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Transgender children
Topic Started: Mar 9 2018, 02:19 AM (3,412 Views)
Ice
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Do you guys think children should be able to transition? Why/why not? I just watched a few videos about it and now i personally don't think they should be able to because:
-it changes your body a lot(some changes are pernament)
-it sterilizes you
-theres lots of health risks going off hormones.

Children are too young to make such a big decision, imo.
Edited by Ice, Mar 9 2018, 09:22 AM.
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I agree that they're too young to make such a choice, they're still trying to figure out who they are. Seems wrong to allow them to do that.
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Those risks you mentioned don't go away with age. And if they want to transition, they aren't going to get off their hormones.
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Tinny
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It varies from parent to parent, and I think this is one part where legislation should back off, at least until the children are old enough. Parents are ultimately the guardians of their children and should be able to tell if they can or can't, maybe you bring in a doctor to tell if the kid is ready for the stuff transitioning entails mentally and/or physically, but aside from that I wouldn't say that there is any danger to a kid being trans. Just depends on what the parents think on a case by case basis like most things.
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Why would parents be in charge of making a medical decision that they are completely untrained for? There's also no 'maybe' about whether you bring in a doctor or not; a doctor's office should be the first port of call for anybody who believes they may be transgendered, the same as you would for any other medical issue.

For me, I think that children are too young to consider the implications of a decision like that. Surely the most healthy thing to do would be to let them do what they want to do regardless of enforced stereotypes, rather than have parents thinking 'oh s***, my son likes dolls, must be transgendered'. If that happens, are you telling me that kids aren't impressionable enough to think 'oh, my mummy and daddy said I'm not supposed to be a boy, they're probably right'? Plus, you also have the danger of if a parent wanted a boy/girl, had the opposite gender, and may convince their child they are transgendered. Again, children are impressionable and will listen to their parents.

I'm not saying that there aren't people who knew from a very young age that they were transgendered because I know that it's common. But there are also many children out there who are just 'tomboys', or the equivalent term for males (not sure there is one), and in those cases they just need to be left to their own devices as they grow up.
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I think parents should support their children in all of their endeavors no matter what. A child wouldn't ask for a transition until they understood the consequences anyway, and if they still want to go through with it when they do understand it, I think the support should be 100%.
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Greetings. I will be your waifu this season.

Yeah, I completely disagree with medical transitions in children.

A fair amount of people change their mind after they switch sex, not that many but enough that I have a hard time believing absolutely everyone "knows" they're the wrong sex. We all "know" things but completely change our minds, especially as children.

If you have a boy that feels it's actually a girl, raise it like one until it's 16-18 and can make an informed decision on a medical transition.
A lot of children go through weird phases, it's not outlandish to be careful that this may be one of them when plenty people regret it. Sometimes people are just lost and need to figure out their own mind, switching sexes is no casual affair.


Personally I have a hard time believing any children are really transgender, except in maybe some rare cases, I believe it's something that develops as you do, the same way sexuality does.
Children are concerned with being children and often weird fantasies come with that.
Plenty parents seem to think "He plays with dolls...he's actually a girl?" and probably plant that seed in their head, perhaps not on purpose but children are easily influenced.
If you're lightly suggesting your boy might actually be a girl there's a good chance they'll grow up thinking it's wrong that they're a boy and that will influence their personality as such.


Ideally in my opinion a child should just know that it will have support from it's family in however it feels, so that they're not going to suppress any feelings or desires or be needlessly influenced down a path that may not be for them.
If there's never a proverbial closet to hide in to begin with there's not going to be any issues.

Sexuality, gender and personalities in general are very complex.
A boy might love to play with girly toys and wear girl clothes, maybe even talk like a girl but might still be heterosexual and still consider themselves male, it's stupid to jump to conclusions.
The whole "I know my child" thing is a stupid angle since this is hardly a "normal" easily understood thing that everyone has deep experience with.
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This is one thing I will absolutely not agree with.

Who the hell cares if those issues don't go away with age? Who cares if a kid has 'weighed out the options'? It's still a kid, who lacks full maturity and development. That could severely mess them up later if they regret it.

They want to be the opposite gender? Fine. Let them do it without surgery or professional assistance, for the time being at least.

There's also the fact that they could become a laughingstock in school.
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Mar 9 2018, 01:06 PM
There's also the fact that they could become a laughingstock in school.
That shouldn't really come into it. Lots of things can cause a child to be the target of bullying by other children. Kids get bullied for working hard at school; should kids not bother trying hard to avoid bullying?
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I had a feeling someone would say that. I wasn't going to mention it, because it seems like a weak argument, but that's only the tip of the iceberg, not the basis for my issue with this scenario.
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Greetings. I will be your waifu this season.

Hmm, it is a touchy subject though since it's not just "Haha you have goofy teeth" or something relatively innocuous, being bullied for something so deeply personal could definitely cause some psychological issues later down the line.

But then suppressing it and hiding it for fear of that also causes issues.

Not sure which is worse.


I think that's something that can't really be dealt with until schools/society understand all this more, it's all well and good if they're willing to put "Miss" instead of "Mr" on the school register and teach kids about it in general but the potential trans kid is still going to get beat up outside of school for being different, most likely.
Not really sure how that could be tackled directly, obviously the earlier children learn about these things the less likely they are to have adverse reactions to them but it'd be a bit weird to be giving nursery kids explanations on all that.

And then there's the issue of parents, no matter how progressive a school is ignorant parents will teach them backwards info.


Guess it would just depend on the situation, how confident the child is and what school life is like etc etc
All in all I think it'd still be best to not touch upon it much until the kid is a teenager, just make it known that they can talk about anything bothering them. By that point they might be developed enough to not be warped by any bullying.

Or there could just be no bullying at all but, children :rofl:
Edited by Steve, Mar 9 2018, 03:09 PM.
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Mar 9 2018, 01:20 PM
but that's only the tip of the iceberg, not the basis for my issue with this scenario.
Yeah, I understand that. I just thought it was worth pointing out that people shouldn't bow to bullying.

@Steve - But the scenarios we've been talking about, of letting children buck stereotypes without saying 'that must mean they're trangendered', could still possibly lead to bullying. Kids bully those they perceive as different; if a boy comes to school wearing pink or with a barbie backpack, or a girl with short hair who plays sports, there's a possibility they'd be a target of bullying. Bullying isn't really a relevant part of the discussion we're having.
Edited by Mitas, Mar 9 2018, 03:16 PM.
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Mitas
Mar 9 2018, 08:54 AM
Why would parents be in charge of making a medical decision that they are completely untrained for? There's also no 'maybe' about whether you bring in a doctor or not; a doctor's office should be the first port of call for anybody who believes they may be transgendered, the same as you would for any other medical issue.

For me, I think that children are too young to consider the implications of a decision like that. Surely the most healthy thing to do would be to let them do what they want to do regardless of enforced stereotypes, rather than have parents thinking 'oh s***, my son likes dolls, must be transgendered'. If that happens, are you telling me that kids aren't impressionable enough to think 'oh, my mummy and daddy said I'm not supposed to be a boy, they're probably right'? Plus, you also have the danger of if a parent wanted a boy/girl, had the opposite gender, and may convince their child they are transgendered. Again, children are impressionable and will listen to their parents.

I'm not saying that there aren't people who knew from a very young age that they were transgendered because I know that it's common. But there are also many children out there who are just 'tomboys', or the equivalent term for males (not sure there is one), and in those cases they just need to be left to their own devices as they grow up.
Transgendered people being welcomed in society, as well as transgender operations being allowed for children, does nothing to cause this, and in fact in many ways, just the opposite attitude to gender makes this more of a necessity this situation you provide as already happened, I suggest you take a look at David Reimer, this also deals with your problem of saying that they're impressionable, for David here knew there was something wrong at around age 10. So no I don't think children are that impressionable to not know when they're assigned the wrong gender and simply believe what their parents tell them, children are smarter than they're given credit for. And I can see why one would want to hold off on this, but again, I do not see why the parents wouldn't best know what to do in this situation, and fair enough, bring in a doctor to test them psychologically, but that should not eliminate all course of action, especially considering children already have an idea of 'what sex they're supposed to be' well before they even enter puberty. Gender is not simply something that is put inside your head, if it were David Reimer would have lived his entire life as "Brenda" likely even after finding out about his true gender.

So yes I think this can fully happen and in some cases should fully happen, because I can't imagine what sort of excuse I'd have given to "Brenda" about why we can't simply fix 'her' into a 'him.' And perhaps you say this is an outlier, but this sort of outlier is exactly why I believe children should be able to.

And it's certainly not as if more cis (male/females who feel they are male/females) will be forced to transition than trans children being forced to act as if they're men and woman either, so on a pure numbers level I'd imagine doing this would most certainly hurt less people than the not.

And regarding this, it would indeed be arguably better if we could be rid of all gender coding and instead never have this come up in the first place, but I don't think you'll be able to uproot and drastically change what is arguably one of the core beliefs of our culture, certainly not on a website for Dragon Ball, and thus we must look for more realistic options.

Overall, children do know what gender they are, and even when all evidence they theoretically should have is gone, they are still more than able to figure out the truth, even despite their parent's claims. He figured out his gender and by extension sex at 10 years, and it would be another five years before being told the truth. Children know what their gender is, parents have no power over that. As such, I believe it should be allowed.
Edited by Tinny, Mar 9 2018, 07:29 PM.
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Yeah hold-up, I was bullied for being light-skinned. Kids are a vicious bunch of bastards. If it ain't being transgender, it'll be something else. The amount of colour to your skin amongst your own age group, you being gay or bi, If you have a disability. Bullying isn't a good reason at all to prevent it.
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Daemon Keido
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Especially since that won't stop the bullying anyway.
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