Please INTERPRET/CLUE ME IN ON VAGETA (DBZ)

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Please INTERPRET/CLUE ME IN ON VAGETA (DBZ); I joined to post this
Tweet Topic Started: Oct 26 2008, 12:10 AM (451 Views)
XxNeXuSxX	Oct 26 2008, 12:10 AM Post #1
Posts: 3 Group: New Member Member #3,768 Joined: October 25, 2008 Favourite Anime DBZ What Browser do you use? Firefox	Sorry if this is in the wrong forum, feel free to direct it as you wish Way back, I was just re-watching the entire series as it was presented on television. Obviously I was still a little exasperated on how poor Sabat cast Vageta on his first episode (seemed like he was trying to emulate Drummond farr to hard)/ But that's not the point, let me get on with the topic: Between episodes 91 and 92, the conclusion of the Freiza Saga, there's something that appears to be a glaring plot hole (moreso than usual ones by 10x). Both are funimation dubbed, originals. Anyway, during episode 91, Vageta is cheeting that Kakarot and Freiza out of the way because he's now the strongest fighter in the universe, and laughed at any attempts to get him back. Vageta was then talking about how everyone there was going to bow down to him and serve him and so forth. This angered Gohan so he charged him and they began to fight... Vageta eventually knocked him down and was going to kill him until Piccolo stopped him. Vageta then FLEW away... concluding the episode. Then in episode 92, it begins suddenly with Vageta (magically back) leaning against a tree. He interrupts everyone's worries and offers a solution on how to get Kakarot back (You know, despite celebrating his despise because he's the most powerful. Direct contradiction). This is followed by (a now completely undamaged Gohan) approaching Vageta, thanking him and attempting to shake his hand (you know, despite nearly being killed by him allegedly a minute before that). Then the previously scared sh*tless Bulma of Vageta in 91 hits on Vageta in 92. WTF?



* -Zero-	Oct 26 2008, 02:44 AM Post #2
Black Knight Posts: 8,697 Group: Retired Staff Member #1,874 Joined: November 5, 2006 Favourite Anime Code Geass, Death Note, Dragonball/Z	HAHAHAHA. I was like you with wtf. Indeed that was a major plothole by toei when they created the anime. To make myself feel better I simply tell myself that Vegeta vs. Gohan thing was vegeta day dreaming of what could happen lmao
	Thanks to Kid Buu for the sig! The story where DBZF Members are the characters! DBZF:The Unknown Conspiracy POSITIVE ZERO PRODUCTIONS ZeroGuild Forum!


~~Frankie~~	Oct 26 2008, 06:13 PM Post #3
Posts: 573 Group: GTFO Member #593 Joined: August 8, 2005	That is a plot hole. Its like Vegeta Evil then suddenly Good. Its weeeeird. But yeah, same time around when Bulma and Vegeta were getting it on too. Conciedence? Cheeeyahhh.



Larxene	Oct 26 2008, 08:12 PM Post #4
Posts: 411 Group: Member Member #3,762 Joined: October 21, 2008 Favourite Anime Dragonball, Yu Yu Hakusho Favourite Manga Eyeshield 21, NANA, Count Cain	Animation company's fault. Lol filler. Plotholes are nothing new with Toei. Let's see if I can make something up to explain this.... Um.. Vegeta's pride was hit very hard at that point. He was acting like an arrogant jerk, but deep down he was pissed at himself and, imo, this is when he began to develop a certain amount of respect for Goku(at least as a fellow sayian). He says a lot of irrational things when he feels that way: 1) When he was fighting Recoome, he felt as if he should "just quit"(Let me know if this is a mistranslation of what he said, I read a very poorly translated scanlation) 2) When Goku was killed after Gohan fought Cell, he said he would "never fight again" I guess he needs time to come to his senses. Bulma, I have no idea. This is the same woman who brought her baby to see the arrival of deadly androids.



XxNeXuSxX	Oct 26 2008, 11:38 PM Post #5
Posts: 3 Group: New Member Member #3,768 Joined: October 25, 2008 Favourite Anime DBZ What Browser do you use? Firefox	Ah okay, well it's good to know it was Toei and not an awkward cut by Funi or something. Why wouldn't Toei watch their episodes before releasing them?! Ridiculous! The ep.91 Vageta seemed a lot more natural that he would take over Earth at that point, but the ep.92 Vageta decided to just "hang around" for 131 days before realizing that he wasn't even training. I can't explain anything at all in this episode and I had to stop watching at that point because my head was going to explode from the million plot holes. Edited by XxNeXuSxX, Oct 26 2008, 11:40 PM.



* -Zero-	Oct 26 2008, 11:44 PM Post #6
Black Knight Posts: 8,697 Group: Retired Staff Member #1,874 Joined: November 5, 2006 Favourite Anime Code Geass, Death Note, Dragonball/Z	There is another episode in the buu saga with a plot hole. When earth is restored back and Goku and Kid Buu are fighting in the kai planet, we see Picollo and Gohan on a mountain thing then they go to the lookout, next episode they are back at the mountain thing. LMAO
	Thanks to Kid Buu for the sig! The story where DBZF Members are the characters! DBZF:The Unknown Conspiracy POSITIVE ZERO PRODUCTIONS ZeroGuild Forum!


Larxene	Oct 27 2008, 10:12 PM Post #7
Posts: 411 Group: Member Member #3,762 Joined: October 21, 2008 Favourite Anime Dragonball, Yu Yu Hakusho Favourite Manga Eyeshield 21, NANA, Count Cain	XxNeXuSxX Oct 26 2008, 11:38 PM Ah okay, well it's good to know it was Toei and not an awkward cut by Funi or something. Why wouldn't Toei watch their episodes before releasing them?! Ridiculous! The ep.91 Vageta seemed a lot more natural that he would take over Earth at that point, but the ep.92 Vageta decided to just "hang around" for 131 days before realizing that he wasn't even training. I can't explain anything at all in this episode and I had to stop watching at that point because my head was going to explode from the million plot holes. Most anime filler episodes turn out this way. Their only purpose is to stall the anime, so the manga can catch up, so you really won't miss much if you skip them. They probably have to make this stuff up on the spot, so I'm sure they don't bother looking for plotholes. That's why I read the manga first. It goes so much faster and they're aren't any pointless scenes.



$	Nov 2 2008, 08:23 PM Post #8
Posts: 9 Group: New Member Member #3,779 Joined: October 30, 2008 What Browser do you use? IE	So in the manga what is the reasons for Vegeta not destroying/taking over earth? Or was his threat to destroy it/take it over, during the Frieza saga even in the manga? Probably just all anime filler lolol.. Either way one thing that, although I have no proof, that kinda makes sense to me is... one of the main reasons Vegeta may have been able to attain SSJ was he calmed down and came more content with his power rather than wanting it for evil. May be he achieved it because he decided not to use it for evil, but instead he just wanted to be the strongest Sayain in the galaxy. I have no proof of this, however, but it makes sense to me, as after he attained it he mostly stayed on the good side besides his incident with Babidi. For all I know though he just attained it through hard work etc. etc. too lol Edited by $, Nov 2 2008, 08:24 PM.



Larxene	Nov 3 2008, 12:56 AM Post #9
Posts: 411 Group: Member Member #3,762 Joined: October 21, 2008 Favourite Anime Dragonball, Yu Yu Hakusho Favourite Manga Eyeshield 21, NANA, Count Cain	$ Nov 2 2008, 08:23 PM So in the manga what is the reasons for Vegeta not destroying/taking over earth? Or was his threat to destroy it/take it over, during the Frieza saga even in the manga? Probably just all anime filler lolol.. Either way one thing that, although I have no proof, that kinda makes sense to me is... one of the main reasons Vegeta may have been able to attain SSJ was he calmed down and came more content with his power rather than wanting it for evil. May be he achieved it because he decided not to use it for evil, but instead he just wanted to be the strongest Sayain in the galaxy. I have no proof of this, however, but it makes sense to me, as after he attained it he mostly stayed on the good side besides his incident with Babidi. For all I know though he just attained it through hard work etc. etc. too lol His threat wasn't in the manga at all. By this point in the manga he was probably still trying to grasp the fact that a low class sayian was able to surpass him. It was a huge blow to his pride so I think the only thing on his mind at this point was becoming stronger and reaching SSJ level. He'd wouldn't be content if he had just taken over Earth, there was still a being out there who is stronger than him and until he surpassed that being, he'd never heal his wounded pride. I think that's why he wanted them to revive Goku. So he could fight him again and defeat him. Anyway.. I realized something recently that might help explain this "plot-hole" in the anime. This is very similar to the anime version of Vegeta's reaction to Trunks' death in the Cell saga. When Trunks was killed by Cell in the anime, he said "What was I doing back there, I should have been the one to surpass Cell." But Trunks' death was clearly what had enraged him. Vegeta was just hiding behind his "Prince of all Saiya-jins" mantra. He was blaming himself for his son's death, but he refused to admit he actually cared about the life of another person. He may not have even realized it himself. It's probably the same idea with his boast about taking over the Earth. His pride was hit very hard and so be began to brag to cover up those emotions. It's obviously more direct in the manga with both cases, but I actually like what they did now that I think about it. It adds to Vegeta's character I think. ...And to answer your second question, apparently Vegeta was able to become a SSJ because his heart was "pure evil." He wanted nothing more than to become stronger so his heart was "pure" in a sense. By this point he still didn't care about the lives of his family(he didn't even try to save them when Gero blew up Bulma's plane) It wasn't until he spent time with Trunks that he started to care about them.



Emperor Cold	Nov 3 2008, 02:18 AM Post #10
Makaioshin Posts: 317 Group: Member Member #3,724 Joined: October 5, 2008 Favourite Anime Dragonball/Z/GT (yes I like GT...imagine that!) Detective Conan, FMA (original), Yu Yu Hakusho Favourite Manga Anything by Akira Toriyama	x_bulla_x Nov 3 2008, 12:56 AM $ Nov 2 2008, 08:23 PM So in the manga what is the reasons for Vegeta not destroying/taking over earth? Or was his threat to destroy it/take it over, during the Frieza saga even in the manga? Probably just all anime filler lolol.. Either way one thing that, although I have no proof, that kinda makes sense to me is... one of the main reasons Vegeta may have been able to attain SSJ was he calmed down and came more content with his power rather than wanting it for evil. May be he achieved it because he decided not to use it for evil, but instead he just wanted to be the strongest Sayain in the galaxy. I have no proof of this, however, but it makes sense to me, as after he attained it he mostly stayed on the good side besides his incident with Babidi. For all I know though he just attained it through hard work etc. etc. too lol His threat wasn't in the manga at all. By this point in the manga he was probably still trying to grasp the fact that a low class sayian was able to surpass him. It was a huge blow to his pride so I think the only thing on his mind at this point was becoming stronger and reaching SSJ level. He'd wouldn't be content if he had just taken over Earth, there was still a being out there who is stronger than him and until he surpassed that being, he'd never heal his wounded pride. I think that's why he wanted them to revive Goku. So he could fight him again and defeat him. Anyway.. I realized something recently that might help explain this "plot-hole" in the anime. This is very similar to the anime version of Vegeta's reaction to Trunks' death in the Cell saga. When Trunks was killed by Cell in the anime, he said "What was I doing back there, I should have been the one to surpass Cell." But Trunks' death was clearly what had enraged him. Vegeta was just hiding behind his "Prince of all Saiya-jins" mantra. He was blaming himself for his son's death, but he refused to admit he actually cared about the life of another person. He may not have even realized it himself. It's probably the same idea with his boast about taking over the Earth. His pride was hit very hard and so be began to brag to cover up those emotions. It's obviously more direct in the manga with both cases, but I actually like what they did now that I think about it. It adds to Vegeta's character I think. ...And to answer your second question, apparently Vegeta was able to become a SSJ because his heart was "pure evil." He wanted nothing more than to become stronger so his heart was "pure" in a sense. By this point he still didn't care about the lives of his family(he didn't even try to save them when Gero blew up Bulma's plane) It wasn't until he spent time with Trunks that he started to care about them. That still doesn't explain the fact that he flew away and appeared back lol.



$	Nov 3 2008, 02:44 AM Post #11
Posts: 9 Group: New Member Member #3,779 Joined: October 30, 2008 What Browser do you use? IE	Oh alright... I knew it had something to do with him being pure..



Larxene	Nov 3 2008, 05:49 AM Post #12
Posts: 411 Group: Member Member #3,762 Joined: October 21, 2008 Favourite Anime Dragonball, Yu Yu Hakusho Favourite Manga Eyeshield 21, NANA, Count Cain	Emperor Cold Nov 3 2008, 02:18 AM x_bulla_x Nov 3 2008, 12:56 AM $ Nov 2 2008, 08:23 PM So in the manga what is the reasons for Vegeta not destroying/taking over earth? Or was his threat to destroy it/take it over, during the Frieza saga even in the manga? Probably just all anime filler lolol.. Either way one thing that, although I have no proof, that kinda makes sense to me is... one of the main reasons Vegeta may have been able to attain SSJ was he calmed down and came more content with his power rather than wanting it for evil. May be he achieved it because he decided not to use it for evil, but instead he just wanted to be the strongest Sayain in the galaxy. I have no proof of this, however, but it makes sense to me, as after he attained it he mostly stayed on the good side besides his incident with Babidi. For all I know though he just attained it through hard work etc. etc. too lol His threat wasn't in the manga at all. By this point in the manga he was probably still trying to grasp the fact that a low class sayian was able to surpass him. It was a huge blow to his pride so I think the only thing on his mind at this point was becoming stronger and reaching SSJ level. He'd wouldn't be content if he had just taken over Earth, there was still a being out there who is stronger than him and until he surpassed that being, he'd never heal his wounded pride. I think that's why he wanted them to revive Goku. So he could fight him again and defeat him. Anyway.. I realized something recently that might help explain this "plot-hole" in the anime. This is very similar to the anime version of Vegeta's reaction to Trunks' death in the Cell saga. When Trunks was killed by Cell in the anime, he said "What was I doing back there, I should have been the one to surpass Cell." But Trunks' death was clearly what had enraged him. Vegeta was just hiding behind his "Prince of all Saiya-jins" mantra. He was blaming himself for his son's death, but he refused to admit he actually cared about the life of another person. He may not have even realized it himself. It's probably the same idea with his boast about taking over the Earth. His pride was hit very hard and so be began to brag to cover up those emotions. It's obviously more direct in the manga with both cases, but I actually like what they did now that I think about it. It adds to Vegeta's character I think. ...And to answer your second question, apparently Vegeta was able to become a SSJ because his heart was "pure evil." He wanted nothing more than to become stronger so his heart was "pure" in a sense. By this point he still didn't care about the lives of his family(he didn't even try to save them when Gero blew up Bulma's plane) It wasn't until he spent time with Trunks that he started to care about them. That still doesn't explain the fact that he flew away and appeared back lol. I guess he just came back off-screen after he cooled down. That's all I can think of.



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