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Power scaling the Broly movies; How strong were the Z-fighters against Broly
Topic Started: Jul 14 2017, 09:22 PM (1,846 Views)
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There are only 2 possibilities depending on how you interpret it.

A.) The Z-fighters were equivelant to how they were in the Cell games in M8. But Gohan was weaker than his Cell games self in M10.

B.) They were weaker than their cell games selves in M8 because their full power had yet be revealed in the anime. But by the same token Gohan was equal to or stronger than he was during the cell games. Why? Because the movie was in production and released before it had been said by Vegeta in the anime that Gohan had gotten weaker.

Which do you agree with and why?
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Jiren
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M8 Z senshi are Perfect Cell arc level as thats the time line of the movie... Movie 10 Gohan is the same as in the Boo Arc...


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PocketGod
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Why does M8 Gohan have to be weaker than his cell games version exactly?
Broly was so strong it just didn't matter, he was playing with Goku, everyone else just got mangled because he had no interest in them.

Anyway to answer your question I go with everyone being their cell games selves. And IMO M10 Gohan dwarfs cell games Gohan.
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Goddess Ultimecia
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Pocket God's take is interesting, and something I might consider.

Personally I think M10 Gohan is stronger than his Cell Games self, the guy has SSJ2, which implies the Cell Games took place, and in the movie he hadn't stopped training. So he should be pretty damn strong compared to his Boo arc self.
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lazerbem
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I think he's weaker just because of how pitiful his performance is. He takes a whole of three hits non-damaging hits before gassing out from exhaustion. Cell Arc Gohan got his arm snapped and still pulled out all the stops. M10 Gohan has bizarrely poor stamina for blows that didn't break his bones to so quickly tire him out.

Also, Gohan was weaker in Movie 8 as evidenced by not being the one to get the power-up
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+ Ssj3vegito96
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They're cell games level except for gohan imo

In M10 gohan is probably stronger than CG gohan imo too
IT'S CHEESE
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Jiren
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Movie 9 Z fighters are Cell Games not movie 8... Here is why...

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Edited by Jiren, Jul 15 2017, 09:23 AM.


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BioBroly288
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Jiren
Jul 15 2017, 09:06 AM
Movie 9 Z fighters are Cell Games not movie 8... Here is why...

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It also says "why are they having a cherry blossom picnic when they should be worried on fighting Cell" indicating that it was during the 10 day wait.

Also LSSJ is stated to be a Different Evolution. USSJ was just used as a reference appearance wise, We shouldn't be comparing ones power just because they happen to look similar.

In regards to all this I have it like most fans have it which is during the 10 day wait and Movie 10 being before but saga with a chance of Gohan being stronger because of what he said.
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Jiren
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BioBroly288
Jul 15 2017, 02:00 PM
Jiren
Jul 15 2017, 09:06 AM
Movie 9 Z fighters are Cell Games not movie 8... Here is why...

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It also says "why are they having a cherry blossom picnic when they should be worried on fighting Cell" indicating that it was during the 10 day wait.

Also LSSJ is stated to be a Different Evolution. USSJ was just used as a reference appearance wise, We shouldn't be comparing ones power just because they happen to look similar.

In regards to all this I have it like most fans have it which is during the 10 day wait and Movie 10 being before but saga with a chance of Gohan being stronger because of what he said.
The Daizenshuu says its a mystery though and their placement is not accurate... Most fans also dont say its during the 10 days... Movoes are alternative universes... They dont take place in the series... LSSjin is based on SSjinG3 in appearance but its a better and stronger form... Irs implied in the guidebook.. Hence its grade 4 in par with CG FPSSjin Goku... M10 is during the budokai time... Gohan is the same as his Boo arc self... No reason to think otherwise...


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It has to be during the 10 day wait. Gohan is teen gohan which means him and goku went into the time chamber

Gohan's just not as strong because iirc it hadn't been implied in the manga that gohan was incredibly strong when this movie was being made

Everyone should be as strong as they were in the CG except maybe gohan
IT'S CHEESE
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Jiren
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Ssj3vegito96
Jul 15 2017, 07:56 PM
It has to be during the 10 day wait. Gohan is teen gohan which means him and goku went into the time chamber

Gohan's just not as strong because iirc it hadn't been implied in the manga that gohan was incredibly strong when this movie was being made

Everyone should be as strong as they were in the CG except maybe gohan
Movies are alternative universe... They dont take place in the series... Gohan is weaker because its not hased on the CG but the arc before.. Also Vegeta and Trunks are SSjinG2 the ones who fought Cell.. Movie 9 is Cell Games... You should learn the topic more thoroughly


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+ ThePrinceOfSaiyans
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Literally everyone put up a better fight than Gohan. I'll be frank. It doesn't make much sense for the characters in Movie 8 to be as strong as their Cell Games counterparts when the anime hadn't made it known how powerful their Cell Games counterparts were at the time. Remember, Movie 8 was released in theaters before Goku and Cell had even started fighting in the anime. Yes, the movie was released between chapters 412 and 413, by which point Super Saiyan 2 Gohan had already forced Cell back into his second form, but movies follow the anime, albeit loosely. Goku and Gohan not being Super Saiyans 24-7, and Vegeta's use of Grade 2 would suggest to me they're not Cell Games level.
Edited by ThePrinceOfSaiyans, Jul 15 2017, 09:00 PM.
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BioBroly288
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Jiren
Jul 15 2017, 05:34 PM
BioBroly288
Jul 15 2017, 02:00 PM
Jiren
Jul 15 2017, 09:06 AM
Movie 9 Z fighters are Cell Games not movie 8... Here is why...

Spoiler: click to toggle
It also says "why are they having a cherry blossom picnic when they should be worried on fighting Cell" indicating that it was during the 10 day wait.

Also LSSJ is stated to be a Different Evolution. USSJ was just used as a reference appearance wise, We shouldn't be comparing ones power just because they happen to look similar.

In regards to all this I have it like most fans have it which is during the 10 day wait and Movie 10 being before but saga with a chance of Gohan being stronger because of what he said.
The Daizenshuu says its a mystery though and their placement is not accurate... Most fans also dont say its during the 10 days... Movoes are alternative universes... They dont take place in the series... LSSjin is based on SSjinG3 in appearance but its a better and stronger form... Irs implied in the guidebook.. Hence its grade 4 in par with CG FPSSjin Goku... M10 is during the budokai time... Gohan is the same as his Boo arc self... No reason to think otherwise...
It implies that LSSJ is similar looking to USSJ. Heck the Daizenshuu also stated that LSSJ was a different evolution then Super Saiyan kind of like how Super Saiyan 4 and the God forms are in thier owm separate line. So no LSSJ is not a Glorified USSJ for that rivals MSSJ.

It doesn't make sense for Goku and the others to not be equal to their CG selves at all, The first time we seen Teen Gohan as a SSJ was a MSSJ, just because he's shown to be weak doesn't prove a lot, Broly decimated everyone just as bad as the next, there was really no clear cut indication on who was stronger then who, Goku kept fighting because he kept getting energy pumped from everyone else, He to got knocked out as soon as the fight started.

Yes Toriyama said the movies are in different timelines, but the Canon is often refrenced in those movies(M5,M7,M9,M10 which stated Goku has passed, M12 and M13) as if they existed so there treated as extended filler.He also stated that everything in the daiz Is valid.

Also most fans do have it placed during the wait, it's the only reasonable reason as to why Gohan was a Super Saiyan in Teens.
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I'll Take This
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Why does M8 Gohan have to be weaker then Cell games ? You might as well say M13 Gohan is weaker then SSj2 Goku -.- or SSj Goku > Mystic Gohan

Fact is, Toei always amped there Z fighters, never nerfed. Goku is the strongest and no character is nerfed, otherwise how about we all stop being biased and start putting SSJ Goku > Mystic Gohan and SSJ3 Gotenks in the fillers and have Full Power Perfect Cell beat both of them -.-

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Literally everyone put up a better fight than Gohan.


Incorrect, Vegeta actually did the worst since he got one-shot. Gohan did no better then Trunks or Piccolo. Nor does it matter who survived what when it was up to Broly who he wanted to end as shown with Vegeta.

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I'll be frank. It doesn't make much sense for the characters in Movie 8 to be as strong as their Cell Games counterparts when the anime hadn't made it known how powerful their Cell Games counterparts were at the time.


This point doesn't make sense. Movies go by anime, yet the anime goes by the manga -.- ? What is the difference of waiting for the anime when they need to manga for the anime as their main source of canon material ? When M8 was released, they where already 5 months into Cell games in the manga. There are no excuses, nor was there any indication that there levels was difference, nor did the movie follow what the timeline was showing.

Plus Movies are an alternate timeline, so it follows neither the anime or the manga.

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Remember, Movie 8 was released in theaters before Goku and Cell had even started fighting in the anime. Yes, the movie was released between chapters 412 and 413, by which point Super Saiyan 2 Gohan had already forced Cell back into his second form, but movies follow the anime, albeit loosely.


It follows the timeline of the anime, since they release episodes and rank the movie on where the movie is ranked. The movies however do not follow the anime timeline, since the anime follows the manga, thus the anime is considered as a secondary canon if fillers weren't involved. The movies however are an alternate timeline different from the anime/manga.

Another reason your point makes no sense is that you are suggesting Toei animation purposely blind themselves to follow the anime despite the anime shows no difference then the manga until fillers are involved and they need the manga for the anime to begin with, and in fillers, nothing was shown different.

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Goku and Gohan not being Super Saiyans 24-7, and Vegeta's use of Grade 2 would suggest to me they're not Cell Games level.


Goku and Gohan not being SSj 24/7 just further proves it's a different timeline. And Vegeta has the same concept designs as M9, thus if M8 is bulky, then so is M9, since M9 Vegeta was bulky as well.

M8 are Cell games level, but Goku is the strongest in the movie, no bloody different then how it was in the anime fillers or M12 or 13, unless you are going to nerf the Z fighters in that movie as well.




M8= Cell Games level except Goku, as he is the strongest
M10 = Alternate timeline where Gohan had trained, meaning M10 Gohan > M9 Gohan > Cell Games Gohan
Edited by I'll Take This, Jul 17 2017, 04:55 AM.
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Broly12015
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Movie 8 = Full Power Perfect Cell Level
Movie 10 = Fat Boo Level
Movie 11 = Semi Perfect Cell Level
Broly and Cell For Life
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