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ssj; what if its not a constant multiplier
Topic Started: Nov 5 2010, 04:49 AM (1,330 Views)
+ Pyrus
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When Base Goku, who had a Kili reading of 800, turned Super Saiyan, he had a Kili reading of 3,000. That's a 3.75x increase from Base, and that's where that multiplier comes from. The thing is, I'm not entirely sure if Goku was using full power, since he only went Super Saiyan to use its light output, not its power.
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+ Ryebrid
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Kili IS NOT energy

Your basing that off the fact that energy and kili are equal. Their not

We dont know anything about how kili is determined it just randomly pops out of nowhere.

And i dont even need to answer that, why would Goku be serious against a monster thats pathetically weak.
He was calm the whole time
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+ Pyrus
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I know it's not energy, I was just saying because it's the only thing we have.
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Wintergreen5000
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WCZE

Chief
Nov 5 2010, 06:04 PM
ILLusioNaire
Nov 5 2010, 04:35 PM
Kamikaze Pyro
Nov 5 2010, 08:19 AM
How do they? I don't understand how you got to that conclusion honestly. I mean, I'm not trying to be an *****, I'd actually like to know since I'm so confused right now, haha.

As for the topic, I go against the constant Super Saiyan multiplier in later arcs, specifically the Boo Arc where it seems Super Saiyan has the least boost in power IMO. During the Freeza Arc and up until the Cell Games, I have it at least 30x. After that, hoo boy, anything goes.
Yes, I agree. The multiplier certainly changes over the course of time, since much training is done while the Saiyans are in Super Saiyan, making the forms stronger, thus making the multiplier larger.

At Lunar: What the heck dude are you talking about? There is no way that base Saiyans, even 20 of them put together could be as strong as an SSjin 2.
Why do we all choose to look down on the actual fact that we should not be counting power levels after frieza arc. Yet u guys are hurting ur brains here trying to figure out each other's "OPINIONS".

How about WE DO NOT KNOW MULTIPLYER OR POWER LEVELS DURING BUU ARC, because it was never stated in the anime nor the mango.

Let's just go with who beat who and how hard was it...
This whole power level thing is really irritating.

As far as I can read I didn't give any kind of power levels... I'm just stating what is obvious. From what we've seen, Super Saiyan is stronger than base by 50 times, initially. If SSjin 2 is even twice as strong as SSjin, which it obviously isn't, even 20 Saiyans combined of the same initial base level would not be able to compete with one SSjin, nevermind an SSjin 2. It would take 100 Saiyans combined to match an SSjin 2, and this is what we KNOW, not THINK. However, this is to say that the multiplier didn't increase or decrease, which is not true. As we see from the Buu Arc, the Super Saiyan multiplier actually ends up decreasing for Goku, which means that he trained in his base state quite a bit.

Apart from this, there are various key notes that give us fans some indication to, not power levels, but to power differences. For instance, we can take notice of fights that occured during the first main arc and make a premise if you will by which to guage differences in later fights based off the performances we observe.
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Kingpin
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ILLusioNaire
Nov 6 2010, 05:54 AM
Chief
Nov 5 2010, 06:04 PM
ILLusioNaire
Nov 5 2010, 04:35 PM
Kamikaze Pyro
Nov 5 2010, 08:19 AM
How do they? I don't understand how you got to that conclusion honestly. I mean, I'm not trying to be an *****, I'd actually like to know since I'm so confused right now, haha.

As for the topic, I go against the constant Super Saiyan multiplier in later arcs, specifically the Boo Arc where it seems Super Saiyan has the least boost in power IMO. During the Freeza Arc and up until the Cell Games, I have it at least 30x. After that, hoo boy, anything goes.
Yes, I agree. The multiplier certainly changes over the course of time, since much training is done while the Saiyans are in Super Saiyan, making the forms stronger, thus making the multiplier larger.

At Lunar: What the heck dude are you talking about? There is no way that base Saiyans, even 20 of them put together could be as strong as an SSjin 2.
Why do we all choose to look down on the actual fact that we should not be counting power levels after frieza arc. Yet u guys are hurting ur brains here trying to figure out each other's "OPINIONS".

How about WE DO NOT KNOW MULTIPLYER OR POWER LEVELS DURING BUU ARC, because it was never stated in the anime nor the mango.

Let's just go with who beat who and how hard was it...
This whole power level thing is really irritating.

As far as I can read I didn't give any kind of power levels... I'm just stating what is obvious. From what we've seen, Super Saiyan is stronger than base by 50 times, initially. If SSjin 2 is even twice as strong as SSjin, which it obviously isn't, even 20 Saiyans combined of the same initial base level would not be able to compete with one SSjin, nevermind an SSjin 2. It would take 100 Saiyans combined to match an SSjin 2, and this is what we KNOW, not THINK. However, this is to say that the multiplier didn't increase or decrease, which is not true. As we see from the Buu Arc, the Super Saiyan multiplier actually ends up decreasing for Goku, which means that he trained in his base state quite a bit.

Apart from this, there are various key notes that give us fans some indication to, not power levels, but to power differences. For instance, we can take notice of fights that occured during the first main arc and make a premise if you will by which to guage differences in later fights based off the performances we observe.
This is all speculation so I care.
I've never heard of any kind of thing multiplyer till I read this post.

I have two question before I stop checking this post.
50x multiplyer for ssj1.... fact or opinion?
Multiplyer change for goku..... fact or opinion?
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Chief
 
Try learning facts instead of spurting out incorrect garbage based on your own personal and unexperienced opinions.

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+ Ryebrid
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50 x Multiplier = Fact

Multiplier Change = Complete fan made fiction
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Kingpin
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DbzHybrid
Nov 6 2010, 06:42 AM
50 x Multiplier = Fact

Multiplier Change = Complete fan made fiction
Thank you.

I wish I can say now we can stop this nonsense but I'm afraid that won't be the case.

Let's try not to recreate Dragonball z, and it's already done, Fights have all ready taken place.
Toriyamma stop counting power levels so why can't we?
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Chief
 
Try learning facts instead of spurting out incorrect garbage based on your own personal and unexperienced opinions.

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Kingpin
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I understand some peoples points and dilemma. Yes it's true, ssj2 doesn't seem like it was mulitiplyed by 50x but then again we don't have an exact number, here nobody does...... not even toriyamma.

What's happening here is that you guys are making up numbers and fighting so hard to convince each other that u are right,

How about we change from "thinking" that we are right to "accepting" we are wrong, because really aren't we all?
Honestly, who is right in this post.?
Edited by Kingpin, Nov 6 2010, 04:19 PM.
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Chief
 
Try learning facts instead of spurting out incorrect garbage based on your own personal and unexperienced opinions.

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Frankie
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Statistics are nothing. Super Saiyan can also depend on the amount of rage they feel, the moves they choose to use. Remember with some opponents Goku faced he used a sense of grace with them, since his heart is so soft :P
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lunar2
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hey, chief, why is it that every time you see a number in a topic, you go into your rant against trying to figure out whats going on? you are on a discussion forum, we are going to discuss what we think. if you dont want numbers to be involved in these discussions, then stay out of the ones that use them.
list of canon sources:

the DB manga, and the Dr. Slump manga as it applies to the crossover during the rra saga.

list of non canon sources:

everything else, regardless of origin, format, or quality.

for those that blindly follow word of god
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* -Zero-
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DbzHybrid
Nov 5 2010, 04:55 AM
I believe Akira said himself that it was a 50 x multiplier.

And hence the name "multiplier" its pretty obvious it is a multiplier and not addition LOL
Where did he say it was a multiplier? I don't seem to have any reason to think a Super Saiyan level would give them exactly x50.

Goku for example never really noticed much of a difference between SS and SS2 yet SS3 was like in an all new level.


Others like Gohan SS2 was noticeably very different from SS1.

I don't exactly recall the times that Goku went SS2 though, I'll have to rewatch the series, it's been a while.

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Im not sure LOL

Of course their power isnt constant and exact. Thats why i dont get why people try make power lvl list and whatever.
Scouters are outdated.
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Wintergreen5000
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WCZE

Chief
Nov 6 2010, 06:39 AM
ILLusioNaire
Nov 6 2010, 05:54 AM
Chief
Nov 5 2010, 06:04 PM
ILLusioNaire
Nov 5 2010, 04:35 PM
Kamikaze Pyro
Nov 5 2010, 08:19 AM
How do they? I don't understand how you got to that conclusion honestly. I mean, I'm not trying to be an *****, I'd actually like to know since I'm so confused right now, haha.

As for the topic, I go against the constant Super Saiyan multiplier in later arcs, specifically the Boo Arc where it seems Super Saiyan has the least boost in power IMO. During the Freeza Arc and up until the Cell Games, I have it at least 30x. After that, hoo boy, anything goes.
Yes, I agree. The multiplier certainly changes over the course of time, since much training is done while the Saiyans are in Super Saiyan, making the forms stronger, thus making the multiplier larger.

At Lunar: What the heck dude are you talking about? There is no way that base Saiyans, even 20 of them put together could be as strong as an SSjin 2.
Why do we all choose to look down on the actual fact that we should not be counting power levels after frieza arc. Yet u guys are hurting ur brains here trying to figure out each other's "OPINIONS".

How about WE DO NOT KNOW MULTIPLYER OR POWER LEVELS DURING BUU ARC, because it was never stated in the anime nor the mango.

Let's just go with who beat who and how hard was it...
This whole power level thing is really irritating.

As far as I can read I didn't give any kind of power levels... I'm just stating what is obvious. From what we've seen, Super Saiyan is stronger than base by 50 times, initially. If SSjin 2 is even twice as strong as SSjin, which it obviously isn't, even 20 Saiyans combined of the same initial base level would not be able to compete with one SSjin, nevermind an SSjin 2. It would take 100 Saiyans combined to match an SSjin 2, and this is what we KNOW, not THINK. However, this is to say that the multiplier didn't increase or decrease, which is not true. As we see from the Buu Arc, the Super Saiyan multiplier actually ends up decreasing for Goku, which means that he trained in his base state quite a bit.

Apart from this, there are various key notes that give us fans some indication to, not power levels, but to power differences. For instance, we can take notice of fights that occured during the first main arc and make a premise if you will by which to guage differences in later fights based off the performances we observe.
This is all speculation so I care.
I've never heard of any kind of thing multiplyer till I read this post.

I have two question before I stop checking this post.
50x multiplyer for ssj1.... fact or opinion?
Multiplyer change for goku..... fact or opinion?
If you train while in SSjin you will become a stronger SSjin. Can we agree on this? Okay. If you become a stronger SSjin than what you were before...then that means that the multiplier for SSjin has been increased. I mean, I don't need to prove this really, it's common sense. It's not a matter of opinion here. It did happen. The 50X multiplier itself comes from the Daizenshuu. Whether you want to believe that or not is up to you. I'm just using it as an example. Now, obviously we can't know for sure the multipliers during the Cell Game, and we can't know power levels for sure. But so what? We do what we do because we are fans.
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Kingpin
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lunar2
Nov 7 2010, 06:05 AM
hey, chief, why is it that every time you see a number in a topic, you go into your rant against trying to figure out whats going on? you are on a discussion forum, we are going to discuss what we think. if you dont want numbers to be involved in these discussions, then stay out of the ones that use them.
Because it is outdated and is not fully supported by any facts.

But in all honesty, do you believe that saying yamcha had a power level of 500,000 was a foolish and irresponsible statement?
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Chief
 
Try learning facts instead of spurting out incorrect garbage based on your own personal and unexperienced opinions.

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Kingpin
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DbzHybrid
Nov 7 2010, 12:25 PM
Im not sure LOL

Of course their power isnt constant and exact. Thats why i dont get why people try make power lvl list and whatever.
Scouters are outdated.
(Reaches out my hand to shake yours in respect and agreement).
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Chief
 
Try learning facts instead of spurting out incorrect garbage based on your own personal and unexperienced opinions.

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