05 PM.
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| Wintergreen5000 | Aug 17 2011, 05:01 PM Post #29 |
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WCZE
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Lol. I always enjoy debating with you. Our views on things are so radically different it kind of makes me laugh having to reply to your post. Seems like I can always count on you to come in and tell me I'm wrong. But I mean that in a good way. Anyway... 1. Gohan [Post Z-Sword Training] in base is stronger than MSSjin Goku? Where's this stated? Where's it shown? Seems like it just assumed on your part for whatever reason. Why should I believe that Gohan's base is equal to MSSjin Goku? 2. Both Goku and Gohan swung the sword in base [is that right, "swung"?], so your point that base Goku could "barely" swing it after just having picked it up is really "pointless" considering the fact that when Gohan first picked it up he could barely swing it at all. And he wasn't training with it for that long. Keep that in mind. 3. Gohan may have gotten stronger using the Zeta Sword, but it really couldn't have made that much of a difference considering he had barely been training with the sword for any time at all. It couldn't have boosted his level THAT much. At the most, it would be to the point where Gohan's SSjin 2 level would've become greater than Goku and Vegeta's. Same with his other levels. But to the point where his base level equals Goku's MSSjin level? I don't see that happening. Maybe if he trained with it for a full year or something. 4. Gohan gained an extra form from using the Zeta Sword? I missed THAT. 0.0 5. I don't really use numbers and calculations. Early on after the Freeza Arc up to the Android Arc, yes, theoretically I will, but beyond that it is simply impossible to determine levels since we don't know what kind of increase they would've attained. I rely more heavily on statements, events, and logic moreso than immaginary power levels that are probably more wrong than right. 6. Again, no evidence on your part that Base Gohan [Post-Z Sword Training] is equal to MSSjin Goku. No evidence that SSjin 2 Gohan [Post Z-Sword Training] is greater than Gotenks Post RoSaT [WHAT? POST?!] At the most, SSjin 2 Gohan [Post Z Sword] is stronger than SSjin 2 Goku and SSjin 2 Majin Vegeta, but I see no reason to believe he's stronger than SSjin 3 Goku, Super Janemba, or even near Super Buu's level. Edited by Wintergreen5000, Aug 17 2011, 05:03 PM.
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| oodle | Aug 17 2011, 05:12 PM Post #30 |
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Hmm, maybe gotenks wins this. The general consensus is that the ssj multiplier is > the ssj2 multiplier. But really this just boils down to personal multipliers. With my multipliers, Gohan is like 1.2x stronger than majin ssj2 vegeta. So where do u have majin vegeta relative to base gotenks? Imagine u had it like this Base Gohan (pre z sword) - 100 SSJ Gohan (pre z sword) - 500 SSJ2 Gohan (pre z sword) - 2000 Base Gohan (post z sword) -575 SSJ Gohan (post z sword0- 2875 Edited by oodle, Aug 17 2011, 05:12 PM.
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