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SSJ Blue Vegito vs Merged Zamasu
Topic Started: Jan 10 2017, 09:10 AM (3,782 Views)
Tinny
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Solid Snake
Jan 12 2017, 04:23 AM
Vegito wasn't hurt at all really. Zamasu wasn't hurt either but his attacks just looked more dramatic. Besides, he couldn't even free himself from Vegito's grip till he used his explosive wave.

Well, for one your example doesn't align with how Vegito and Zamasu battled. Zamasu was the one gaping more so then Vegito was.

Restating a claim doesn't make out true, it only looks more ridiculous. You haven't addressed anything about it, and you seem to down play the fact that Zamasu's blast is clearly dangerous enough that Vegetto was startled and tried to get away.

Zamasu "gasped more" during the ki blade, before he started to monologue and then disintegrate the ki blade. Vegetto also cried out in pain, actually audibly and loudly cried (not tears, just voice) out in pain when punched in the stomach, which is far more emotive of pain, along with his various oh s*** faces than anything Zamasu did when attacked.

Once again you fail to address, and likely fail to read, my post, once again you lie (directly this time), once again you play the revisionist historian. I think we're done here. Go ahead and claim your last post "victory," if "winning the argument" is what matters to you. You can claim that's not what you're going for, but it'll be the only thing you can accomplish at this rate. You've clearly shown to be unable or unable to bsck your position with solid evidence, despite whatever claims to the contrary you have.
Edited by Tinny, Jan 12 2017, 05:10 AM.
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滅Are you frightened?

Nah you just refuse to acknowledge the information presented. You think I'm Addressing my claim but I don't think you're trying to understand the meaning of what I'm saying. If Vegito isn't really hurt from anything Zamasu does, then how can you assume he's stronger. Vegito was at the advantage the entire time, evidence being the fact he wasn't the one on the defensive majority of the fight. Zamasu explosive wave didn't amount to anything other then forcing Vegito to back off. His punches, which he dodged the first couple of times, didn't cause any damage to Vegito that hr mentioned.

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Zoom
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People need to open their eyes.
This is tanking
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Tinny
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Zoom
Jan 12 2017, 11:50 AM
People need to open their eyes.
This is tanking
I'm not sure what you mean, they both seem to be quite similar in terms of tanking, both casually taking the blast, just that Zamasu didn't bother residing an arm, unless you're referring to Solid Snake's assertion that Vegetto tanked everything and wasn't hurt by anything, in which case yeah, Vegetto doesn't recreate that kind of success in tanking attacks at any other point.
Edited by Tinny, Jan 12 2017, 01:37 PM.
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滅Are you frightened?

I never said Vegito tanked anything, I just said he wasn't really hurt, more or less the sane way Zamasu wasn't either. The one critical scene we think Zamasu drew blood from Vegito was their first fist collusion, which Zamasu knocked him off balance and punched him in the stomach and knocked him down, but as we know he got up and stabbed Zamasu and smiled, no sign of any real pain if any.

I'm not one who believes Vegito was massively stronger at first, but I do believe he was weaker after Zamasu was power stressed. Vegito caught one of Zamasu's strongest attacks and crushed it with one hand. And Zamasu survived (forget the regen for a minute) the Final Kamehameha. The roles we're simply reversed. Neither one had a major lead over the other.

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Tinny
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Solid Snake
Jan 12 2017, 06:54 PM
I never said Vegito tanked anything, I just said he wasn't really hurt, more or less the sane way Zamasu wasn't either. The one critical scene we think Zamasu drew blood from Vegito was their first fist collusion, which Zamasu knocked him off balance and punched him in the stomach and knocked him down, but as we know he got up and stabbed Zamasu and smiled, no sign of any real pain if any.

I'm not one who believes Vegito was massively stronger at first, but I do believe he was weaker after Zamasu was power stressed. Vegito caught one of Zamasu's strongest attacks and crushed it with one hand. And Zamasu survived (forget the regen for a minute) the Final Kamehameha. The roles we're simply reversed. Neither one had a major lead over the other.

You're trying to say this
Quote:
 
I never said Vegito tanked anything

Quote:
 
I'm not one who believes Vegito was massively stronger

Next to statements like
Quote:
 
"Vegito wasn't really hurt from nothing Zamasu did other then having dirt on him."

Quote:
 
Vegito wasn't hurt at all really.

If that's not saying he's tanking them, I don't know what is, so all I can tell is that you're changing your position without actually saying you have in order to win the argument, or are otherwise back pedaling on a statement you made without owning it. Maybe this is cynical and pessimistic on my part, but I've seen this type of pattern repeated over and over with you, though only to this extreme of outright lying once before. And to be completely honest, you've proven multiple times, and not just here (I still remember the martial arts thread), that you're willing to say anything to win an argument, up to an including , if anyone else is willing to speak up and agree with what you said I'll consider it, but right now, I'm not gonna do something like point out how ballet stances aren't fighting stances unless someone seems genuinely confused, curious, or otherwise has a question or thinks you have a point.

Like I said, this isn't about you anymore. I do not trust you with this anymore. This is about anyone else watching, and I think I've made my point, and the problems with your arguments clear as day for all to see. I'm almost certain that no one here who is still reading and interested in this agrees with you (though if you do, please feel free to post and tell me why, if there is a flaw in my reasoning and arguments I'll be happy to examine it). There's no reason to retread the same thing over and over in the same thread, especially given that you have taken to outright ignoring my posts and lying about them (if you don't remember when that is, you can read the thread again). I do not find pleasure in arguing with you, nor stimulation, at this point I'm only doing my, I suppose duty (though that sounds a bit too heavy in this context) to ensure misinformation and falsehoods don't spread unchallenged.

@anyone else

If there is someone viewing this that thinks Vegetto would win and is willing to put forth an argument or post, please, feel free to give your take on this match up, if there's a major flaw in my reasoning or something of his that I should address, or you simply have something to say regarding the match, feel free. I'll be happy to discuss this with you.
Edited by Tinny, Jan 12 2017, 07:32 PM.
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EMIYA
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"I am the bone of my sword."

I don't know what Vegetto's going to do. Maybe if he throws a Final Kamehameha at Small Zamasu it would do something.

But what else can I say? Vegetto used a full powered Final Kamehameha (and it is stated as such, he used up all his energy so that once Goku and Vegeta defused shortly after, they could no longer hold onto their transformed states. He makes it clear that this blast is intended to finish it, he wants to finish it. He's put Zamasu in a corner, beaten him down a bit and got him ready.

And, it failed. Whether it was tanked, regenerated or something, it failed. The attack was meant to finish Zamasu off, hence the "This will finish it" and not only does it fail, it fails to put lasting damage on him It's like when Vegeta blasts a hole in Majin Boo. That damage is regenerated so whatever was done becomes negated.

People seem to think that Vegetto was going to finish it with that punch of his, but how? That would mean that this punch is stronger than Vegetto putting all his energy into the Final Kamehameha.
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エンペラー

Nagito Komaeda
Jan 11 2017, 12:45 PM
Venato
Jan 11 2017, 12:05 PM
Nagito Komaeda
Jan 10 2017, 11:49 PM
Pyrus
Jan 10 2017, 11:47 PM
Nagito Komaeda
Jan 10 2017, 11:45 PM
Pyrus
Jan 10 2017, 11:25 PM
Venato
Jan 10 2017, 11:20 PM
Vegetto has a chance to win this fight if he using the Kaioken. Considering that Vegetto has a body far more durable than Goku's and Vegeta's put together, I am pretty sure that he could go beyond KKx10. A Kaioken Final Kamehameha x20 would probably get the job done.

Otherwise, Vegetto will lose due to Zamasu's power advantage and his semi-immortality.
That could've been what Vegetto had planned, a desperate Kaio-ken amped final assault.
They put all of their Ki into the Final Kamehameha though, just that was evidently all they could handle.
You don't think Goku put all of his ki into that Kamehameha to repel Zamasu's supernova? It sure looked like it to me.
Didn't they say Vegetto put all of his Ki into the Final Kamehameha? That's why they couldn't turn SSJB when Zamasu started getting all gassy. That was his final move, if he could've used Kaioken, why wouldn't he have used it there?
The same could be said for Goku, though, who didn't used his Kaioken for some reasons except for kicking Merged Zamasu in the face. Not even for the beam struggle. Sometimes, a character forget about their powers and don't use it when it could make things easier for some reasons. Sometimes, it's justified...and it's just plain bad writing at other times.

Anyways, except maybe for the Kaioken, I can't see Vegetto winning this fight.
Fair point, but in that case, it comes down to two options

a) Vegetto wasn't messing around and the Final Kamehameha was his ultimate move
b) Vegetto was messing around and didn't use his best technique, instead pumping a lot of Ki into a useless move

One fits perfectly, the other needs to be justified by bad writing which totally destroys Vegetto's character.
Well, I thought the whole lot of you hated the writing is Super, and thought it was horrendous + that Super has already destroyed quite a few characters. So in that sense, the two options fits perfectly. :rofl:
Not saying Vegetto's stronger by any means if you think I'm implying that.
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滅Are you frightened?

Let's get this clear, I'm not lying about anything. At best I head in a wrong direction on what I try to explain but that doesn't mean I'm lying. They are similar to those of say like Kid Gohan not directly tanking but Cell's blows but he's not necessarily hurt, but he was bloodied.

So no, Vegito didn't tank ANYTHING Zamasu did, but that doesn't mean he was hurt. Say and repeat that like 10 times. After that, go and watch the fight again, and every time Zamasu hits Vegito, observe his following reactions after the blow has already stopped. And tell me, does him not mentioning or even hinting he's hurt, means Zamasu inflicted any serious damage? The same can be said for Zamasu not really being hurt either but that doesn't mean he wasn't hit.

So really, I don't care who's this about or not, if you and your band think Vegito is weaker then Zamasu the whole fight, when clearly the fight shows otherwise crystal clear, then maybe you should reevaluate things before you try to assert an opinion as fact without acknowledging the stuff shown or said surrounding the fight.

Emiya - Exactly, the punch was also said to finish it and it didn't cause he defused. We can easily say this attack was capable since he also said a near identical line like he did with the Final Kamehameha.
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EMIYA
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"I am the bone of my sword."

How? How does a single energy punch match or even exceed the power of an all out Final Kamehameha? Especially after you've just used said move and used up your ki firing the blast?
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Tinny
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Solid Snake
Jan 12 2017, 09:02 PM
Let's get this clear, I'm not lying about anything. At best I head in a wrong direction on what I try to explain but that doesn't mean I'm lying. They are similar to those of say like Kid Gohan not directly tanking but Cell's blows but he's not necessarily hurt, but he was bloodied.

So no, Vegito didn't tank ANYTHING Zamasu did, but that doesn't mean he was hurt. Say and repeat that like 10 times. After that, go and watch the fight again, and every time Zamasu hits Vegito, observe his following reactions after the blow has already stopped. And tell me, does him not mentioning or even hinting he's hurt, means Zamasu inflicted any serious damage? The same can be said for Zamasu not really being hurt either but that doesn't mean he wasn't hit.

So really, I don't care who's this about or not, if you and your band think Vegito is weaker then Zamasu the whole fight, when clearly the fight shows otherwise crystal clear, then maybe you should reevaluate things before you try to assert an opinion as fact without acknowledging the stuff shown or said surrounding the fight.

Emiya - Exactly, the punch was also said to finish it and it didn't cause he defused. We can easily say this attack was capable since he also said a near identical line like he did with the Final Kamehameha.
...Fine, I'll respond to you again.

You directly lied to me multiple times, even about the content of my own post. It's in this very thread.

Tanking means not being hurt. You're saying he wasn't hurt. You're saying he tanked it. And now you're changing your tune in the very same post by saying he was bloodied (and thus hurt). Which is it? Neither of them crippled the other, that is obviously true and I wasn't aware this was up for debate, though then again you keep switching between Vegetto getting hurt and Vegetto tanking so often I can't tell if your next post will support this next or not. Is he hurt or not? Is he bloodied or not? Did he tank them or not? You're giving me conflicting answers in the same post.

You clearly don't, you are doing this for no one but yourself, and not even to discuss, but to defend yourself. Defend your pride or your manhood or your self worth, whatever it is that drives people to so shamelessly lie, and project, and form conspiracies in their head about the people who happen to oppose or disagree. "My band?" What is that even supposed to mean, what are you trying to say with that? That Sam, Emiya, Pyrus, Nagito, and I all made some kind of conspiracy against you or "Vegetto supporters?" Do you really think there's something this organized going on? Or are you trying to go for some kind of underdog narrative for yourself in a discussion about two cartoon characters beating each other up? Also denying your flaws while attributing them to others is a very real phenomena called Psychological projection, I suggest you actually take a look and seriously consider if you're wrong. I'm open to the idea that Zamasu might be weaker, perhaps even with the fkhh he was weaker. All I would need is evidence. And there's the difference between you and I, you will not accept that there is a possibility you are wrong, you are stubborn, you are shify, you are wiling to lie, to omit information that doesn't suit you. I'm willing to admit Vegetto might and very well could be stronger than Zamasu during their fight, especially before the power up. Not the whole "he never got hurt and tanked everything" narrative you seem to simultaneously support and deny.

I don't trust you, you have outright lied, none of this "wrong direction" it was a very clear lie, you say I exaggerated his pain, when in the post you were referring to, I didn't even describe it. I do not trust you anymore, and frankly I'm very disappointed with you, this Vegetto vs Zamasu stuff is one thing, but baseless accusations for no other reason to sooth your own ego is just low, far lower than I expected of you. Now it's gotten to the point where you're calling everyone involved in this discussion blind and unwilling to face the truth, to which I have only one response, which while not fitting for every situation, I think fits this perfectly.

"If you think everyone around you is an jerk, you're the jerk"

And so I think it applies here as well, I trust you know which word to switch out with "jerk." Especially since you've seem to have already decided that no one here has any possible basis for their beliefs in reality.

@Emiya

He's already decided you have deluded yourself. He might respond, but he isn't reading your post.
Edited by Tinny, Jan 12 2017, 09:30 PM.
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滅Are you frightened?

Tinny - Sure let's roll with that. Ignorance is bliss.

Emiya - Refer to Kid Goku vs King Piccolo.
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EMIYA
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"I am the bone of my sword."

Listen, things are getting heated here (and another topic just popped up in the Super section so....) I'm just going to close this topic. I'm sure the rest of you don't mind.
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