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| P123 Battle Power Chart | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Nov 14 2010, 03:12 AM (1,889 Views) | |
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Nov 14 2010, 03:12 AM Post #1 |
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Saiyan Saga Part 1 Roshi 139 Yamcha 177 Krillen 206 Tien 250 Piccolo ~ Weights 322 ~ Full Power 408 Goku ~Weights 334 ~Full Power 416 Raditz 1,220 Gohan ~Rage1 710 ~Rage2 1,307 Saiyan Saga Part 2 Saibamen 1,200 Yamcha 1,235 Krillen 1,440 Tien 1,750 Piccolo 2,300 Nappa 8,000 Goku ~Initial 5,000 ~FullPower 8,060 ~Kaioken 16,120 ~KKx3 24,180 ~KKx4 32,240 Vegeta 18,000 ~Oozaru 180,000 Freeza's Henchmen Krillen 1,500 ~Potential 10,500 Gohan 1,500 ~ Potential 12,500 Kiwi 18,000 Dodoria 20,000 Zarbon 22,000 ~Transformed 28,000 Vegeta 24,000 ~Zenkai 30,000 Ginyu Force Ginyu(Goku'sBody) 23,000 Krillen 23,000 Gohan 27,000 Nail 42,000 Reecome 45,000 Burter 45,000 Jeice 45,000 Vegeta 30,000 ~Zenkai 60,000 Ginyu 120,000 Goku 90,000 ~Kaioken 180,000 Freeza Saga Krillen 175,000 Piccolo ~ Initial 300,000 ~ Nail Fusion W/w 1,250,000 ~ Nail Fusion 1,500,000 Gohan 275,000 ~Rage 1,100,000 ~Zenkai 450,000 ~Rage 1,800,000 Vegeta 475,000 ~Zenkai 2,400,000 Freeza ~ 3rd Suppression 530,000 ~Initial 2nd 1,060,000 ~Power Up 2nd 1,200,000 ~ 2nd Suppression 1,400,000 ~ 1st Suppression 2,250,000 ~ Initial True Form 3,300,000 ~ 50% 72,000,000 ~ 70% 100,800,000 ~ 100% 144,000,000 Goku 3,000,000 ~KKx10 30,000,000 ~KKx20 60,000,000 ~SSJ 150,000,000 Mecha Freeza Saga Yamcha 265,000 Krillen 309,000 Tien 375,000 Gohan 450,000 Vegeta 2,750,000 Piccolo 4,000,000 King Cold ~ Full Power 100,000,000 Trunks 3,000,000 ~SSJ 150,000,000 Mecha Freeza ~ Initial 100,000,000 ~FullPower(NotShown) 160,000,000 Goku 3,500,000 ~SSJ 175,000,000 Androids Saga Yamcha 1,770,000 Krillen 2,060,000 Tien 2,500,000 Gohan 3,290,000 Android 19 55,000,000 ~ Post 110,000,000 Android 20 60,000,000 ~Post 120,000,000 Trunks 4,500,000 ~SSJ 225,000,000 Goku 5,200,000 ~SSJ 260,000,000 Vegeta 5,400,000 ~SSJ 270,000,000 Cyborg 18 350,000,000 Cyborg 17 375,000,000 Piccolo 187,500,000 ~Kami Fusion W/w 345,000,000 ~Kami Fusion 375,000,000 Android 16 500,000,000 Imperfect Cell 300,000,000 ~Post Absorbtion 500,000,000 Cell Saga Goku ~ SSJ 260,000,000 ~ USSJ 390,000,000 ~USSJ2 975,000,000 Vegeta ~SSJ 900,000,000 ~USSJ 1,350,000,000 Semi Cell ~ Initial 875,000,000 ~ Full Power 1,000,000,000 ~ Initial PC 1,350,000,000 ~ Perfect Cell 2,500,000,000 Trunks ~SSJ 800,000,000 ~USSJ 1,200,000,000 ~USSJ2 3,000,000,000 Cell Games Piccolo 750,000,000 Cell Juniors 3,500,000,000 Trunks ~SSJ 3,500,000,000 Vegeta ~SSJ 3,500,000,000 Goku 1,000,000,000 ~50% SSJ 2,500,000,000 ~ SSJ 5,000,000,000 Perfect Cell ~ Suppressed 2,500,000,000 ~ Powered Up 6,000,000,000 ~ Full Power 10,000,000,000 ~ Super Perfect 17,000,000,000 Gohan 1,200,000,000 ~SSJ 6,000,000,000 ~SSJ2 18,000,000,000 Buu Saga Part 1 Tien 3,000,000 Kibito 500,000,000 Yakon 800,000,000 Piccolo 850,000,000 Goten ~SSJ 1,280,000,000 Trunks ~SSJ 1,350,000,000 Kaioshin 3,000,000,000 Dabura 4,750,000,000 Gohan 900,000,000 ~SSJ 4,500,000,000 ~SSJ2 13,500,000,000 Vegeta 1,100,000,000 ~SSJ 5,500,000,000 ~SSJ2 16,500,000,000 Goku ~ SSJ2 Burst 17,500,000,000 Buu Saga Part 2 Majin Vegeta 1,333,000,000 ~SSJ 6,666,000,000 ~SSJ2 20,000,000,000 Good Buu 30,000,000,000 Evil Buu 35,000,000,000 Fat Buu 65,000,000,000 Gotenks 32,000,000,000 ~ SSJ 80,000,000,000 Gohan ~Post Z Sword 4,000,000,000 ~ SSJ 20,000,000,000 ~ SSJ2 60,000,000,000 Buu Saga Part 2 Goten 800,000,000 ~SSJ 4,000,000,000 Trunks 800,000,000 ~SSJ 4,000,000,000 Gotenks 100,000,000,000 ~SSJ 250,000,000,000 ~SSJ2 375,000,000,000 ~SSJ3 750,000,000,000 Ultimate Gohan 1,000,000,000,000 Super Buu 700,000,000,000 ~Buff 800,000,000,000 ~Buutenks 1,450,000,000,000 ~Buuhan 1,700,000,000,000 Vegetto 1,200,000,000,000 ~SSJ 3,000,000,000,000 Buu Saga Part 3 Kaioshin 15,500,000,000 Vegeta 1,333,000,000 ~SSJ 6,666,000,000 ~SSJ2 20,000,000,000 Mr. Buu 30,000,000,000 Goku 1,333,000,000 ~SSJ 6,666,000,000 ~SSJ2 20,000,000,000 ~SSJ3 80,000,000,000 Kid Buu 80,000,000,000 Movies+Anime Turles 30,000 ~Post Fruit 400,000 Olibu 875,000,000 Cooler 140,000,000 ~ Final Form 470,000,000 ~ Meta 1,000,000,000 East Kaioshin 3,000,000,000 North Kaioshin 3,250,000,000 West Kaioshin 3,500,000,000 Dai Kaioshin 3,750,000,000 South Kaioshin 4,000,000,000 Pikkon ~Weights 950,000,000 ~Full Power 5,250,000,000 Bojack ~ Initial 6,500,000,000 ~ Transformed 9,500,000,000 Broly ~ SSJ 6,800,000,000 ~ LSSJ 17,000,000,000 Super Janemba 800,000,000,000 Gogeta 500,000,000,000 ~SSJ 1,250,000,000,000 Gokan 1,500,000,000,000 ~SSJ 3,750,000,000,000 1) Always assume full power,unless told otherwise. 2) If a power up is not noted , it didn't happen. 3) Statements are true,unless contradicted. Base x 50 = SSJ SSJ x 1.5 = USSJ USSJ x 2.5 = USSJ2 SSJ x 2.5 = LSSJ MSSJ/5 = Base MSSJx3 = SSJ2 SSJ2x4 = SSJ3 Fusion multipliers are cut in half... Base x 2.5 = SSJ SSJ x 1.5 = SSJ2 SSJ2 x 2 = SSJ3 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zoD5Ayro1U4 Freeza saga http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0L2zrmMr6Q Cell Saga http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UaEYD1bONHE Buu Saga http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D4LFLGo69KM Movies/Anime Edited by p123, Nov 28 2010, 04:37 AM.
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| + Pelador | Nov 14 2010, 03:19 AM Post #2 |
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Crazy Awesome Legend
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How come all you ever post is power levels? It's not like anything after the Freeza saga can be proven either so what's the point? I actually consider this spam since half of it is just made up nonsense. |
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| lunar2 | Nov 14 2010, 04:20 AM Post #3 |
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how come all you ever do is complain. some people enjoy discussing power levels, and they have every right to come to a dragonball discussion forum and discuss power levels. i actually consider your post trolling because you came to a power level topic just to complain and start fights over the discussion of power levels. and p123, i think from android saga on, your numbers are way to low, but i havent had a chance to go in depth with this list, so thats all i can say at a glance. good job on the ssj multipliers though, except why are fusions lower? |
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list of canon sources: the DB manga, and the Dr. Slump manga as it applies to the crossover during the rra saga. list of non canon sources: everything else, regardless of origin, format, or quality. for those that blindly follow word of god | |
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| + Pyrus | Nov 14 2010, 04:22 AM Post #4 |
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Yeah, I guess I'll get into this list once I return. I'm so bored these days, haha. From a glance, I agree that they seem very low, but oh well. |
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Spoiler: click to toggle
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| Fulgore | Nov 14 2010, 04:35 AM Post #5 |
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The Darkness Returns
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Completely disagree about Gokan's power level.. only 500,000,000 more than Ultimate Gohan? Really? rofl. |
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| Doodification | Nov 14 2010, 05:12 AM Post #6 |
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Straya C^&*
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Lol, imagine a saiyan saga fighter taking on a buu saga fighter lol, absolute slaughter |
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Nov 14 2010, 06:12 AM Post #7 |
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Hey sure I would love to get into the in depth stuff. I have worked very hard on these numbers, I have created many theories , formulas etc, for these power levels. These developed over time, a long period of time and many changes have been made. I would say this is probably my 100th attempt at power levels. I haven't had to change them in a few months, and I would be a daily changer. So for me to feel satisfied with them, and then make videos, I am very satisfied and confident in these numbers. I like to promote them, I believe alot of my theories are a good thing for the fandom. I truly feel I have created a better version than the Daiz POV on power levels and have included them for all sagas. So yes, Pelador, I am pretty much all about power levels. It's pretty much an obsession of mine, and like I said, I have spent many hours, many sleepless nights on them. I have definitley concentrated a major portion of my life, hoping so to be a benefit to the fandom. If you look deeply into my numbers you will find that everything fully correlates. But anyway, my numbers are too low you guys say? Well yes, at the end of the day, the best we can do is provide a general range for power levels. It's impossible to be 100% correct. But I believe the range I have developed is one of the best out there. And I hope some people could benefit from the general range, and theories of my power levels. Whether you think this guy should be 100 million or 200 million, this list should develop the certain range of where fighter's powers should lie. A guide to say. So that is why I post power levels all the time. And Lunar is right, coming to a thread that you are against, just to post that you are against it, is trolling. Sounds like a waste of time to me, but to each his own. FulGore If you were familiar with the text you wouldn't be rofling. What is really so funny about that? You have provided no examples of why Gokan should have benefitted that much greater. Here is the chart.... Gokan >/= Buutenks > Gohan >SSJ3 Gotenks ~ Super Buu Let's take a simple set of numbers... SSJ3 Gotenks 10 Super Buu 10 IMO Buu absorbs by addition, except for the Kai's. So Buutenks is 20. So Logically if super Buu is 10 and Buutenks is 20, then Gohan would be like 15. Now Elder Kai states that Gokan might not have to transform against Buutenks. Seeing as he is familiar with potara, a god in the Db verse, and you and I are just spectators. I tend to believe him. So if Elder Kai says Gokan might not have to transform, I take that as a fact. IMO might not have to transform means Gokan is probably a little bit stronger than Buutenks. So. Gokan 21 Buutenks 20 Gohan Super 10 SSJ3Gotnk10 And actually your wrong. Gokan is 500 BILLION stronger than Gohan. As in a 1.5x increase. Now don't forget, that even if it was a 1 billion increase, Gokan can now transform logically into SSJ/SSJ2/SSJ3 on top of that. So don't forget, that is just Base Gokan. Who's full power, SSJ3 would absolutley dwarf Gohan. So keep things in consideration. The boost is determined by my fusion formula. That's another topic though, a long in depth topic. If you want to discuss the lowness of my numbers I need a couple more examples then just saying low. If you could point to a saga or an general range where you feel it's low let me know please. But keep in mind, that if the Androids 17/18 are lower than you expected, which is what I am assuming, they are indirectly going to effect the whole chain. But anyhow please post your questions , I will be here ready willing and able. |
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| Doodification | Nov 14 2010, 06:48 AM Post #8 |
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Straya C^&*
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look, i really don't think akira toriyama wrote formulas and equations on power levels, to be honest, you trying to find them out seems a great waste of time, i'm sorry if that offends you |
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Nov 14 2010, 07:29 AM Post #9 |
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It doesn't, because it's true. It is unrealistic to think that AT was capable of calculating and formulating everything to fit together so perfectly. AT is never suggested to be so capable. I do not imply that at all. All I have done , is taken what is given, and make it all fit into one gigantic correlating chart, in a way, AT never intended, and probably never thought possible. I have spent a long time slowly putting the pieces of the puzzle together. Luckily for me, AT was very obsessive, and strict with his standards, giving me an oppurtunity to even try to accomplish this. If it wasn't for his habits, and intelligent writing style, all of this would have been impossible. GT for example, did not have creators who put the time or effort into it, and thus, there is no puzzle to put together. AT crafted a beautiful work, that I could craft into my own beautiful work. So yes, you are right, AT didn't have the capacity to look this deep into his own work, if he did , I woudn't have to be the one displaying this chart. However, his work was so fine, so precise, it left room for someone like me to come along, and make it all truly fit together. Thanks for your time. |
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| Fulgore | Nov 14 2010, 09:35 AM Post #10 |
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The Darkness Returns
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You're actually wrong. There's nothing stating Gokan has ACCESS to SSj3, considering gohan has LOST his ability to ascend. He might have Mystic, which my god blows Ssj3 out of the water Multipliers would be much higher than if it was vegeta/goku. Factor in Father-son, or even a power level match bonus. 500,000,000,000 is not a lot more, there's no WAY I'd put Gohan in a fusion with someone like GOKU below Buuhan... That's just retarded. Also, Buu's absorption added flat power. If a fighter was 1 trillion, he gets 1 trillion.. I'm disputing your math on this man Edited by Fulgore, Nov 14 2010, 09:36 AM.
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| Nusu | Nov 14 2010, 09:35 AM Post #11 |
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Piccolo Daimao > Piccolo Jr.
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I find it good, only one thing bugs me, Piccolo gaining 4.000.000 and Vegeta only gaining 2.500.000 or at least Piccolo should gain 2.000.000 if ask me, and then 4.000.000 in the training with Goku and Gohan. And another thing, Krillin jumping up from 75.000 too 400.000. But the rest is good. |
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Once upon a time, there used to be a signature. Then it got lame, and now I'm out of options for a new one. | |
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| + Ryebrid | Nov 14 2010, 10:45 AM Post #12 |
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You can make all the pretty numbers you want but none of it will be true. Sorry to say dude, but your list is just fan made and nothing more, it isnt accurate like you think it is. You can pretend to believe all the multipliers and would be power increases that came from your head. But at the end of the day, all Akira did was try to make an interesting show, nothing technical. But i respect you for what you have done. I sure as hell wouldnt even know where to begin with making power lvl lists lol Nice work, just not as accurate as you think. |
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Nov 14 2010, 05:56 PM Post #13 |
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I think I already went into this Fulgore... Elder Kai says that Gokan might not have to TRANSFORM. Key word, transform. Which implies that Gokan could transform. If he could reach SSJ3? Well seeing how two SSJs, can reach SSj3, IMO it's likely Gokan could without training. But with training surely he can. And no one is ever actually WRONG. Alot of things are up for interpretation, not everything is black and white. Try to be a little more open minded while discussing levels here, this is a highly hypothetical realm here, coming in here to say they are wrong or fake or fanmade is trolling. Power levels are fan made, that much is obvious at least, shouldn't need to point it out, and like I said right/wrong don't really apply here unless there is a contradictory statement. So like I said, Elder Kaioshin implies that Gokan can have transformations. I just take that implication seriously. Elder Kaioshin > Fulgore/ Me/ Other Posters because Elder Kaioshin is in the manga, and thus his opinion is relevant, while ours are not. Why would I think your opinion on how strong Base Gokan is trump Elder Kaioshin's POV? I don't get that. Elder says he might not have to transform. To me that implies Base Gokan is going to be somewhere around Buutenks. A bit stronger probably but he should be close. His estimation is all we have manga wise, and that's the only thing Im looking at, as this is about the DB story, so I would listen to the DB characters. Ya no what I mean? Yes I feel Buu absorbs by addition for the Z fighters. And is multiplication for South Kaioshin, and Dai Kai only suppressed Buff Buu. I don't understand how you disagree with this chart. Gokan 21 Buutenks20 Gohan 15 SSj3Gotenks 10 Super Buu 10 Perhaps if you could show you what you mean numerically I can understand you better. Start with Super/SSj3 Gotenks as being 10 and work from there. Guys try to keep things kosher. Just because I posted power levels does not mean it gives you a reason to attack me. Telling me I am flat out wrong is rude, and telling me they are fanmade, is just questionable? Obviously they are fanmade. If you are against power levels, then you are wasting your time, and mine here. Please avoid posting wasteful posts like that. This thread is all about debating power levels that I posted and getting people's indepth opinions on it. @ Nusu Nusu in the Androids Arc we learn that Piccolo is ridicolously strong. He is confident in his power he states as much. Piccolo also is aware of SSJ Trunks power and words. Trunks implies he is not confident in his power and admits he is nothing to the androids. So logically.... 1) Piccolo Androids is confident... 2) Trunks is not confident in his power 3) Piccolo > Trunks Piccolo has no idea how strong the androids are. All he knows is that SSJ Trunks is no match for them. For him to be confident about going up against the androids it doesn't make alot of sense for him to be confident yet weaker than someone who is not confident. It just doesn't make sense. As we can see using that logic Piccolo got ridicolously strong in that 3 year period. Then you gotta ask yourself why? Sure he was going through hard training, but Piccolo is SSJ level, and previously he was weaker than Base Saiyans. From this I conclude that Piccolo has increased his potential dramatically because of the fusion with Nail. Then I look back. The one year time period between Freeza to Mecha Freeza, guess what? Piccolo was fused with Nail, and training for a year. If he increased that much in three years, and his potential is way above the base saiyans at that point, why wouldn't he increase a lot by this point? Then I check the manga. Piccolo gets some positive comments from Vegeta, then Piccolo challenges Vegeta, to which Vegeta of all people backs down, and takes his anger out on Bulma. Then Piccolo takes a commanding role to dictaing the terms of the androids. IMO that is an implication that Piccolo is indeed a good deal stronger than he was on Namek. So then I ask myself. Piccolo vs Vegeta at this point... Vegeta is a cocky arrogant guy, and Piccolo is known to not challenge people unless he is superior, and if he knows he is inferior he would not do that, he is not cocky not arrogant and very aware of his power and others. Piccolo is very smart. I doubt he would straight up challenge Vegeta unless he is at least close to Vegeta. So I take these all into account. So if Vegeta is 2.75 million I think Piccolo should range from 2.5 mil to 4 mil. I choose the latter, but I am aware of the range, and any number inside that range is plausible and acceptable. And that's what power levels is about. Finding general plausible ranges and then using personal opinion to craft them to your liking. The humans are shot. I just threw anything in there. IMO Krillen against Freeza should probably be 150-200 k range. I actually wanted to not include the humans strength but the guy who made my power level videos included them by accident as they were old numbers, and pretty much forced me to stick with them, since they are up all over the net. But I agree. The humans power is impossible to even gauge. They do not have enough feats or statements to get an accurate description. So I agree with you. My human ratings are definitley not up to par with my other numbers. But as you can see from my Piccolo Androids /Mecha theory, I have put a ton of effort and thought into each and every increase for relevant characters. You may not agree with my logic, but as long as you know what im doing and why, and whether it's plausible or not really is all that matters. So if your just coming here to bash/troll/flame please keep that for other threads, I am here to have in depth conversations with knowledgable members who enjoy debating in a highly hypothetical realm. If this is not something you like to do, you don't have to, and would be appreciated if you do not post. If your not helping, your hurting. Anyway thanks for your time to read all of this guys, I enjoy the deep detailed discussion. Let's just keep it mature here, I am not some punk 15 year old kid, I am a grown man, and will be treated/talked to as such. Anyway, let's discuss! |
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| Fulgore | Nov 14 2010, 07:48 PM Post #14 |
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The Darkness Returns
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Elder Kai was blown away by how strong VEGETTO was. He didn't see that coming, and I'm more than willing to bet that Vegetto DESTROYS Buutenks. Hell, I wouldn't put Vegetto even CLOSE to Ultimate Gohan in terms of power. It's not even a competition Anyway, moving on. Let's assume that vegeta's PL is 400 at SSj2, and Gokus is 1200 at SSJ3 Their power level fused should come out be around 720k, Assuming they got the Rival bonus that was mentioned Now Gohan fuses with goku Gohan is 1500 and Goku is 1200 Assuming they get a father-son bonus it should be around 2.7 million.. Your math is also off Your Buuhan totally failed to take into account Goten Trunks and Piccolo..so your thoroughly thought out PLs have holes in it there is no comparison between the two. Edited by Fulgore, Nov 14 2010, 07:50 PM.
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Nov 14 2010, 08:10 PM Post #15 |
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Don't make me run and get your mom kid, didn't she teach you to use your manners? Guess not... Goku's SSJ3 is not accounted into the Fusion Formula, as he doesn't have full control over his SSJ3. It's too powerful for him , and only controlled forms carry over, not forms that are not in control. Elder Kai is impressed with SSJ Vegetto. Base Vegetto literally craps himself when Buuhan comes after him. Base Vegetto doesn't even test his power out or anything, he wants nothing to do with Buuhan. Piccolo/Goten/Trunks are not included for cosmetic reasons. I didn't want all crazy jumbled up numbers messing up my baby. It's know that Buu absorbs by addition. So obviously I didn't miscalculate, it is just to be easy on the eyes. Anyone could notice that I mean cmon really? Lol. Not to mention that the combined powers of Goten/Trunks/Piccolo is like 1% of Buuhan, but obviously you didn't pick up on that. Their powers are nothing. Which is why I chose cosmetic > Accuracy. But instead of asking me your trying to " get me ", learn some manner buddy , I am a grown up. You don't know how my fusion formula works yet you act as if your an expert and know it better than I do.... Man? What's with this guy? Is this the pre teen forum? I should probably stop coming here. Anyway... This is how my potara fusion works... Gohan 1 triillion Goku 20 biillion Goku's SSJ3 is not used in the fusion formula because it is not a controlled form Like i mentioned before. Goku 20 billion x 25 = 500 million. Now under regular fusion Base Gokan = 500 million = Base Gogeta Since Vegeta = Goku except for SSj3. Which would actually make base Gokan weaker than Gohan, but Gokan would surpass Gokan easily with his transformations. If a stronger fighter ( Gohan ) fuses with a really weak fighter ( Goku ) it is possible to result in a weaker fusion than the stronger fighter. This is implied by Goku about if he fuses with Hercule . However, with potara.... Potara has greater effects than fusion. And is able to access the stronger fighter's power that couldn't be accesed in regular fusion. So potara initially works as fusion.. Base Gokan = 500 million then the potara increases by adding Base Gokan = 500 million with Gohan who is 1 trillion. Potara will not allow for a weaker fusion than the stronger fighter. And there you have it. Your rudeness speaks volumes of your character by the way. Edited by p123, Nov 14 2010, 08:26 PM.
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