OFG

Sep 2 2016, 03:50 PM

How do you know that's true?

Ding

 

You are claiming that the Hebrews borrowed this story and they didn't simply preserve it via their traditions. Can you give me any proof to support your claim?

Quote:

 

There are numerous more flood stories from ancient sources all around the globe which is excellent evidence for the existence of a great flood from a historical point of view.

Genesis 6:17

 

I am going to bring floodwaters on the earth to destroy all life under the heavens, every creature that has the breath of life in it. Everything on earth will perish.

Genesis 7:4

 

Seven days from now I will send rain on the earth for forty days and forty nights, and I will wipe from the face of the earth every living creature I have made.

Genesis 7:21

 

Every living thing that moved on land perished—birds, livestock, wild animals, all the creatures that swarm over the earth, and all mankind.

OFG

Sep 2 2016, 02:10 PM

Shining Light

Sep 2 2016, 01:57 PM

Actually let me take a step back. Would you suggest that God can't have controlled the animals for example?

If God is all-powerful, then sure, I guess, but it's still a cop-out answer for obvious reasons.

And yes, I would probably make the argument that God isn't all-powerful due to a variety of reasons which have been discussed in other recent threads.

Shining Light

Sep 2 2016, 05:43 PM

OFG

Sep 2 2016, 02:10 PM

Shining Light

Sep 2 2016, 01:57 PM

Actually let me take a step back. Would you suggest that God can't have controlled the animals for example?

If God is all-powerful, then sure, I guess, but it's still a cop-out answer for obvious reasons.

And yes, I would probably make the argument that God isn't all-powerful due to a variety of reasons which have been discussed in other recent threads.

I know neither the obvious reasons why it's a cop-out nor the reasons why God isn't all powerful. Least not from your perspective.

OFG

Sep 2 2016, 05:24 PM

People believing in the flood story, while a bit ignorant, is much more acceptable than people who refuse to believe in things like fossils. I've met a couple of people who were convinced that fossils weren't real. They were either placed in the ground by the devil to fool us and make us turn away from god, or they're a lie made up by scientists.

Some people believe in fossils but refuse to believe in dinosaurs. They rationalize this by claiming that scientists "put the bones together wrong on purpose." Ummm... yeah.

Nagito Komaeda

Sep 2 2016, 05:46 PM

Shining Light

Sep 2 2016, 05:43 PM

OFG

Sep 2 2016, 02:10 PM

Shining Light

Sep 2 2016, 01:57 PM

Actually let me take a step back. Would you suggest that God can't have controlled the animals for example?

If God is all-powerful, then sure, I guess, but it's still a cop-out answer for obvious reasons.

And yes, I would probably make the argument that God isn't all-powerful due to a variety of reasons which have been discussed in other recent threads.

I know neither the obvious reasons why it's a cop-out nor the reasons why God isn't all powerful. Least not from your perspective.

It's a cop-out because the answer has no substance. You could use it to describe absolutely anything.

''Why does the Earth orbit the Sun?''
''Well, space works in mysterious ways.''

''Why do things fall to the ground when I let go of them?''
''Earth works in mysterious ways.''

It's just a method of completely avoiding the issue while touting your position as the correct one.

Quote:

 

I'm not gonna say he works in myserious though. I'm gonna say he's the creator and it would be weak for him not to have the ability to do such stuff. He's not a man, after all, he created man.

OFG

Sep 2 2016, 09:07 PM

Quote:

 

I'm not gonna say he works in myserious though. I'm gonna say he's the creator and it would be weak for him not to have the ability to do such stuff. He's not a man, after all, he created man.

That argument can only go so far. When you start saying things like "God used mind-control on every animal on the planet to get them onto a teeny tiny boat" it gets ridiculous. If God really did have all the power in the universe, events wouldn't have occurred the same way, we wouldn't be in the same position we are today, and the Bible would be written entirely different. There are so many contradictions throughout the Bible; at some points God seems all-powerful, at others he definitely isn't. As far as the ark story is concerned, I ask again: Why couldn't God have simultaneously killed every man, woman, and child on the planet with the exception of Noah's family rather than magicking them inside a tiny boat for 40 days and 40 nights? You could argue that God was just "testing" Noah, but again, that's a cop-out answer. I feel like we could go in circles here.

Shining Light

Sep 2 2016, 02:05 AM

Ketchup Revenge

Sep 2 2016, 01:43 AM

Ding

Sep 2 2016, 12:19 AM

Ketchup Revenge

Sep 1 2016, 10:19 PM

They have a hard time accepting that their version of God is too small for the Universe as we know it now.

An infinite God is too small? I don't understand.

The most destructive force from the Biblical God that we see is a world-wide flood.
There's beams of energy that exist in space that can literally tear apart entire galaxies; 99.9% of which is too far away from Earth to affect Humans or any of what is stated to be God's creations, so what is the purpose of these things existing?

In addition to this, there's way more complicated processes happening in the Universe than on Earth, but God spent upwards of five days constructing the Earth and its immediate needs, but only one day was spent on the workings of the stars? How in the world does that make any sense?

Christians, Muslims, and Jews, as well as other religions can't link the powers of the God they know to what we understand about the universe in modern age, so they inflate his power and influence, despite there being no evidence in the "Divine book" that says he's capable of doing those things.

You're making a claim that God isn't that powerful because he hasn't shown great destructive abilities? Do you see what you're begging there?

Shining Light

Sep 2 2016, 01:11 AM

I wonder where you got that image, of what God is, from

Ketchup Revenge

Sep 3 2016, 03:46 PM

Shining Light

Sep 2 2016, 02:05 AM

Ketchup Revenge

Sep 2 2016, 01:43 AM

Ding

Sep 2 2016, 12:19 AM

Ketchup Revenge

Sep 1 2016, 10:19 PM

They have a hard time accepting that their version of God is too small for the Universe as we know it now.

An infinite God is too small? I don't understand.

The most destructive force from the Biblical God that we see is a world-wide flood.
There's beams of energy that exist in space that can literally tear apart entire galaxies; 99.9% of which is too far away from Earth to affect Humans or any of what is stated to be God's creations, so what is the purpose of these things existing?

In addition to this, there's way more complicated processes happening in the Universe than on Earth, but God spent upwards of five days constructing the Earth and its immediate needs, but only one day was spent on the workings of the stars? How in the world does that make any sense?

Christians, Muslims, and Jews, as well as other religions can't link the powers of the God they know to what we understand about the universe in modern age, so they inflate his power and influence, despite there being no evidence in the "Divine book" that says he's capable of doing those things.

You're making a claim that God isn't that powerful because he hasn't shown great destructive abilities? Do you see what you're begging there?

He is depicted as powerful of course, but creating a world-wide flood as a way to show his destructive capacity is peanuts compared to a gamma ray burst that is ripping apart a galaxy.

There's simply no evidence, even in the Bible, of him being capable of anything outside Earth's immediate vicinity.

Shining Light

Sep 3 2016, 05:06 AM

OFG

Sep 2 2016, 09:07 PM

Quote:

 

I'm not gonna say he works in myserious though. I'm gonna say he's the creator and it would be weak for him not to have the ability to do such stuff. He's not a man, after all, he created man.

That argument can only go so far. When you start saying things like "God used mind-control on every animal on the planet to get them onto a teeny tiny boat" it gets ridiculous. If God really did have all the power in the universe, events wouldn't have occurred the same way, we wouldn't be in the same position we are today, and the Bible would be written entirely different. There are so many contradictions throughout the Bible; at some points God seems all-powerful, at others he definitely isn't. As far as the ark story is concerned, I ask again: Why couldn't God have simultaneously killed every man, woman, and child on the planet with the exception of Noah's family rather than magicking them inside a tiny boat for 40 days and 40 nights? You could argue that God was just "testing" Noah, but again, that's a cop-out answer. I feel like we could go in circles here.

What events are you talking about? The flood itself, for example? No, not really. Humanity had turned totally wicked, and so Elohim had to do something about it. But do note that it says Noah saw grace in the eyes of Elohim.

Then you might bring up the story of Adam and Eve and how Elohim let them fall. Well, he did give them free will to either do what was commanded of them, or disobey him. But here's the catch: The reason he told them not to eat of its fruit was because it would actually be detrimental to them. Why make the tree at all? That's something I'll have to meditate on.

But if you're referring to outside the bible then I guess that was a waste lol. Still keeping it there.

How do you picture the Bible being written then?

When is Elohim depicted as less powerful?

What method would've been better to wipe humanity away? Just instantly killing? That would've required him to actually look upon humanity again, which would've ruined his ultimate goal.