How will the robotic economy affect global employment?

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How will the robotic economy affect global employment?
Tweet Topic Started: Mar 15 2017, 02:18 AM (1,540 Views)
SSJSC	Mar 24 2017, 06:57 PM Post #31
Posts: 1,024 Group: Member Member #10,761 Joined: January 23, 2014	Nagito Komaeda Mar 24 2017, 05:59 PM SSJSC Mar 24 2017, 03:54 PM Mitas Mar 24 2017, 02:40 PM Why does he have to elaborate? You obviously understood what he meant because that's exactly what he's saying: there will always be a certain level of unemployment. And it's only going to increase as the decades pass and more jobs are made obsolete by advances in robotics and AI. He said if you got rid of unemployment, it'll be zero hour contracts, which skew the statistics. To me, it was unclear because it seems like he came up with a reason not to get rid of unemployment. So I'm asking him cordially to please clarify that a little further. And please disregard from making framed comments in the thread when I didn't ask you, thanks. It's not that I don't want to get rid of unemployment, it's just that it's literally impossible. Zero-hour contracts are contracts where the employer isn't obligated to give you any working hours. Essentially, you could be on a zero-hour contract and get no hours at all. You'd still legally be employed, but you wouldn't be working. I mean, heck, with unemployment in general, it'd get to the point where you'd have to artificially inflate different sectors in order to create the jobs necessary to employ everyone. Our biggest concern is that there are still 30-40 millions of people unemployed and each year when someone creates 300,000 jobs, it doesn't satisfy the amount greatly. Many people are trying to move out, start families, and make money and they can't do anything because of this. This is the biggest issue globally ever. Even with someone who has experience and educational skill sets, those kinds of people are still out of work and busting their asses off every day just to get someone to hire them. It's messed up because back then you could get a job with a college degree, nowadays, there's absolutely NOTHING you can do to get a job even if you communicate well with people or have college degrees. Entry level jobs are gone!! All the jobs we have right now in this country are all high level pay jobs reserved for people who have been working in the company for a long time from the bottom or people who have TONS of experience. It's just impossible to to find someone with that much years of experience, but if they take someone who's willing to learn and stay loyal to the company, that would make our lives a lot easier, we wouldn't need to go through so many unnecessary obstacles just to get a damn job. LOL. How are young people going to move out of their parents home and have their own home? They can't because the government only cares about their vacation spendings and less about US (the people - capitalized). What kind of a 25 year old man/woman would be working at a grocery store? This is a poor excuse for a job market or economy, and if we can't stop the robots from destroying jobs, we're going to be living with parents FOREVER until we die. We won't be seeing job productions until 2070 -- which is BAD, you're better off catching cancer and dying in that case.



* Yu Narukami	Mar 24 2017, 07:07 PM Post #32
Izanagi! Posts: 12,330 Group: Retired Staff Member #6,446 Joined: July 3, 2011 Gender Not Specified Country None	Taking people on based on their willingness to learn and future loyalty would be a hit in the beginning, and that's something that businesses won't do. Plus, if something like that were forced on companies, it'd be discriminating against the people who've managed to gather that experience through their lives. Positive discrimination isn't necessarily a good thing. Regarding that 25 year old man/woman, presumably somebody who wants a job and is willing to take one that people see as 'menial' or 'beneath them'. Being 25 and working in a grocery store isn't something that's bad, that's absolutely ridiculous. Do you really think people would survive until 2070 if there wasn't some system of Universal Basic Income in place? Once that's in place, job productions won't be essential. The well-off will be willing to be taxed to support the unemployed because most of the human race would be unemployed, meaning that if they didn't, any profits that could be made by those people buying their products or services would be non-existent.



SSJSC	Mar 24 2017, 07:16 PM Post #33
Posts: 1,024 Group: Member Member #10,761 Joined: January 23, 2014	So why is it that people who have gathered educational and work experience still can't find a full time job? Hmm.. there has to be a reason why or am I just daydreaming in this world and these things are just plain fantasies? Companies that don't put the time and effort into training new employees is suppose to be their fault or the candidates' fault? It surely isn't candidates' faults. They all want jobs for sure. When you're 25, you're suppose to be working at a more professional company full time on a salaried wage, and unfortunately, things don't look that way right now. We're doomed to be villagers and beginner craftsmen/women forever now. You guys keep saying universal basic income will solve everything. Tell me how is it going to work for us. Give me at least an example of how that will apply to our society. Let's say Greg is living at home with his parents, wants to move out, but can't find a job to make money and move out. How would that solve his problem? Edited by SSJSC, Mar 24 2017, 07:18 PM.



* Yu Narukami	Mar 24 2017, 07:23 PM Post #34
Izanagi! Posts: 12,330 Group: Retired Staff Member #6,446 Joined: July 3, 2011 Gender Not Specified Country None	SSJSC Mar 24 2017, 07:16 PM So why is it that people who have gathered educational and work experience still can't find a full time job? Hmm.. there has to be a reason why or am I just daydreaming in this world and these things are just plain fantasies? Companies that don't put the time and effort into training new employees is suppose to be their fault or the candidates' fault? It surely isn't candidates' faults. They all want jobs for sure. When you're 25, you're suppose to be working at a more professional company full time on a salaried wage, and unfortunately, things don't look that way right now. We're doomed to be villagers and beginner craftsmen/women forever now. You guys keep saying universal basic income will solve everything. Tell me how is it going to work for us. Give me at least an example of how that will apply to our society. Let's say Greg is living at home with his parents, wants to move out, but can't find a job to make money and move out. How would that solve his problem? Y'might want to look at the market for that one. Education and work experience doesn't matter if there aren't any jobs up for grabs. Really? Says who? If that were true, then in an ideal world, would every single person aged 25 and above be working at a more professional company? Face it, grocery jobs, garbage collection jobs, janitorial jobs, they all need filling. And you're also making the assumption that all 25 year olds want to work at professional companies. UBI is basically giving a certain amount of money to a person, unconditionally, that covers their living needs. You can expand it and make it cover some expendable stuff too. Basically, you get given the amount of money you need to survive and live comfortably. It would solve his problem by giving him money so he can contribute to the rent payments and save up enough money to move out eventually.



Daemon Keido	Mar 24 2017, 07:25 PM Post #35
Warmaster of Chaos Posts: 3,915 Group: RP Moderator Member #6,491 Joined: July 16, 2011 Gender Male Country Canada Favourite Anime Dragonball Z, of course Favourite Manga Currently Toriko	SSJSC Mar 24 2017, 07:16 PM When you're 25, you're suppose to be working at a more professional company full time on a salaried wage, and unfortunately, things don't look that way right now. We're doomed to be villagers and beginner craftsmen/women forever now. I AM 25. Gonna be 26 in a month actually. None of those "professional" companies are places I fit in. They are too restrictive. Instead of more jobs given to people, what we really need is more ENTREPRENEURS. I am partners with my dad in various jobs, most prominently as a cemetery caretaker. And we got therr by being entrepreneurs who talked our way into jobsites. The salaryman is NOT the only path in life.
	A Shadow is merely Darkness in the presence of Light Thanks Kid Buu for this awesome sig! The Emperor Protects


SSJSC	Mar 24 2017, 08:08 PM Post #36
Posts: 1,024 Group: Member Member #10,761 Joined: January 23, 2014	Nagito Komaeda Mar 24 2017, 07:23 PM SSJSC Mar 24 2017, 07:16 PM So why is it that people who have gathered educational and work experience still can't find a full time job? Hmm.. there has to be a reason why or am I just daydreaming in this world and these things are just plain fantasies? Companies that don't put the time and effort into training new employees is suppose to be their fault or the candidates' fault? It surely isn't candidates' faults. They all want jobs for sure. When you're 25, you're suppose to be working at a more professional company full time on a salaried wage, and unfortunately, things don't look that way right now. We're doomed to be villagers and beginner craftsmen/women forever now. You guys keep saying universal basic income will solve everything. Tell me how is it going to work for us. Give me at least an example of how that will apply to our society. Let's say Greg is living at home with his parents, wants to move out, but can't find a job to make money and move out. How would that solve his problem? Y'might want to look at the market for that one. Education and work experience doesn't matter if there aren't any jobs up for grabs. Really? Says who? If that were true, then in an ideal world, would every single person aged 25 and above be working at a more professional company? Face it, grocery jobs, garbage collection jobs, janitorial jobs, they all need filling. And you're also making the assumption that all 25 year olds want to work at professional companies. UBI is basically giving a certain amount of money to a person, unconditionally, that covers their living needs. You can expand it and make it cover some expendable stuff too. Basically, you get given the amount of money you need to survive and live comfortably. It would solve his problem by giving him money so he can contribute to the rent payments and save up enough money to move out eventually. Ideally, grocery stores are reserved for people who need to start working or building a resume from step 1, or people who need to make up work experience and don't have enough. The pay isn't high, and the job isn't professional enough even though you still have to treat it professionally because it's work. It's more for people who got out of high school and are starting careers or college graduates who need to make it up. When you're 25 and experienced, there's no reason why you should still be working at a supermarket and demanding your boss to raise your pay so you could have enough to rent a place and afford your bills every month. You want a job that pays you enough to make a living? Go work at bigger companies like Apple, Department Motor Vehicles, or Solar Panel. Asking someone who is 23 or 25 to go work at a grocery store to make a living is like telling him or her to go work at McDonald's too for the same reasons.



* Yu Narukami	Mar 24 2017, 08:16 PM Post #37
Izanagi! Posts: 12,330 Group: Retired Staff Member #6,446 Joined: July 3, 2011 Gender Not Specified Country None	Your entire post is laced with the assumption that everybody does, or should, want a job that's 'professional'. Where is that coming from?



SSJSC	Mar 24 2017, 08:32 PM Post #38
Posts: 1,024 Group: Member Member #10,761 Joined: January 23, 2014	Nagito Komaeda Mar 24 2017, 08:16 PM Your entire post is laced with the assumption that everybody does, or should, want a job that's 'professional'. Where is that coming from? It's not an assumption, it's almost too much of a fact to be considered an assumption or an opinion. Why would people want to be flipping burgers all day for $8 an hour?



* Yu Narukami	Mar 24 2017, 08:33 PM Post #39
Izanagi! Posts: 12,330 Group: Retired Staff Member #6,446 Joined: July 3, 2011 Gender Not Specified Country None	SSJSC Mar 24 2017, 08:32 PM Nagito Komaeda Mar 24 2017, 08:16 PM Your entire post is laced with the assumption that everybody does, or should, want a job that's 'professional'. Where is that coming from? It's not an assumption, it's almost too much of a fact to be considered an assumption or an opinion. Why would people want to be flipping burgers all day for $8 an hour? So you take issue with the pay and not the actual job, then?



SSJSC	Mar 24 2017, 09:13 PM Post #40
Posts: 1,024 Group: Member Member #10,761 Joined: January 23, 2014	Nagito Komaeda Mar 24 2017, 08:33 PM SSJSC Mar 24 2017, 08:32 PM Nagito Komaeda Mar 24 2017, 08:16 PM Your entire post is laced with the assumption that everybody does, or should, want a job that's 'professional'. Where is that coming from? It's not an assumption, it's almost too much of a fact to be considered an assumption or an opinion. Why would people want to be flipping burgers all day for $8 an hour? So you take issue with the pay and not the actual job, then? Lol, this is common sense. Low pay flip burger jobs are starter jobs, working at places like Apple and Microsoft as sales or technician are for older and more experienced people, and they're actually salaried jobs. We just don't have enough beyond flip burger jobs these days.



* Yu Narukami	Mar 24 2017, 09:15 PM Post #41
Izanagi! Posts: 12,330 Group: Retired Staff Member #6,446 Joined: July 3, 2011 Gender Not Specified Country None	SSJSC Mar 24 2017, 09:13 PM Nagito Komaeda Mar 24 2017, 08:33 PM SSJSC Mar 24 2017, 08:32 PM Nagito Komaeda Mar 24 2017, 08:16 PM Your entire post is laced with the assumption that everybody does, or should, want a job that's 'professional'. Where is that coming from? It's not an assumption, it's almost too much of a fact to be considered an assumption or an opinion. Why would people want to be flipping burgers all day for $8 an hour? So you take issue with the pay and not the actual job, then? Lol, this is common sense. Low pay flip burger jobs are starter jobs, working at places like Apple and Microsoft as sales or technician are for older and more experienced people, and they're actually salaried jobs. We just don't have enough beyond flip burger jobs these days. Okay, so if there was a high minimum wage, you wouldn't have any issues with those kinds of jobs?



* Mitas	Mar 24 2017, 09:40 PM Post #42
It truly was a Shawshank redemption Posts: 12,129 Group: Retired Staff Member #2,993 Joined: December 16, 2007 Gender Male Favourite Anime DBZ What Browser do you use? Google Chrome Favourite Manga DBZ, Full Metal Alchemist	SSJSC, I'm just going to cut in and say for what I think is the third time now: I moved out of my parents house on a 20 hour a week job that paid an average wage. I also know multiple people who have done the same. I know somebody who works at a department store who lives with his girlfriend. Why do you keep ignoring that and saying that people can't do it unless they get a job that you deem worthy? It's possible, that's not up for debate. You're coming into this debate with all these assumptions about which jobs are worthy, which is not helpful in a discussion about unemployment because you are basically discounting the majority of available jobs because you don't deem them worthy, yet bemoaning the lack of employment. Where is the logic in that?
	"Then you've got the chance to do better next time." "Next time?" "Course. Doing better next time. That's what life is."


SSJSC	Mar 24 2017, 09:51 PM Post #43
Posts: 1,024 Group: Member Member #10,761 Joined: January 23, 2014	Nagito Komaeda Mar 24 2017, 09:15 PM SSJSC Mar 24 2017, 09:13 PM Nagito Komaeda Mar 24 2017, 08:33 PM SSJSC Mar 24 2017, 08:32 PM Nagito Komaeda Mar 24 2017, 08:16 PM Your entire post is laced with the assumption that everybody does, or should, want a job that's 'professional'. Where is that coming from? It's not an assumption, it's almost too much of a fact to be considered an assumption or an opinion. Why would people want to be flipping burgers all day for $8 an hour? So you take issue with the pay and not the actual job, then? Lol, this is common sense. Low pay flip burger jobs are starter jobs, working at places like Apple and Microsoft as sales or technician are for older and more experienced people, and they're actually salaried jobs. We just don't have enough beyond flip burger jobs these days. Okay, so if there was a high minimum wage, you wouldn't have any issues with those kinds of jobs? For the spare time, no because it's better than not having a job and being dependent at least. If burger jobs were $20/hr, people wouldn't be complaining so much now. But they were never meant to be high pay. Also, you create UBI by taxing robots and then giving it to the millions, if not, billions of unemployed right? Edited by SSJSC, Mar 24 2017, 10:16 PM.



Daemon Keido	Mar 24 2017, 11:25 PM Post #44
Warmaster of Chaos Posts: 3,915 Group: RP Moderator Member #6,491 Joined: July 16, 2011 Gender Male Country Canada Favourite Anime Dragonball Z, of course Favourite Manga Currently Toriko	SSJSC Mar 24 2017, 09:51 PM Nagito Komaeda Mar 24 2017, 09:15 PM SSJSC Mar 24 2017, 09:13 PM Nagito Komaeda Mar 24 2017, 08:33 PM SSJSC Mar 24 2017, 08:32 PM Nagito Komaeda Mar 24 2017, 08:16 PM Your entire post is laced with the assumption that everybody does, or should, want a job that's 'professional'. Where is that coming from? It's not an assumption, it's almost too much of a fact to be considered an assumption or an opinion. Why would people want to be flipping burgers all day for $8 an hour? So you take issue with the pay and not the actual job, then? Lol, this is common sense. Low pay flip burger jobs are starter jobs, working at places like Apple and Microsoft as sales or technician are for older and more experienced people, and they're actually salaried jobs. We just don't have enough beyond flip burger jobs these days. Okay, so if there was a high minimum wage, you wouldn't have any issues with those kinds of jobs? For the spare time, no because it's better than not having a job and being dependent at least. If burger jobs were $20/hr, people wouldn't be complaining so much now. But they were never meant to be high pay. Also, you create UBI by taxing robots and then giving it to the millions, if not, billions of unemployed right? You are not looking at the solutions you have been given. We don't need more salarymen to build a workforce. We need more entrepreneurs to blaze the trail. Sticking to what is working today will NOT help when the workforce is reorganized by a robotic population.
	A Shadow is merely Darkness in the presence of Light Thanks Kid Buu for this awesome sig! The Emperor Protects


SSJSC	Mar 25 2017, 12:16 AM Post #45
Posts: 1,024 Group: Member Member #10,761 Joined: January 23, 2014	Daemon Keido Mar 24 2017, 11:25 PM SSJSC Mar 24 2017, 09:51 PM Nagito Komaeda Mar 24 2017, 09:15 PM SSJSC Mar 24 2017, 09:13 PM Nagito Komaeda Mar 24 2017, 08:33 PM SSJSC Mar 24 2017, 08:32 PM Nagito Komaeda Mar 24 2017, 08:16 PM Your entire post is laced with the assumption that everybody does, or should, want a job that's 'professional'. Where is that coming from? It's not an assumption, it's almost too much of a fact to be considered an assumption or an opinion. Why would people want to be flipping burgers all day for $8 an hour? So you take issue with the pay and not the actual job, then? Lol, this is common sense. Low pay flip burger jobs are starter jobs, working at places like Apple and Microsoft as sales or technician are for older and more experienced people, and they're actually salaried jobs. We just don't have enough beyond flip burger jobs these days. Okay, so if there was a high minimum wage, you wouldn't have any issues with those kinds of jobs? For the spare time, no because it's better than not having a job and being dependent at least. If burger jobs were $20/hr, people wouldn't be complaining so much now. But they were never meant to be high pay. Also, you create UBI by taxing robots and then giving it to the millions, if not, billions of unemployed right? You are not looking at the solutions you have been given. We don't need more salarymen to build a workforce. We need more entrepreneurs to blaze the trail. Sticking to what is working today will NOT help when the workforce is reorganized by a robotic population. There's a political issue with making entrepreneurs... how could one be an entrepreneur if he doesn't have anything to create himself?



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