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| Best Z Arc? | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Jul 18 2017, 04:02 PM (570 Views) | |
| + Son-Goku | Jul 18 2017, 04:02 PM Post #1 |
孫悟空
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This is something I can't ever decide. I love all four arcs, but which one is truly the best? The Buu Arc is good, but there's a lot in it that bothers me and powers are all over the place. It's probably the most unorganized arc, I'd say this one is the worst arc, definitely not that it's bad just the worst of the four. Then I'd say the Saiyan Arc is probably the third. It's the start of DBZ and it has great battles, but it just isn't quite as good as the Cell Arc or the Frieza Arc imo. The last two are the Frieza Arc and the Cell Arc, but I just can't quite decide which one is my favorite. Goku is my favorite character, yet he doesn't have a lot of action in the Cell Arc but for some reason I feel like that Arc may be my favorite. There's a lot of good stuff in the Frieza Arc and it probably has Vegeta at his best with his best fights. Then there's Goku vs Frieza which is my favorite fight. I feel like anime wise the Frieza Arc is my favorite, while the Cell Arc is my favorite in the manga. |
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| Darker | Jul 18 2017, 06:57 PM Post #2 |
The Lord of the Dark
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I'm going to go with the Cell Arc because it was different. The whole arc just kept building up, and the stakes were higher than ever, taking place on Earth after all. Unlike the Freeza Arc, we didn't have the main characters waiting for the great hero Goku to arrive and finish off the villains, which unfortunately happened. Only Ginyu put up a fight because of his extra ability, he wouldn't have won otherwise. Goku was getting beaten up, only to come back stronger, and this happened two times in a row, with Ginyu and Freeza (second time was technically Super Saiyan but still). The other characters had their shining moments, but very few, and the main villain lost all the dignity and fright there was to him as soon as he was nothing but talk. Cool as they were, the transformations grew a bit old, and we barely got to see enough with them, especially the 3rd form. The Cell Arc was more of a build up, the villain's transformations were more clear now and the fact that this new bad guy knew what the heroes were capable of and could play off their traits and weaknesses was pretty scary, which is what we see in his Imperfect form, certainly the most horror-oriented of the bunch.  His semi-perfect form started to show the flaws from other characters he had within him, which would later be seen during his defeat, especially the one trait every character he shares cells with has had at least once in their life: overconfidence. But in the Cell Arc we didn't just have the one big main threat, but also 2, no, 5 other androids to deal with. Most of this arc as a mystery that slowly revealed the truth, until we see what all of is about once Piccolo visits Ginger Town, and what's left of the population. Cell was doing nothing but going around mercilessly killing people, all for the sake of perfection, and once we see his Perfect form we get a similar scary vibe to when Freeza reached his final form, except this time the baddies has a much bigger advantage over his adversaries, and is so confident he even sets up a tournament and announces on TV how the world is going to end (very akin to King Piccolo). Such a fearsome opponent even the mighty and nigh-unbeatable Goku gives up, and lets the next "hero" of the story take over, and that's where we get one of the best deaths, one of the best transformations and one of the best scenes overall in the whole series. From this point on it's just satisfying to see Cell get his a*** whooped, but Gohan's sadistic saiyan behaviour allowed him one more chance to beat the good guys, which lead to Goku's death, which then lead to a pretty big kick to the balls for the Z-Fighters.  And then we get the big finale, a pretty intense beam struggle which will decide to fate of the world. The anime improves upon it a bit by having the other fighters attack Cell alongside Gohan, futile as it is, since Cell repels them with his mere aura. A lot happens in this huge final fight, and I really, really like it. This whole arc is damn good. |
 Piccolo: Just how many people have you sacrificed?! Cell: Sacrifice? Hmph, rubbish! On the contrary, it is an honor to become a fraction of my power. | |
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| SSJsongojames | Jul 18 2017, 07:17 PM Post #3 |
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Cell arc is the perfect ending and the best arc of the series. Goku thinking the earth is safter without him, which was the perfect culmination of Goku's adventures up to that point, and passing down the torch to his son who has developed into a better protector both physically and mentally than Goku can ever be (Or as it seemed at the time), with Goku himself even admitting that Gohan is a better person than him, showing how wise Goku has become while still retaining, no, utilizing those core elements of his character in the perfect way, with the knowledge of his Saiyan heritage being part of the reason why he concluding that the earth isn't meant for him since he lets bad guys attack at their best. How the Cell Games utilized the way Goku's character was built throughout the world tournaments and turned it on his head, with Goku realizing the mistake he made by placing too much faith in his son, willingly giving up which was a huge deal for his character, as shown in the 21st Tournament which was metaphoric for Goku's relationship with his son Gohan. Goku's dislike for unfairness in fighting was turned in his head with Piccolo questioning whether he values a fair fight more than the life of his son, freakin' powerful stuff right there. Piccolo reuniting with Kami was the natural conclusion to his arc, with the build up and suspense that led to it being fantastic writing. Him being the one to tell Goku the mistake he made was perfect, and showed how much Piccolo bonding with Gohan in a more emotional level than Goku did, which further added to Goku's shock when he realized the mistake he made. Vegeta giving up fighting was fantastic because at the point in his life Goku practically held what remained of his pride, and with Goku gone those remains are shattered. Vegeta had no choice but to care for his family otherwise he'd have lost the will to live. Bulma being surprised when Trunks told him that Vegeta changed like that added to the impact of the scene, because it furthered the idea that Vegeta can only change if the source of his pride, Son Goku, doesn't come back, which further added to Goku's reasoning for staying dead! Not only was Vegeta an example of someone Goku prevented from doing evil by leaving, but he also served as a symbol. If someone like Vegeta can change because of Goku leaving, then it's highly likely that someone else out there in the Universe i.e in Frieza's army can change, one person can make all the difference as Dr. Gero showcased. (More on why Vegeta was great here http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8548441/1/ ) Dr. Gero/Cell being the perfect endgame villain, due to Gero's duality with Goku (More of Dr.Gero's duality with Goku here http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8546232/1/ ) and Cell further reflecting on the very side of Goku that Goku himself fears, which further adds to the impact! (More on why Cell is a great villain here http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8546594/1/ ) Gohan's character arc coming full circle, yes he didn't do a bunch of things before the Cell Games but he didn't need to, the Cell Games which so great for his character that it more than made up for it, plus it really gave the sense of saving the best for last. Cell being a foil for Gohan's character was perfect, it furthered the idea of why Gohan is a better protector than Goku, because Gohan ideals and morals are his motivation for fighting rather than his desire to become a fighter. (More on why Gohan was great here http://dbzf.co.uk/topic/8582504/1/ ) Goku mastering the SSJ which was the only way Gohan could hope to realize his full potential (At the time) was the perfect use of their characters and the SSJ form. The MSSJ form was perfect for Goku, it was perfect for the character because it reflects on his mindset when it comes to fighting: Focusing mainly on his limitation rather than focusing only on besting others. The fact that the Ascended Forms had limitations but Vegeta and Trunks didn't care to focus on removing said limitations because they felt they were strong enough further reflects this. Vegeta not being able to achieve it despite working harder due to not sharing that mindset was the icing on the cake. The form literally played with the idea of how to fully realise the form because they had to achieve practically the opposite of anger to do it, which was genius writing. The way Bulma was part of the reason why Goku thought about his decision was fantastic in all its irony, with her having faith in Goku and believing he's needed for the planet's future whereas Goku himself believed the planet's future would be better without him thanks to the future Bulma herself made Goku know about by creating the time machine. Also, Bulma being the one to make Goku think about his past is genius since she's the main reason he had all the adventures. Bulma influenced Goku to start and finish his adventures. I can literally go on and on about the supreme greatness that is the Android saga. Edited by SSJsongojames, Jul 18 2017, 07:28 PM.
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| SaltiestBiscuit | Jul 18 2017, 08:03 PM Post #4 |
 
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At risk of being unoriginal I went with the Cell Arc too. To me it had the most emotional resonance, a compelling "what's gonna happen next?" narrative, and built to a perfect ending. I will now provide a wall of text... In a Dragonball arc I look for the following: great action; epic character moments, logical story progression and increase of stakes, and a satisfying ending. Cell has it all. The Saiyan arc has epic character moments (piccolo's sacrifice, Krillin avenging Yamcha, chiaotzu' sacrifice, etc...) and solid action throughout. It progresses along pretty well and the stakes are the same the whole time but at least they don't lessen. I just find the ending leaves a lot to be desired. Of course that's cuz it leads into Namek/Frieza but it's still worth noting. It's also decidedly the least epic, as even some of the moments I love (I.e chiaotzu's) just kinda show up all of a sudden without dramatic build. The Namek/Frieza Arc has good action (really they all do, it's dragonball), a few epic character moments (though mostly just in the form of cool fights), but I find it has an awkward progression, where everyone's trying to avoid Frieza, but you all know they r going to fight Frieza. It is kinda the closest we get to an old fashion dragonball hunt in Z early on though. Also the Frieza ending bites. Whether it ends when the planet blows up and you think Goku and Frieza are both dead, or when they ask the dragon to bring back Goku and you find out he's still alive, it's a narrative dead stop to any repercussions of the battle. The Cell Arc has awesome action,epic character moments for all (though Yamcha only gets the Kamehameha clash at the end), the story just keeps building with stakes getting worse and worse, even after SSJ2 makes you think the day is autosaved, And the ending is perfect with a logical conclusion, a way for characters to move on organically, and just the right of fallout and repercussions to the battle. (Trunks wrecking Future Androids, Goku opting to stay dead, Krillin trying to make the Androids human, Vegeta "quitting" fighting, etc...) The Buu Arc has some sick action but is devoid of impactful character moments(short of Vegeta and Gohan). The characters seems less like "themselves" and more like whatever the plot wants them to be all of a sudden (aside from good old Krillin), it endlessly progresses in the messiest way possible, and Buu provides the most generic "well he's gonna do bad stuff" stakes. The ending is cool before or after the gap, except the ending to the big fight seems like it's not what the rest of the arc was telling you it was going to be at all. Cell Arc, all the way Also I feel like Garlic Jr. is being slept on here 
Edited by SaltiestBiscuit, Jul 18 2017, 10:28 PM.
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| Famicommander | Jul 18 2017, 11:52 PM Post #5 |
Jukebox hero
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Frieza > Saiyan > Cell >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Buu DB > Z > Super > GT |
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| + ThePrinceOfSaiyans | Jul 19 2017, 12:40 AM Post #6 |
魔王子
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I gotta go with the Cell saga. Cell saga Vegeta might be my least favorite version of Vegeta, but everything else about the arc is so god damn good. You have Trunks, you have Cell, you have Super Saiyan 2 Gohan, Goku vs Cell, Piccolo vs No. 17, it's just got so much great stuff. It has its problems to be sure, but the good heavily outweighs the bad. The Freeza saga is certainly a close second. Vegeta was arguably at his best in that arc. |
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| Dan The Commentator | Jul 21 2017, 01:04 AM Post #7 |
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I've always thought that the Saiyan arc was the best written arc in Dragon Ball, period: - It utilized a good majority of the cast in meaningful ways. - Most of the deaths had real emotional weight to them. Standouts include Tenshinhan's and Piccolo's sacrifices. - There's some interesting character development for Goku, what with him coming to terms with his less than savoury origins, and his speech about how on Earth, a low class can rival the elites if he tries hard enough is great. - Gohan's and Piccolo's individual development is almost as strong as the relationship that springs between the two of them. - It's mostly devoid of the problems that plague later Dragon Ball (constant escalation of power, a never ending cavalcade of transformations, a myriad of new unbeatable forms, techniques, etc. that are hyped up to "totally beat the bad guy this time, I swear" but never do (admittedly the Genki Dama does fall into this, but it's only once). - The Kaioken is just a way cooler power-up than any of the Super Saiyan forms. I like the fact that it carries it's own risks, and that it has to be used strategically. |
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| + QueenTD | Jul 21 2017, 02:31 AM Post #8 |
My Dear Melancholy,
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Nothing I can say about the Android/Cell saga that can live up to how Darker and SongoJames wrote about it. Fantastic post you two  |
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| Darker | Jul 21 2017, 02:48 AM Post #9 |
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The Lord of the Dark
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Thanks Queen 
Edited by Darker, Jul 21 2017, 02:49 AM.
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Piccolo: Just how many people have you sacrificed?! Cell: Sacrifice? Hmph, rubbish! On the contrary, it is an honor to become a fraction of my power. | |
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| Zoom | Jul 21 2017, 09:48 AM Post #10 |
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Saiyan arc was Toriyama best arc in my opinion. Cell arc is good, but have a lot of problems. Dragged out too long and too many power ups from Cell. |
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| + Emmeth | Jul 21 2017, 11:04 AM Post #11 |
I ♥ Yoeri
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I think the Boo arc is getting too much heat. While it had some plotholes and silly moments, it felt more like Dragonball than the other arcs in Z. Toriyama's silly sense of humor came more through in the Boo arc than any other. I change my opinion on which arc I think is the best often, but Boo arc consistently stays one of my favorites just because of how much content there is. Super Saiyan forms beyond the original, a foe that can truly absorb the prots' powers and an actual World Tournament albeit cut short. |
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| Notaka | Jul 22 2017, 09:10 AM Post #12 |
Always Wright
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Both Frieza's arc and Cell's arc are good, but If i had to choose it'd be Cell's arc. It realized the whole premise of Gohan surpassing his father and becoming earth's savior. Though the Frieza's arc ending would have also been perfect. |
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| Bad User | Jul 26 2017, 03:16 PM Post #13 |
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My thoughts in a nutshell. Lol Frieza saga was the one that kept me hooked. It definitely has a lot more sense of adventure than other arcs. It's the first one that introduced characters traveling to another planet, which somehow felt realistic (unlike today when some characters can simply teleport from one planet to another planet, dimension, universe etc. in a matter of seconds). It also added a sense of terror, showing how Frieza and the gang tortured villages of Namekians (it's also more involving than in other arcs, where you know there's terror but it's only implied or treated superficially, you don't get to feel them feels). One of my favorite moments was when Gohan jumped in front of Frieza and her gang to save the little Namekian Dende ( Other favorite moment was when Goku first transformed into SSJ. Unlike today, that transformation felt natural and reserved only for truly physically and mentally strong Saiyans and not simply a plot device to kill of the boss. It was one of the last arcs to show the friendship of Krillin and Goku, because if you come to think about it, only after Frieza popped Krillin and Goku realized he couldn't be brought to life since he was already revived once, Goku was filled with rage, anger and pain that got the best of him (I think it's one of the few times we actually see him like that). Also Vegeta, which I considered an a***** the entire DBZ, was actually in a good light at his death. He let out his deepest thoughts and feelings, things which I dunno where they drained to, after he was revived. Even Piccolo had a very good character development, he left Earth being a jerk to anyone but Gohan, though when he got on Namek, although he was still jerky, he actually cooperated with the crew (and didn't take s*** from anyone unlike now). Krillin was also still important to the series, although he was still kind of weak. At the end of the arc, I was really impatient to see if and how Goku manages to escape the exploding planet. Downsides: Goku's... heroic... character takes a turn for the worst. Frieza was the one that terrorized the whole Universe, tortured and killed lots of innocents and lots of planets, also killed or hurt his friends, yet Goku was insisting on letting her alive and giving her second chances. (Srsly Goku if she got away and kept on doing that would that hurt your conscience oh it would wouldn't it...) My second favorite is Saiyan saga. What I liked the most is Gohan's development. He was a pampered and overprotected toddler, who acted like a little pussy, but after spending that year with Piccolo, even if he was still a little scared (he was only 5), he definitely improved and overcame his fears. He might not have been very strong, but in only one year turned from a scaredy-cat into a brave little kid. Another great thing was Piccolo's development. He was the reincarnation of King Piccolo who was basically Satan on Earth during his reign and was born only to continue the evil, but after spending a year with his arch-enemy's son (the one who killed his own father) he turned the tables to the point where he protected Gohan and gave his life for him and redeemed himself (knowing that the dragon balls would disappear and he might not come back to life, but he didn't actually care). I think this was a waaay better redemption and development than Vegeta's, who took a s***load of years to soften and, unlike Piccolo, he had a family and was supposed to. Another thing I liked was Piccolo's and Gohan's teacher-pupil / big-lil brother bonding. I know Piccolo's methods were cruel and questionable at first, but he was evil and spent his entire life alone, in the wilderness; he wasn't supposed to and maybe didn't even know how to be all sugar and honey. But Gohan sensed the good in him and was responsible for Piccolo's change of heart and Piccolo was the one who made Gohan a man. It was touching, really. Their friendship is better written and depicted than many other relationships in DBZ Another thing I enjoyed was the introduction of Saiyans. I kept myself from getting in touch with any spoiler, so, after being used to Earthly environment the whole DB, the arrival of Raditz and him telling how Goku is actually an alien and that's the reason for his gorilla thingy and he was sent to Earth to destroy it was *inserts mind-blowing gif*. This alien perspective was actually interesting back then. And yes, Earth characters were still relevant and I would've liked to see them with a little more screen time in fights. Oh, and colorful transformations and huge relevance of power levels were not a thing. Remember how Yajirobe sneaked behind VegetApe and cut off his tail? It still shows how nothing is perfect and even great powers have their own disadvantages. If we insert this scene in later DBZ, Vegeta would have acknoweldged Yajirobe before he even arrived and the only thing that would break would be Yajirobe's sword then all his molecules. Next would be Cell saga. It was OK. Too lazy already to write more... The only downsides were characters making dumb decisions, culminating with Goku passing the fight to Gohan WHILE giving Cell a senzu. I mean, Cell was a cold-hearted killer. He would destroy Earth. He must be fought with every tool and advantage and stuff they got. He was powerful already. Gohan fighting him, it would still be at least 1% chance he lost. If that's so, they would all be doomed. Gohan still got the beating of his life and lots of pain, because Cell wasn't going easy on him. And even if Gohan won, there was still a big chance that he would be left with a huge trauma and a fked up childhood. He was still a scared 9/11 years-old boy, on whose shoulders the fate of the world was put by his father and if he failed he would be the one responsible for a great tragedy (imagine the pressure for a child), and he hated to fight, being forced to only to protect everyone. But, the most important of all, what did Goku thought to be the highest priority of them all: show off my son's awesome powers. /facepalm Goku was a major let-down for me at this point. And then there's Buu saga who was 'f*** logic' 90% time. I think it was more of a parody and a comedic take on DBZ, but I won't go into reasoning, my hands hurt alright. Edited by Bad User, Jul 26 2017, 03:23 PM.
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