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| USA Election 2008; Obama vs McCain | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Jun 14 2008, 08:28 PM (2,093 Views) | |
| + Rebel X | Oct 4 2008, 08:04 PM Post #31 |
 
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The recent Vice Presidential Debate is something u can update ur thoughts on. not sure if it changed peoples mind or made them moe confused but it always causes a stir. There are many more debate left in this season, so watch them. |
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| Famicommander | Oct 6 2008, 04:25 AM Post #32 |
Jukebox hero
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I'm voting for John McCain, even though it hurts me to see how far the GOP has fallen since Reagan. I'm actually a Libertarian, but Bob Barr is the worst candidate they've ever nominated and I would much rather see a NeoCon in office than a Socialist (Obama). This economic crisis was created out of government intervention and regulation. Obama wants more of it. I am of the opinion that everyone involved in the government is incompetent, and I therefore want them to have as little impact on my everyday life as possible. Also, Barack Obama advocates partial birth abortion. For those who aren't familiar with the procedure, it's when they wait for the baby's head to crown, then drill a hole in it and suck out the brains and stem cells. No, I'm not making it up. And yes, Obama did vote in favor of it. There is no excuse for such a procedure and to call it anything less than murder is blasphemy. |
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| Famicommander | Oct 6 2008, 04:28 AM Post #33 |
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You do know that Congress, which is currently controlled by the Democrats, has a lower approval rating than President Bush? This shouldn't be about political parties. George W. Bush is not the same person as Senator McCain. McCain actually ran against Bush in 2000. |
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| Meowth | Oct 6 2008, 07:08 AM Post #34 |
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McCain will do most of the things Bush does, it will just be a mess again, nothing will change. It's not like he's going to change much, he is running as the Republican candidate, no matter what his values are going to be in the intrest of any Republican politician. It's like over here, David Camron might be a new face and promote intresting policies but he's the Conservative leader and a Conservative govenment over here will push the same Conservative values. The US need a change, infact maybe a totally new change, nither the Democrats or Republicans, a totally new face would be great, won't happen though. As well as McCain being far too old, he doesn't seem like he'll last the whole of his time, so you'll end up with Sarah Palin, who seems a little insane to say the least. It's going to look all democratic and fair but the rality is it's going to be another 4 years of a Republican govenment through verious forms of rigging. It'll be as fair as the Zimbabwian elections were this year, without all the violance. Why not just change to a Dictatorship as oppose to pretending to be democratic? Surly much easier. 
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| Rockman | Oct 6 2008, 11:51 AM Post #35 |
hoighty-toighty
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That's so backwards. You say you're libertarian but you're voting for McCain. That's by far the biggest load of crap I've heard in the recent days. I'm going to take a venture and say that you don't quite fully understand what being Libertarian truly is about. Just because Bob Barr is the nominee, that doesn't change the face of the Libertarian party. Your vote for McCain is a vote for all of the Christian values that hinder our world. There is no personal liberty with John McCain, other than the right to own guns. Which might I add is a load of *****. You're for the right to bear arms, so your okay with serial killers being able to own them. However killing an unborn to save another persons life is wrong? You really need to check where your priorities lie and quit claiming to have wanted to vote for Bob Barr as if it would make you look better now that you're voting for McCain. It doesn't, it makes you look like a hypocrite, and very wrong. For you not to care about anything else but your personal opinions and morals is anything else BUT Libertarianism.
Wrong, the crisis is due to the housing lenders. Everyone and their dog knows that.
Oh so, you'd want the libertarian mind set of government, (less), but you're voting for McCain. I call Bull*****. Well it's too late, you're voting for McCain. If he get's president you'll have to live with your mistake. Which by the way is a change to nothing, wrapped in nothing. A maverick of "the way things are" is more like it. Personally, I'd rather have the wrong candidate running with all the right values that the Libertarian holds dear, than vote for one of your sideways politicians. Who don't have real debates, who take money from companies like Exxon, who would like my freedom and liberty to be thrown away at the cost of making Christians happy first, who aren't really sure of how to get us out of the economic crisis. Even though he would never win, at least I can stand here and say I told you so. Oh and about my freedoms and liberties being thrown away at the cost of making Christians happy first, you all wouldn't know this because you are already blind to it. The majority are going to take sides with the Christian values and toss my views aside anyway because that's the way it is. |
 JAke is a copyright of Spazo and Pickle Flavored Fudge Pops inc. | |
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| Meowth | Oct 6 2008, 01:40 PM Post #36 |
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As well as banks lending money to people they know can't pay it back and transfering bad money to other banks to balence their own books. |
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| Famicommander | Oct 6 2008, 04:03 PM Post #37 |
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@Kotetsu ". You're for the right to bear arms, so your okay with serial killers being able to own them. However killing an unborn to save another persons life is wrong? You really need to check where your priorities lie and quit claiming to have wanted to vote for Bob Barr as if it would make you look better now that you're voting for McCain. It doesn't, it makes you look like a hypocrite, and very wrong." Libertarians are more pro-guns than Republicans. Bob Barr is pro life as well. "For you not to care about anything else but your personal opinions and morals is anything else BUT Libertarianism." Incorrect. Libertarianism is about personal responsibility and freedom. "Wrong, the crisis is due to the housing lenders. Everyone and their dog knows that." Yes. And the government passed legislation which allowed banks to give loans to people who couldn't afford it, and also to borrow money from other banks so that they could give out loans to people. That, coupled with the Federal Reserve printing money out of nowhere, is why we're in this crisis. I suggest you read into a situation before embarrassing yourself. The government sponsored the creation of Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae, then took it over when it failed. "Oh so, you'd want the libertarian mind set of government, (less), but you're voting for McCain. I call Bull*****." I've already said that McCain is not my ideal candidate. But Socialism (Obama) is the antithesis of small government. "Oh and about my freedoms and liberties being thrown away at the cost of making Christians happy first, you all wouldn't know this because you are already blind to it." And how would McCain be putting Christians first? By being pro-life? Sorry, but valuing human life is not universally Christian. And how about homosexual marriage? McCain personally disagrees with it, but thinks that the legality of it should be decided at a state level, just as the Constitution dicates (all social matters not explicitly outlined in the Constitution shall be a power reserved for the states). It seems that you're the one who has no idea what Libertarianism is about. I would've voted for Ron Paul, but since he's no longer running I had to settle. And if I'm going to settle, I may as well settle for someone who has a chance to win and keep a socialist out of office |
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| Meowth | Oct 6 2008, 05:16 PM Post #38 |
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As well as abolishing or minimizing the state, which isn't a bad thing in a sense, depends how you want to view it.
Well, the govenment does need to intervien at this kind of economic crisis, I mean it's not a problem that is just affecting the US, it's affecting every country. If you don't have govenment intervention, you are just going to fall harder, you can't just ride out an economic crisis and expect everything to be okay. I dunno what the US view on govenement intervention is though, but people here want the govenement to do more, such as guarantiying an unlimited ammount of savings if the bank it's in fails. At the moment, it's going to be raised up to £50k, as well as people wanting to see intrest rates come down, but that aside since this topic isn't about the economic crisis.
Vote for an indepentent that you agree with? I mean, socialism isn't a bad idioligy in my view, but it depends on the form of socialism you are talking about, if you are talking about Socialist Democrat then there is nothing really wrong with that, the UK Labour Party are Socialist Democrats, personally I don't see anything wrong with that idiology.
Do share why you don't like socialisem, please. Also, don't you want free healthcare? 
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| Famicommander | Oct 6 2008, 09:41 PM Post #39 |
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"Well, the government does need to intervien at this kind of economic crisis, I mean it's not a problem that is just affecting the US, it's affecting every country. If you don't have government intervention, you are just going to fall harder, you can't just ride out an economic crisis and expect everything to be okay." No. Bailing them out now is setting them up for an even greater loss in the future. The problem was created out of government regulation. More regulation is always a bad thing. The free market will eventually correct the problem on its own. Capitalism without loss is not capitalism at all. "Vote for an indepentent that you agree with? I mean, socialism isn't a bad idioligy in my view, but it depends on the form of socialism you are talking about, if you are talking about Socialist Democrat then there is nothing really wrong with that, the UK Labour Party are Socialist Democrats, personally I don't see anything wrong with that idiology." Socialism is immoral. It punishes success and takes from the people what they rightfully earn. The freer the market, the freer the people. The government should be limited to protecting the rights of its citizens. Nothing more. Socialism was termed by Karl Marx himself as a stepping-stone to Communism.' "Also, don't you want free healthcare?" There is no such thing as free health care. Before the government was involved in the health care in the United States, it was the cheapest and the highest quality in the world. Since the government got involved, prices have skyrocketed. If they get involved further, quality will plummet. Free market competition ensures high quality at low prices. |
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| Meowth | Oct 7 2008, 05:55 AM Post #40 |
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Because we all know how bad England is right now don't we? Socialist democracy totally isn't working out for us over here lolol. It works fine over here. I mean, it's much better than a Conservative govenment who make the rich richer while the poor get poorer. Oh I see now, you can't stand communism but still, socialism doesn't become communism unless the country votes for a communist govenment. Labour are Socialist Democrats, I say that again because they aren't full on socialists, which I doubt Obama is, he might share some socialist values but not all.
Cheapest being free? I don't think it was ever free there, our healthcare is free unless you want to say that paying tax means that it isn't free but we don't have health bills if you need to go to the hospital for something that will treat you. I mean private/commercial healthcare is okay but what if you are poor and can only just afford to heat your home? You can't really pay a hospital bill for say an infected leg from falling over, though I don't know much about US healthcare, do you have to pay for treatment if you've been in an accident? You don't over here. |
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| Famicommander | Oct 7 2008, 07:02 AM Post #41 |
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Jukebox hero
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It seems you don't have even a basic understanding of the Austrian school of economics or free market capitalism in general... |
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| Meowth | Oct 7 2008, 01:29 PM Post #42 |
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It's you I don't understand, it's like you're voting for someone who isn't going to change much if anything about the country, you'll go through another four years of the same thing. Or say McCain dies of a heart attack because he's old and such, you'll be stuck with Sarah Palin who really doesn't seem like a very good leader, I actually think she'd be worst than McCain as President. That aside, I can't see what I said about economics that you where refering to, I was talking about healthcare, you didn't answer my question about that. Does it cost money in the US to get emergancy treatment on a leg infection? If the answer is yes, then America doesn't have a very good health system because if someone poor cuts their leg and it gets badly infected, they will need emergancy tratement, but if they can't afford it then they have to live with a bad leg and even the possiblity of the infection spreading. Over here, treatment in an NHS hospital is free, as in you don't pay anything, the NHS is supported by tax payer money. I mean, any treatment is free on the NHS except cosmetic. So, if you do have to pay, is that really fair on those families who can't afford the healthcare? No, it isn't. |
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| Guinness420 | Oct 7 2008, 02:01 PM Post #43 |
 
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I don't support McCain for reason in my opinion. You should know about his Keating Five Scandal. I'm more pro-Obama. |
'Cripplin Necks, Cutting Throats, & Crackin Knucklez from 1967-2007, R.I.P Chris Benoit -- The Crippler & The Rabid Wolverine'
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| Rockman | Oct 7 2008, 04:32 PM Post #44 |
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Yes, about healthcare. I have the option to pay 415$ a month to receive health care. In which case I have good health to start with, and I don't smoke. So tell me, now that I don't have healthcare, if I cut myself wide open or develop cancer or some other ailment that has an indirect cause. Where will I be then? SOL is the correct answer. I can't afford health care as a student. I'm not sure how better to explain this. You say free economy will lower prices of health care, but all I see is a 415$ price tag. You do the math and tell ME how I'm supposed to deal. |
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JAke is a copyright of Spazo and Pickle Flavored Fudge Pops inc. | |
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Oct 16 2008, 01:46 AM Post #45 |
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Does anyone have an opinion on tonight's debate? It's not over yet here, but personally, I've made up my mind. I made up my mind a long time ago and my candidate can do no wrong at this point. |
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